Learn2LuvIt

He'd be in big time message sending mode. IMO-I believe he might be healthy scratching Fil or Franzy for one/a few games.

Spot on. Also, if memory serves me correctly, I believe this decision went as high up as Mr. Ilitch as he soon after made comments in the paper about "certain" players not fitting in with the identity of the Red Wings. It's funny, on the first floor of Duggans Pub (Woodward and 12) there is an old picture taken there of Avery, Cheli, Federov, Dandenault, and McCarty (I think that is all of them in the picture?). Anyway, besides all of them looking hammered, Avery looks sooo freakin young. Curly haired and looks like he's about 15. I always think what could have been if he would have been a different type of guy...so much potential.

Stevie Y Vladimir Konstantinov Fedorov Joey Kocur

No, no, no....let's continue to be enamored with average/good players who show up one out of five games, or look "real good" in Traverse City, or played real well for us in Grand Rapids, or have had one solid season out of the last four, or they were on the roster when we won the cup. Lets continue to say how great they are becuase they do charity work in the community, or someone met them and they were "really cool guys". Let's make sure our fan base is so blinded by these facts that their individual play night-in, night-out is the last thing we question. "I really hope Brunstrom clears waivers because he'll be great"....really??? ok, this from a few pre-season games....whatever. If that's what we're hoping to take us to the 3rd round, SCF, win a cup....then we as a fan base need to re-evaluate. What a silly notion to hold a player accountable to the Red Wing way of winning damn near every night. At least in the past if we didn't win, effort was not the question. I think Stevie Y. would have a lot of problems with what is going on in the front office, behind the bench, and in the locker room. How about instilling one of the greatest motivators of all time: fear. Fear that if you don't produce, this country club exsitence know as the Wings is over (I mean country club in a good way and the way the Wings treat our players...from the tailored private jet to and from every game, to giving players a window of days off due to personal reasons/having children, being treated like movie stars around town, to the high end Illitch Xmas party, etc...the list goes on and on). How about if the Wings are such a "great organization" to play for, go out every night and play with maximum effort or else you're gone. How about "To whom much is given, much is expected". Seems like we are giving a lot to these players, and making excuses when they don't perform as expected. "I think this will be a break out year for Fil", "When Franzy's healthy he will do x", "Huds has been working real hard over the summer and looks in great shape", "We really liked Ian White in San Jose, we think he'll be good for us" (which is BS because Babs badly wanted Brent Burns), "Z is getting good opportunities, puck luck just isn't with him right now and nothing's going in" (bunch of bs...the pucks aren't going in because the shots aren't good enough to get passed the goalie), "Homer won't play in back to back games" (because he's old),"Pav is getting better and creating a lot of offense", "Abby has been one of our best players" (really???, your 3rd/4th liner is your best player....that's a problem) , "I think the Bert line has been the best line thus year", (yeah, except they can't put the puck in the net and run around behind the net and in the corners...places where it's impossible to score from). Just to be more specific, I think Stevie Y. would be tempted to want to throttle Franzen and the way he floats around the ice, and skates through plays if he's not wide open or has to battle in the corners for the puck....and then is always yapping at the other team or refs. He's like a combination of Lang and Maltby...he shows up every so often, but runs his mouth constantly (so yes, he's lazy and he sucks, and has a big mouth). I digress. Yes, it's very early in the season. But regardless of the scoreboard/record, we don't look right at all. Obviously I'm very frustrated. We are HockeyTown, the best place to place professional hockey on the planet. We need our players to start playing like they never want to play anywhere else every night. We need our fans to start demanding more. How about this.....F@$k you Franzen, show up every night or get to packing. Go Wings

Dead on. You can also throw the other "Rust Belt" cities in that group as well (Cleveland, Youngstown, and Erie).

Is Z hurt/not healthy?

I've been thinking about this question for the past few days and have come to no conclusion or any sort of opinion, so I thought I'd throw this question out: Would now be an optimal time to trade Z? *Not sure if he has a NTC, but in reality, that obstacle has been overcome by teams wanting/needing a player out. Taking that element out of the equation, and just addressing the basic question above.

