bringback91

Over-dramatic much? Although i agree about Sundin other than the fact it doesn't matter when he retires because he's going to re-sign with the leafs in the off season. I don't know that trading ONE of either Kop, sammy or Hudler for Feds like the other poster said is really that insane, I mean you might not like it, but that doesn't make it as silly as your making it out to be. Lets just skip all the jibber jabber and concentrate on the three that were mentioned by the poster for Feds. nevermind the whole trade and all of that, how many of those three do you think will be Wings in 2 years?

Would have to agree, although on one hand I'd think they'd want Dats since he's already locked up long term, but then I think they'd probably rather have Z on reputation alone (the whole groomed to be captian thing and such) but that's a bigger gamble due to his soon to be UFA status. All said and done, I don't doubt the Wings would be out bid. Also i don't know that they wouldn't want a good young goalie (more of a sure thing than Howard) coming back to Tampa. But yeah, Vinnie is defeintly one of the best and most fun to watch for sure.

"What the.......Quad city D.J.'s?!? AGAIN?!?"

count me in, good luck

I've seen a whole hell of alot of "no this won't work", "no he sucks and is old" (BTW you don't have to be 19 and 6-5 to be a good hockey player) so on and so forth but not a whole lot of suggestions. Seems to be this thinking that the only good players or fits can't have prior seasons with the Wings on thier career stats. I agree rushing a Mac return isn't the answer, but neither is writing the guy off simply cause he played here before. He's still got alot to prove, but how can you not be at least slightly impressed with his progress so far? I think it's an awesome sign. I also love the whole "it's only the AHL" arguement. Like it's one step above fraiser leauge adult hockey or something. Although many didn't even think he'd get this far. If you ask me what Dmac is displaying is exactly what the Wings need. Heart, dedication, the will to succeed when everyones writing you off and telling you it's no use. To me it's a 50-50 shot at Dmac coming back to the Wings, I hope he does. I've seen Gratton's (big E jr.) name thrown around as the new saviour, just as Lindros, Bert, Doan, Witt and some others have been in the past. Not too long ago Gratton was the most overpaid, overrated player in the leauge, but at least he never played for the Wings before right? I just think it's silly to be so quick to rip others opinions down but than not to offer up some of your own for evaluation. Everyone complains that the only possible reason for wanting players like Feds or Mac to come back is nostalgia, while i think for some that's the only reason they don't want them back. If the Wings can find players better suited to fill those rolls than by all means do it for sure, but the fact that the Wings brass haven't simply dismissed these players as possiblitys should tell you something. But than again 3 cups in 10 years also isn't good enough for some either.

Actually while i'm sure your just trying to be clever, those aren't that bad of suggestions if they were really avalible. Wards just the type of guy they could use back there and honestly i'd rather have Dandenault over lebda although i do like the guy. Kozzie was clutch in the playoffs, and replacing Hudler with him would be a huge upgrade. While were at it, yeah i'd take Lapointe over Drake too.

I read the one that said this: "But while Sundin is healthy if not agreeable to a trade, the Blue Jackets couldn't deal Fedorov if they wanted." - toronto sun article you posted

Holy cow, did hell just freeze over?!? Just messing with you gordo, and believe it or not i agree about the blueline. To me it's not so much the Wings having to have big forwards to contend against say the ducks, but moreso the D. The cycle and down low play has burned the wings the past few years in the playoffs and really exposes the weakness in the D. You wanna beat Lids, dump it in and get some forechecking going it's no secret. And while i do like the guy, Ralf scares me come playoff time. He doesn't seem to avoid checks as well as Lids, and is probably the least physical player not only on D but the team. I didn't like it at first, but I'd like to see Blake come in too. And I think Cheli's got a few tricks (elbow, slew foots, slashes) left up his sleeves to make himself more physical come playoff time. Lids-Lilja Blake-Ralf Cheli- Kronner

Well consider the source. Besides, I'm pretty sure no ones really thinking long term here. Although Z's about to sign the biggest contract in Wings history, and he's not exactly a picture of perfect health with his wrist or back either. It's all a crap shoot, and when it boils down to it Kenny's going to go with what he feels is the safest bet, after losing a risky bet last year.

