joshy207

I don't disagree, the "addition by subtraction" makes the Wings better.. but a lot of those changes have already been made. Quincey is the only real change left on the list. If the team we saw on the ice against Boston is what we're going to see in October, even with the veterans healthy and the kids more experienced, it's still not good enough to contend for the Cup. You are right... the crop of UFAs leaves much to be desired. Most of them are guys we've never really heard of or guys we didn't know were still in the league. There are a few high-end players, but who knows if they'll be available come July 1st. Any team looking to make a real splash in the off-season will have to keep an eye on RFA negotiations around the league and explore the trade market. Top UFA Forwards: Cammalleri, Iginla, Jussi Jokinen, Michalek, Moulson, Raymond, Stastny, Vanek, Vrbata... a few of these guys will be expensive, some won't be too bad, and they all can pop in 20 goals. "Top" UFA Defensemen: Dan Boyle, Mark Fayne, Matt Greene, Ron Hainsey, Scott Hannan, Andrei Markov, Derek Morris, Nikita Nikitin, Matt Niskanen, Brooks Orpik, Marek Zidlicky... we're basically looking for a stopgap for a year or two, or an upgrade over Kindl and Lashoff. Who would I get rid of? I'd have a heart-to-heart with Franzen, find out if he really wants to play, what it would take to get him more engaged, how long he expects to play... and evaluate keeping him, possibly facing a cap-recapture penalty, or buying him out. (I know Holland is keeping him.) I'd buy out Tootoo, let him find an NHL roster spot elsewhere. I'd look to move Kindl. I'd be open to moving a good number of players if the right trade was available.

I think Legwand was worth it at the time--you can't go into a stretch of games with Joakim Andersson as your #1 C, and he did play well for the first few games--but he ended up being a disappointment.

Different person in charge now. Bowman traded a guy for looking at his daughter, he wasn't afraid to make changes. Holland wouldn't change his underwear if he got laid one time back in '08 while wearing them.

I think the Wings might have been a little disappointed overall in Legwand... he had some really good games when he first got here and showed some flashes after that, but for the most part, he played his way down to 4th-line wing. I can't see the Wings being excited to bring him back (even after what they gave up to get him) and I can't see him rushing to sign here and play 4th-line minutes again (even though he's a local and had wanted to be here). Had he produced more, I wouldn't have been surprised to hear that the Wings wanted him back... And I agree with you on the D, they really do need a vet for a year or two, someone solid and responsible. I do want to see Sproul, Marchenko, Ouellet, and maybe the other guys, but don't want to have to rely on them just yet. It seems like the organization is talking out of both sides of its mouth... they are going to build from within (so, YOUTH) but they expect to be much better and make a deep run in the playoffs next year. Are they "blaming" the 93-point, 8th place finish and the 5-game first-round elimination on injuries? They were a factor, yes, but this is also a team in decline. Its key players are old, half of its support players were replaced during the season, and it has no budding superstars on the immediate horizon. Yet Holland wants to keep the band together. He won't trade anyone away because he never does, it sounds like he's not going to pursue any free agents of consequence (they might throw off his 2006-based team salary structure)... does he really think everything is just roses?

His contract says otherwise.

Maybe individual players don't learn from losing, but teams do. Look at the Wings of 20 years ago... after great regular seasons, they lost early to Toronto in '93, San Jose in '94, then got swept in the final by New Jersey in '95 even though they were far better on paper... came back only to lose to Colorado in '96 before finally winning it all in '97 and '98. And didn't this team struggle but have a lot of talent? So didn't the young guys learn this year? Yes, they were outclassed by Boston in the first round, but Boston is probably the best team in the league. Won the President's Trophy, not by accident. They now see how they have to step up their game. I don't see the Wings sucking if they continue the youth movement, I see them being 2 years away from strong contention. I am not calling for the young defensemen to be called up next year, at least not more than one at a time for some evaluation and experience. I want to see all the forwards stay, see Mantha get a legit chance to make the team out of camp, and see him, Pulkkinen, Athanasiou, etc, get short callups. I'm not sold on Ferraro and Callahan though, if they are let go, I wouldn't be too disappointed. I think Mrazek is our best option for backup goalie next year, as I see him taking over the #1 job by the start of the 16/17 season, if not during the 15/16 season. I don't want to see a handful of vets re-signed or brought in and take icetime away from the players who are already here, who have proven they deserve full-time roster spots. (The exception being a prime-age veteran defenseman, the blueline can use some immediate help.) I want to see a little space left open for callups. This is what I mean by continuing the youth movement, not just gassing every vet and bringing in rookies who aren't ready and playing them full-time.