I think I'll have a new term for situations like these. Player showing great potential followed by complete fail; "going Dallas". Used in a sentence...."I hope Fabian doesn't go Dallas on the us". On the bright side, look what happned with Leino going to Philly. Totally lame with us, into a big part of that Philly team. Huge upside to getting this kid locked in and see what a change of scenery can do. In addition, I'm guessing/hoping the Swedes on the team are helping his comfort level and preperation. Pulling for him. Friday can't come soon enough. Go Wings!!!

Feel good story by a guy (Mitch Albom) that isn't what I'd call a great source for the real scoop on sports stories. Great writer no doubt, but his sports coverage/insight just seems to not be very deep (sports used to be his primary beat, but since the radio show and books he's not a sports guy anymore). I have to admit I hadn't read that story. Good story and Albom even brings up the rumblings that Shanny wasn't peforming at as high of rate. 4 Mil for a 10 playoff points in the past three years??....I don't think Kenny had any intention of paying him this and as usual, seemed like there were conversations behind the scene to pave the way for a classy exit that wouldn't tarnish his reputation in Detroit. This whole "identified with another generation" line may have been a great way to exit here in Detroit, but I dont' buy it for a second. However, seems like he's changed his tune a little bit since on what really happened. Here's what he's been saying. "I said to Glen that I wasn't trying to bust the door to get out of Detroit," Shanahan said. On what he told Glen Sather on his visit to NY before he signed with them. Thanks for forwarding the story.

Possibly. However, vetrans tend to get very neogotiable when faced with the prospect of being sent down and taking bus trips across the country to get to games.

Umm...Shanahan was under very heavy criticism for his last three years of playoff performances during his Wings tenure. 19 playoff points in 01-02 followed by 10 playoff points the following three playoff apperances combined. Dave Lewis (as even keel a guy/coach that there is) even called him out several times in the paper saying the Wings needed more. Plus, 2 total points in the playoff's his last season with the Wings....if he expected to get a match salary or raise with the Wings he was crazy. Identified with the older generation of Wings than with the new?? Ummm, Shanny has said publicy that he felt the offer was low and an indication that it was time to move on. I don't even understand what "identified with older generation" means??? Are we talking about a record collection or his hall of fame career? Ending a run with the team and town who you've won three cups with because you identify with older generation??

So was Shanahan. You don't produce, you don't play. There would be a healthly market for Bert with other teams (not great...but healthy enough to get rid of him fairly easily if needed). These young kids for us are going to keep these vets looking over their shoulders...which I think is a great thing for our team. Competition breeds success. Bert, Eaves, Miller, Commodore, Hudler, even Homer...these guys better bring night-in and night-out or they could be sent packing (minus Homer, who'd they'd figure out a classy way for him to finish the year and then make it clear that they have no intention of keeping him. Followed by highly encouraging him to retire and they'll make a big hoopla out of it with off-season Presser and job offer in our European system). Also, with all of this inter-team competition...I keep forgetting we have a good deal of cap space left!! Rolling four lines is huge, and this makes us very, very deep (young in areas, but deep and talented). I'm liking what this could look like come April. Future looks bright for the Wings. EDIT: btw...just to clarify...Shanny's offer from the Wings was way below market value at the time and was viewed by most as an indication that the Wings would have liked Shanny back...but only if they could get him at a big time discount. I've read interviews that Shanny and his camp took this as a signal that Wings management was moving on.

In that case, maybe we should have gave him 4 Mil a year?? Kidding...that's great to hear.

I hear you, and remember those folks hating on the Kronner contract. I was not one of them, as I believe Kronner is in a different stratosphere as a player than Big E. I hope to be eating crow. No problem doing so as long as it's for the sake of the Wings.

