egroen

I agree - with the exception of Chelios, who was rock solid in his first few years with Detroit, getting the runner-up to Lidstrom in Norris voting at the age of 40, while leading the league in +/-. I certainly would not feel bad having *that* Chelios on an all-time Red Wings team... though I personally have him as my 7th defenseman. Chelios in his prime would only be behind Lidstrom and Kelly.

I generally view these as you have to take them at their best in an actual Red Wings uniform -- hence I would take Sawchuk in his prime (as a Red Wing) over 2002 Dominick Hasek. 2000s Robitaille and Hull instead of their younger selves, etc... Otherwise, Doug Harvey would be my number one defenseman.

Yeah, I would respect Chelios a LOT more if he had stayed in Chicago and languished away on one of the continuously worst teams in the NHL with one of the worst owners in the history of the NHL; a team that barely even made a token effort at being competitive.

I would retire Chelios' jersey if I was Chicago. It wasn't Chelios' fault "Dollar Bill" Wirtz wouldn't spend the money to field a competitive team around Chelios. Hell, he hung around longer than Roenick. Chelios, in 1992, almost single-handedly brought Chicago closer to the Cup than they had been in decades, and won two Norrises while with Chicago.

My All-Time Red Wings Team: Lindsay - Yzerman - Howe Shanahan - Fedorov - Dionne Datsyuk - Zetterberg - Pavelich Grimson - Probert - Kocur Abel Lidstrom - Stewart Kelly - Pronovost Goodfellow - Konstantinov Chelios Sawchuk - Hasek Osgood That's right -- Datsyuk and Zetterberg are on the checking line, that's how good it is

Although I think that line is probably beaten by: Lindsay - Abel - Howe Kelly - Stewart/Pronovost Sawchuk Whom all played together as well.

Best two defensive combos: Lidstrom - Konstantinov Kelly - Stewart Those two lines could only be rivaled by the Canadiens and Bruins.

Ted Lindsay - Steve Yzerman - Gordie Howe Nicklas Lidstrom - Red Kelly Terry Sawchuk - Dominick Hasek

Jackman's Calder that year was like the Pronger Hart of 2000 -- The writers (voters) seemed to carry a torch for the under-representation of defenseman in the major awards those years. Based on the theme of articles those years, I was not surprised with the result. Much like Chara beating Lidstrom this year -- many of the writers had made up their minds well before the All-Star Game. Rafalski received Calder votes as a rookie in 2000 -- sort of amazing he did not break into the league (as a free agent, never drafted) until the age of 26.

Ericsson and Helm are both inelgible as rookies. Leino could play himself into minutes not even Zetterberg and Datsyuk saw as rookies -- as there are a lot of slots on the top two lines and PP units up for grabs this year -- which is unusual for the Red Wings. I would say Datsyuk, Zetterberg and Franzen are the only 3 with pretty much guaranteed spots.

If Lilja was our only trade deadline "acquisition" I sould be a happy camper.

The Wings have been looking for another McCarty for years -- he's that middleweight enforcer who could tangle with heavyweights, but was a good skater, solid defensively, could play the Wings puck-possession style of hockey and pitch in offensively with a knack for scoring clutch goals. A "Ra-Ra" type of leader and well-liked throughout the organization and a fan favorite. What on earth is not to like? I can only dream Abdelkader turns into half of the all-around player McCarty was.

Jiri Fischer was taken out for most of a season by Scott Hartnell -- Fischer took boxing lessons from Joey Kocur during his time away, and upon his return, squared off against Hartnell and KO'd him in one punch. Kocur needs to be retained, as far as I am concerned

A Red Wing has not won a Calder since Roger Crozier in 1965. A few notables since then: 2003: Zetterberg 2nd 2002: Datsyuk 4th 2000: Stuart 2nd (not w/ Detroit) 1994: Osgood 5th 1992: Lidstrom 2nd 1991: Fedorov 2nd 1985: Chelios 2nd (not w/ Detroit) 1984: Yzerman 2nd 1980: Foligno 2nd 1972: Dionne 3rd

I do not think Lidstrom will have the chance to rival Yzerman's tenure as Captain - though you have to give him huge props for getting over the hurdle those [very good as well] Red Wings teams were not able to overcome in Yzerman's final years. Chelios would not carry the same weight well into his 40s that he did a decade(s) ago. I do not think he would have been as effective or taken as seriously. I also think he enjoys being "one of the guys" nowadays moreso than he would welcome the responsibilities of a captain. Datsyuk has the whole language barrier problem -- which is a significant problem for your captain. Zetterberg in 2007 really had not "earned his chops" yet -- Tough to be a captain on a team with dozens of Stanley Cup rings without even having one yourself. The most realistic option would have been Shanahan -- and well, I think they made the right choice. Ultimately it is tough to argue with actual results.

Heh... Thanks though, you are surprisingly willing to concede a point (rare charecteristic on a message board)

By that reasoning, Lidstrom is a better captain than Yzerman. Since 2003: Yzerman Captained teams: 2003: Out in First round 2004: Out in Second Round 2006: Out in First Round Lidstrom Captained Teams: 2007: Out in Third Round 2008: Stanley Cup Winner 2009: Out in Cup Finals

A superstar, Hall-of-Fame veteran like Lidstrom is very valuable as a Captain. First -- Who is ever going to question Nicklas Lidstrom? When Lidstrom speaks in the locker room, I have a feeling the team listens and takes it to heart. Second -- He has an outstanding work ethic. If anyone could coast by on talent, it is Lidstrom. If the younger players (let's take Eaves as an example) see someone with very little left to prove working their ass off, it makes a difference. Third -- He has a mind for the game few have ever rivaled. Lidstrom's hockey IQ is off the charts and invaluable as a captain. Fourth -- He is one of the most repsected players in the game. Opposing players respect him on and off the ice. Refs will always at least listen to what Nicklas Lidstrom has to say. Fifth -- He is a warrior, the Cal Ripken of hockey and rarely misses a game. Regularily plays through pain and played with a ruptured freakin' ******** last post-season. Sixth -- He is a professional athlete of very high moral fiber. He is a role model for not only younger players on the team, but for fans as well. Seventh -- He is well-spoken, modest, intelligent and an excellent spokesperson for the team. Eighth -- He has also made monetary sacrifices for the team - which is of utmost importance in a salary cap year. Ninth -- He is ultimately one of the greatest Red wings success stories ever. Drafted by the Wings in the Third Round -- an unbelievable testament to the Wings organization. Tenth -- I can't think of too many other players I would want as a leader, and to lead by example, than someone whose nickname is "The Perfect Human Being".

Not if Zetterberg has Datsyuk. Franzen has no chance to reach those numbers with Filppula as his center... I'll be thrilled if he gets over 35.

LOL... were you hoping to sue me for libel?

It helps put the rest of your opinions in context... http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/index.ph...p;#entry1591761 Don't worry - I am not stalking you. It's just an asinine comment like that is memorable.

I would take Tootoo in a second, as well. Frolov would be a great acquisition as well. Defense and goaltending may be a priority at that time, however.

There's no question that honeymoon experience is awesome -- we got it in 1997 and the Joe was rocking, as well as all of Michigan. But I would not trade 3 Cups since then for that 'first time' feeling again.

Lidstrom is actually one of the top 10 most compensated NHL players ever. Last time he negotiated his own contract (no agent), which bodes well for the Wings. I'm expecting $5-6m, but would hardly be surprised with significantly less... given that I do believe Lidstrom would gladly take less money at this point in his career, for stronger teams.

I just think it is hilarious Jiri Hudler is in gossip mags.