Here are the players between the ages of 25 and 31: Abdelkader, Helm, Kindl, Miller, Quincey, Ericsson, Eaves, Weiss, Emmerton, Tootoo, Gustavsson, and Howard. ZERO top-6 forwards, 3 bottom-6 forwards, 2 top-4 defensemen, 2 goalies, an injured free-agent signee, and 3 guys we've exiled to the minors or traded away. Not exactly a core to build a team around. There's a generation gap here--all the top players are aging, this group in the middle, and some young up-and-comers who aren't quite ready for playoff success yet. This is the price the Wings are paying for years of success, low draft positions, and trading away first-round picks. Pretty much every good team is led by guys between 25 and 31. Detroit is led by guys over 31. They'll either have to trade for top players in that age group or ride out the youth movement for another year or two before reaping the benefits of it.

Young teams need to learn how to win. This year's active playoff roster only had 5 guys who played in the '08 Cup finals--Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Franzen, Helm, and Kronwall. The young players have gained invaluable experience over the past season or two, they'll continue to grow and improve, and I think we're looking at a very, very strong Red Wings team in 2 years if they continue to mix in the youth and stop bringing back veterans who have nothing left in the tank. Adding a good veteran on D would help also. The young guys haven't "failed miserably". This team wasn't all that good, wasn't supposed to beat the #1 team in the NHL, and barely made the playoffs, aided by the epic collapse of 2 other teams. The playoffs are a different animal, it takes time for them to be able to figure it out. Look at Datsyuk... 3 goals in his first 42 playoff games! He had 3 this series alone. At least now, they've gone through that experience in 2014 rather than 2015 or 2016, as the organization had originally planned. This is the new course. The future has already begun.

He's still playing anyway, and could be for another month...

Why is it a stupid rule?

You don't have to play a game, but you have to be on the active roster on a certain date. Last year, the Wings "sent down" Nyquist, Andersson, DeKeyser, and Lashoff, then recalled them hours later. It was a paper transaction to make them eligible for the AHL playoffs once the Wings' season was over.

There's a story floating around that Howard may have a concussion... Aaron Ward tweeted something about that, says it may stem from a collision with Soderberg in Game 3.

This is the path I would take. These guys are inexpensive. I'd pick one and go into camp with the backup spot open for battle between Mrazek and the veteran signee. Winner stays and backs up Howard, loser goes to Grand Rapids and starts, with Paterson backing him up. Another option would be to bring McCollum back into the fold, start him at GR, and send Mrazek down and call up McCollum if Mrazek sits for too long and needs playing time. Mrazek would benefit from playing 55 AHL games, but he would also benefit from playing 25 NHL games.

105.1 is a sports station now, Drew and Marc talk to Mickey Redmond a lot and they do discuss *some* hockey on that station. However, football and baseball are far more popular and will always get more airtime.

I think we're better off auditioning what we have and keeping an eye on the waiver wire and trade market. Some team is always looking to move a player who's being replaced by someone younger and cheaper.

Fair enough, I haven't seen any Griffins games or paid a whole lot of attention to them this year. Pick one, any one...

That was supposed to have been a quoted response for Dabura. I'm with you, Dickie, I'd let Quincey walk, pencil Almquist in the 7th spot, and explore the trade market using Kindl as part of a package for an upgrade.

What do you propose Holland does with Quincey then? He's a UFA, they either have to sign him or let him walk. I highly doubt he'll take a paycut or anything less than a multi-year deal (3-4 years)...