I agree!!! That's what my point has been....why are we paying a 27 year old, 291st draft pick, 4th liner/3rd D pair, 3 Mil a year?? Many have been saying "just wait a few more years...and E will magically turn into this great/top pairing Dman and it will be a great contract for the Wings"....he's been in our system for 5 years (4 of those getting ice time with the Wings) and still just average (some..not me, would argue he's below average). I just don't get it. But hey, Kenny and crew know a lot more about analyzing talent and future upside then I do and I completley trust them. It's not that we offered him an extension, but the money. The money is my big hangup. We are comparing E to Pronger because poster Sibiriak was trying to compare Prongers numbers in his 3rd NHL season to Ericsson's. Ericcson's is in his prime (when it comes to age in the NHL) at age 27/3rd season and Pronger was a mere 20 years old. At age 27 Pronger was one of the best Dmen in the league. No comparison.

Ummm....Datsyuk? Filppula? Howard? Zetty? All started with the Wings under 24 years old....with a solid lineup already on the ice for the Wings. In no means desperate, we we're coming off winning the Stanley Cup and annual Cup contenders. Our development system may keep some still developing/show promise players on the shelf (GR) for longer than other organizations, but talent is talent at any age.

So why exactly then are we paying the 291st draft pick who's had five years playing in Northa America and still plays at an average level.... 3Mill per? I don't have an answer. A lot of pressure on him this year and that salary makes him a roster liability if he doesn't deliver night-in and night-out. I hope the best for Big E and would like to see him play for us for a long time though. btw....so what age was Pronger when he played his first game in his third season? 20. Not to nitpick though. Fair point on draft position.

On the numbers...... He's played in North America for 5 years. First season was with GR in 2006-2007. They've been exclusively "teaching" him either in GR or up with the Wings for 5 years. Fairly quickly?? Pronger was also 20 years old in his third season....not 27! His third year in the NHL was 1995-1996. At 27 he statistically should be in his prime. If what we've seen so far is any indication of his prime, then he is way over-paid! Flat out.

By year three of your above scenario, he will have been on the ice for us for seven total years. Four thus far (2 of those split with GR) and three additional. So year five (this year), we are happy with "He sucks, trade/waive/exile him"? I don't know, we might be more like "Kenny, any reason you gave proven bottom pair defensman 3 Mil per year after watching him play for the Wings for four years??!!" I honestly think if he were 3-4 inches shorter he'd be in a much lower pay range.

WOW. My heart goes out to all those involved. Just horrible. I'm very sad.

By far, the approach I would take. I did this at The Joe and got Nick (when he was injured) and Steve's autograph. However, plan your tactical approach with those pesky ushers in mind. I had to dodge and creep to get into the seats directly below (seats were empty) the Wings management. Once that was done, during a TV timeout, I stood up and looked up into the box and said hello to both Nick and Steve. I said that I knew they were working, but would they ever sign a shirt I had. Both smiled and said "Sure!...no problem". After Nick signed, Steve signed. But at that point my cover was blown and an usher virtually ran over to me to stop the interaction. Too late As the usher got about five feet from me looking furious, I looked up at Steve and he was watching the whole thing with the usher and I, and had a huge mischevious smile on his face...looked at me and looked over at Nick and they both laughed. The usher then was escorting me toward the concourse with full intentions of running me from the arena. I turned to the usher and said "look buddy, I'm just a huge fan and no one was sitting in those seats, no one was hurt, and it was purposely done during a TV timeout...can you cut me a break? You won't see me again tonight". He had a pretty good grip on the arm of my shirt, but when we got down the steps and through the concourse curtain, he smiled and said "get out of my section and enjoy the rest of the game".

Pavel Datsyuk makes another grown man look like a baby giraffe on ice skates.

No clue. This writer needs a hobby in the summertime. Are things that "slow" for him now that he turned to being ridiculous. Maybe he should join a Dungeon's and Dragon's summer league. Seems like a good fit as he's appears to be pretty good at the fantasy thing. Kronner + pick/prospect for Hemsky? Roll again.

Hudler. No question.

No way would the "Canadian Hockey Elite" waive or hastened the waiting period for a Swede. Never going to happen unless a death certain illness/injury. NEVER.