1. That I'm not sure about, really there's no way to know unless you were to ask either of them, which could possibly be done soon. All i can say about that is he and Bowman weren't exactly best of friends, but they sure as hell shared alot of success. In reality though neither is there to be friends with the other, and winning seems to erase many of these off ice issues. 2. Again, can't speak for the man, but he can't be blind to the teams weaknesses and the fact that Feds can address some (not all mind you) of them. Reguardless of what it is now, I can't see it being any worse than his of Hudler, and I'm willing to bet it be peachy keen if Feds comes in and does his job like he's very capible of doing. 3. Not sure on that either, I mean it's a business when it boils down to it but I think he'd be pretty amped up to dismiss alot of the ney-sayers around the leauge in the press and in the stands. I'd like to ask a question myself though, does anyone really think if he were to come here he'd want to do anything other than finish on top? I can't see him as having an chance of coming back and winning over not only fans but the organization and just mailing it in. I think a Fedorov on a mission hasn't been seen around here for a while, and some might actually be pleasntly surprised if they get to see it while he's once again in a Wings jersey.

Which is why it's said GM's are going to be far more cautious, since they've witnessed others get burned. Add Washington and Pittsburgh to that list also, I'm just wondering if it's so plain to see for some posters on here that the guy is so old, useless, and washed up why don't NHL G.M.'s seem to share the opinion?

Exactly, besides the fact that the toronto sun article provided earlier makes it sound as though Columbus will pay the Wings just to take him off thier hands.

Ah, but what if you get both?

Very true Wings fans are very spoiled. Not crazy to suggest one of the most spoiled fan bases in all of sports.

Most probably already know my stance on the issue. But even if he doesn't return to the Wings, you can bet a playoff bound or fringe team is going to snap him up. Ottawa and Pittsburgh have also been rumored, i just know i'd rather have the guy on my team than having to face him in the playoffs. From the Wings "official" website: If Steve Yzerman is the heart and soul of the Detroit Red Wings, then Sergei Fedorov is the blood that pumps life into the team. He can electrify a crowd with an end-to-end rush, or defend a lead with his tenacious checking skills. "He's a gamebreaker," Detroit center Kris Draper said of Fedorov. The Red Wings record book is filled with marks etched by Fedorov. Only Gordie Howe, Yzerman and Alex Delvecchio have accumulated more points in a Detroit uniform than the 803 produced by Fedorov. Fedorov can be an enigmatic player, but there's no doubt that without him, the Stanley Cup might never have come to town.

Yeah your right, my over 20 years of watching hockey, let alone playing the game, just isn't going to cut it this time i guess. But really, this isn't worth the time since you clearly either don't read, don't read close enough, or just can't understand the numerous and lenghty posts by myself and others. Your fine just skimming past the many great and factual points made in these posts and spewing on one or two line posts bagging on the guy. It's not called the "good ol' motivator" it's called "just plain stupid" if that's the case. So he's so not important and in the dog house that Hitch just doesn't want to use the normal motivator of the bench or press box, he's going to put him on D? Get real. Name another player in the leauge today who's been put back on D as a "punishment". And no Bowman played no such game, it was to bring Fedorov more ice time, no matter if it was him or Fedorov that wanted it that's what was done cause he knew he must have Feds on the ice, even if pissed at him or not. Seems to say alot about his importance to the team, huh? And to answer your question about the all star being a good place to see if someones a puck hog, it's the perfect place. Pleanty of time and space for great passing plays.

right......... I don't know that Hitchcock would risk his job and the team just to get back at one player for not smiling ear to ear while skating with the mighty rick nash. Think it had more to do with injury and the fact that Fedorov is a better dman than half of the teams actual Dmen.