As easy as it was to pick last year's MVP (Howard), this year is extremely difficult. Nyquist has been very good, brilliant at times, but he wasn't here for the first 2 months of the season. Same can be said for Zetterberg, but he has missed a lot of time... and the team wasn't in a playoff position much of the time he was playing. (That's not an indictment of him, but the rest of the team has stepped up big-time in his absence.) Kronwall has not been particularly excellent, but has been a steadying influence, and probably wins the award by default as much as by earning it. Howard has been far too inconsistent and Gustavsson can't be counted on to stay healthy. There are a lot of players you can say "without him, we don't make the playoffs"... it's been a complete and total team effort.

Coreau down, Mrazek up.

Coreau is up because Gustavsson is banged up (again... surprise, surprise). Can't rest Howard if Gustavsson can't go, Coreau is an ECHL goalie. Datsyuk needs to play and get in as good of game shape as possible. Sitting Kronwall would mean they'd have to recall a defenseman, which they could do, but it would really weaken their D for that game. Bertuzzi could sub in for Alfredsson.

100%!! Very impressive, all things considered!!

My biggest issue is that this is the automatic way it's done. The roster is always full of veterans so there's little room for any of the prospects to even get a chance until someone gets hurt or until they've run out of waiver options. I'm sure it's because Babcock and Holland don't generally trust rookies/young players until they prove their worthiness, but maybe that's changed this year. I think it has with Babcock, and I hope it has with Holland. Not completely, I don't think they should abandon the process and rush Mantha, Pulkkinen, Athanasiou, Mrazek, and some of the young defensemen all up here next year, but start leaving room for some of them to get a decent taste of NHL action and go from there.

Zetterberg will get in, if/when he's ready... but he needs to be ready to play at a playoff level before he comes back in. And who comes out for him? Andersson or Emmerton could be an injury/performance replacement. Bertuzzi could play a few games, maybe. Weiss has been shut down for the year. The rest have already played their last game in a Detroit uniform.

I believe it works in some cases and not as well in others. Of course, pretty much everyone but the high-end draft picks will spend time in the minors, that's the way player development works. Exceptions like DeKeyser, Justin Schultz, and a few other college free agents have spent 3-4 extra developmental years in college. The key is calling them up at the right time... not rushing them and putting them in situations where they can't succeed, but not leaving them in the AHL for too long and stunting their development. I agree on Sheahan and Jurco, neither were ready last year and probably weren't this September. Also agree on Callahan and Ferraro, who I think will be either marginal 4th-liners or AHL journeymen. But if Tatar and Nyquist were ready last year, why not have them up full-time? (It has worked out for the best, as they're the top 2 forwards playing right now, but that could have still happened had they been full-timers last year.) My biggest case against "overripening" is Brendan Smith. Babcock declared him NHL-ready 2 years before he cracked the Wings' lineup full-time, but by leaving him in Grand Rapids, they not only allowed him to stay at a level where he was able to cover up for his mistakes because the game is slower, but they also missed out on a chance for him to watch and learn from one of the best defensemen to ever play the game, if not THE best. I wonder out loud if staying in Grand Rapids for so long actually stunted his development, and if that's why we watch him mix flashes of brilliance in with consistent mistakes. Maybe some of those mistakes became habits in Grand Rapids because they didn't hurt him or the team. Next year, the Wings have absolutely no reason to send Sheahan down. Jurco, IMO, should stay in Detroit too. His offensive numbers don't quite indicate how well he has been playing, but that will come with a little more time and patience. Glendening can go either way, he's a nice defensive 4th-line center and pest, but doesn't provide anything offensively. Callahan only got one game to prove he's worth re-signing before he runs out of waiver exemptions, and that is not enough of a chance. If he's re-signed, they'll risk losing him on waivers if he doesn't make the roster. Same with Ferraro, who I think has less of a chance of returning. Pulkkinen looked alright in his time up here, but should start the year in GR and be the first callup for a top-9 replacement role. It's been said Mantha will have a chance to compete for a spot... let's hope there is one available for him to possibly fill. Back to the original topic though, right now Kindl and Lashoff are pretty much the best option available for the third pairing. I think Kindl's been a disappointment, given his apparent jump forward last year and the shiny new 4-year contract it earned him. Lashoff doesn't provide much offensively, but is generally dependable defensively for a bottom-pairing guy and can play with a little edge. And yes, he's only 23, so he's still young.