Well for one he hasn't played all that much with Nash and Zherdev outside manning the point on the PP he was playing with Glencross, and Novotny alot. His was a defensive oriented line in a very hitchcock defensive style team. The fact that he's still 3rd overall in points on the team even after injury and the fact that Nash only has 46 points in 56 games is really a reflection of the style the team plays, and just overall crap after Nash, Z, and Fedorov up front. Take a look at Vyborny's numbers this year. I don't think it's crazy to say Fed's would have 10-15 more points this year if playing with the Wings. Sure there's no way to know that, but i don't think it's really that much of a strech. Babcock has said time and time again, he doesn't want Z and Dats together, so it's a good bet Sergei would be playing with one or the other, and man the point on the PP, along with a great ablility on PK win faceoffs, and is strong on the puck and has been playing the Wings puck possesion style since Z was playing with G.I. Joe's (or the Swedish equivilant). And no he's not 95-98 Lindros or Cam Neely but the guy is 6-2 and over 200 lbs. (thus fitting GS&T's size requirement) and knows how to use his size effectivly and has the ability to play every position and in every situation on the ice. And he's a UFA. It all makes all most too much sense. And don't believe everything people post around here, the Blue Jackets miss the guy despreatly right now, and that's evident. I like Kopy and he's been playing well, but that's a good price for someone who could possibly be so clutch in the playoffs where he made his living, and be there in the event of an injury. Really Kopy will see a max of 8 mins a game in the playoffs and i think that's a stretch. He doesn't have to be what he was, come in and play a soild two way game, take some of the heat of Z and Dats, play some special teams. No ones asking him to be A.O.

hey, i'm not the one crying about change. But for arguements sake, you and gordo watned to get bigger and gritter, with those moves you just did. How and what exactly are Drake and Maltby better at. PK's about all i can gather, and that's easily replaced from within. I'd take Murray over Rosie anyday, but really I can see it doesn't matter. Your dead set in your thinking as far as the importance to nationality, I just think it's silly instead of just cheering for the ducks, you want to replace the Wings roster and managment until it's just like thiers. Seems like a backward way of doing it to me. The whole goaltender thing I refuse to address, cause that's just as silly. I don't get it to each his own i suppose. All I'm going to say is if they make changes, i hope it's an upgrade no matter where their born.

No, I wouldn't say that your coming off xenophobic if you'd quit labling entire nationalitys and lumping them into catogories. I thought the Wings shook all these sterotypes last playoff, but I guess that's only with everyone else around the leauge except their own fans. I'm not ready for the Wings to change the philosphy they've had for damn near 2 decades cause of a loss to the GIGANTIC ducks one game in the regular season and a playoff series that could've went either way. But then again i like to watch hockey instead of roman grecko wrestling on ice. So there's no way to win if Kenny picks up 2-3 euros who play prominent roles? Lets say the Wings replaced Lebda with Doug Murray (not canadian BTW) and replaced Drake with Ivanans and Maltby or Ellis with jarkko ruutu?

Well how many games does U of M (football I assume) play a year at home or even close enough to drive too if you live around Ann Arbor? How many would you say that go to the games are aulmni? Your average Wings fan who's so blue collar as you say isn't going to have quite the income as a collage graduate from U of M, so their not going to have as much cash to throw around, but that's (collage football) really a totaly different animal than the NHL. Tigers are the new hot ticket and team in town. Talk about fair weather fans? And have you snuck a peek at their roster lately? it's not full of guy's named joe who used to work on Fords assembly line or anything. Besides, not too long ago they weren't lighting the leauge up to put it mildly, and weren't selling jack for tickets. A new stadium and a new found dedication to winning (something the Wings have had for many years now) helps your ticket sales alot. Pistons are struggling with ticket sales also, and that's in a sport that's WAY more popular than hockey, and a team can't get much more blue collar. Really you can't dismiss the state this States economy is in, it's a very viable reason for slow ticket sales in anything, let alone a niche sport like hockey. You don't think Wings fans also suffer from a bit of being spoiled? I think it has alot more to do with having to win the cup every year than how many canadian's are on it. But this is also a whole nother topic. So being 50-50 (N.A. to Euro) in net and on the blue line and 8 euro 7 N.A. on the forward roster isn't enough "balance". One thing seems clear with Babcock, you earn your ice time, he don't care if your European, Canadian, or from Zimbabwe the better player plays and that's how it should be. The sooner they ditch this "OUR GAME" crap and realize it's a world game now and the NHL is where the best of the best should be the better it will be for the game and especialy the leauge. Take a look at the top 25 point getters in the leauge. More than half are Euro. Take a look at some of the best goalies in the leauge, you'll see a few birthplaces other than Yellow Knife. I guess I'm just weird, cause i want the best avalible player they can get out there on the ice, reguardless of where he's from. The thing about non- N.A. players not vauleing the cup just as much is a load of bulls***. Simple as that. Alot of these guys give up more money, their homeland, traditions, language, family, and alot of other stuff to play in the NHL. A three game losing streak will quickly remind one why he has taken a break from posting on here for a while.

Gordo, obviously i know where you stand on this as well as you do i so really no reason to rehash, but you gotta admit as opposed to him coming back as you are it comes off a little personal on your side as well. Just an observation.

That's the funny part. The Wings do have a good N.A. presence. They have more N.A.'s than they do Euros. None of those teams can hold a candle to the Wings, they've all been crap, won a cup and back to crap again all while the Wings have won Cups and stayed 1 of the top 2 or 3 in the leauge for 15 years, that's why alot of Wings fans are spoiled. I could sit here and list off a bunch of players from Europe that were equaly if not more important to thier teams Cup win than there N.A. counterpart. Doesn't prove a whole lot. We won't even get into the heavy Euro presence that not only help win but also lead the Wings to 3 stanley cups, but than again that's not good enough for Wings fans anyway so it's not worth it. No, it's not racist, it's Xenophobic is what it is. Most of your reasons seem to be based on personal feelings and perceptions of certain players than actually based on fact. You don't really know anything about what these players feel and what the cup means to them, you think you do but you've only convinced yourself of it. Let's take one quote out of context (could've been a joke, I mean Russians are also capable of a bit of humor if you didn't know) and take it as the gospel. It's a joke. Now if Joe Thorton, or J.R. says this it's funny and good for the game to have people like that to market. No, a better economy and lower ticket prices along with not having two other great teams to choose from in the Pistons and Tigers to spend money on. I'm glad the fair weather fan is being driven off, good I prefer it. I mean, I can't tell you how many people on message boards, radio, and even at the Joe are simply talking out of their ass. Maybe it would help ticket sales, but that doesn't mean it'll help the Wings, and it sure as hell don't mean it's right. Let me guess the Tigers are too Latin American for you also, huh?

Yeah, mine too. It did the same thing when i saw Downey try multiple times on one shift to get Pronger to drop em, but in typical chrissy poo fasion he declined to fight someone who can actually fight and decided he's best to stick to face washing and trying to rough up Hudler and Datsyuk. Some will say it's cause Pronger's too smart to fight Downey and be taken off for 5 mins., but i have another opinion of it but it's not too suitable for a family friendly forum such as this.

I usually steer clear of all this "canadian boy" bologna, but this all seems just a bit silly especially with the timing of it. (after a whole 3 loses) To me it cements the fact of the Wings having a spoiled fanbase, but that's a whole nother topic that's been covered many times, just as this has. For one if you want Luongo, say good bye to Z, just as i say everytime someone says pick him up. Z would have to be included in any deal sent the other way. That'd be dumb. Secondly, as far as all the N.A. vs. Euro crap always posted, it really reminds me of old white dudes not wanting black or any other non-white guys on their baseball teams back in the day. You can try to cover that up by saying it's "not a race issue, it's a nationality thing" but than the only one your fooling is yourself. It's silly. Euro- Z, Dats, Flip, Hudler, Kop, Lids, Lilja, Kronner, Hasek, Mule, Sammy The great and powerful N.A.'s!!- Drapes, Malts, Downey, Drake, Cheli, Meech, Ellis, Ozzie, Howard (next year), Ralf, Cleary, Lebda You mean to tell me that the "problem" (how ever much of one you can actually have with your team winning at record setting pace, against a vast varitey of opponents, including teams chocked full of big bad canadian boys) lies with the Euros? Seems to me the weaker side of the lineup lies with the mighty N.A.'s, no? All i ever hear is cheer for the name on the front of the jersey not the back. That should include birth certificates also. You don't like the style being played that has made the Wings the best in the leauge for about 15 years now, don't blame the players blame the coaches, and the front office.