Offsides

He didn't do well in the wcf. In all of our losses except one he let in at least 4 goals, and Detroit had 3 in each game. In the one game we lost 2-1 in OT, that would normally be relatively respectable but the goal he let in was that Selanne one. That goal irks me so much.

I just have seen too many games like that where the D stops everything that's easy to save and then you're left with 10 shots and they're all breakaways and 2 on 1's etc. Which .. we shouldn't have that many defensive breakdowns. If the D is stopping all shots but then just causing horrible defensive breakdowns...well. And we have had a lot of odd man rushes and such lately. The D has been lacking, it's just that Dom is also not making saves that he would usually make. The combination is brutal.

I'm *not* making a judgement on the defense...just pointing out something. Just because the goalie is not making a lot of stops does not mean the D is doing good. They are accountable like anyone else. For instance, on a 2 on 1, if the D man doesn't cover the pass, so that the pass cannot be completed but instead commits to one of the forwards the goalie will have little to no chance of saving it going side to side on a setup like that. The defenseman should let the guy with the puck make the shot and trust the goalie to save it...but if he lets the pass get through..what kind of chance does the goalie have? Not so much. Common sense, right. Yep...welll but that's an instance of there being a shot to do a better defense play. If the D is blocking all the easy shots and letting people walk in on odd man rushes, etc. The goalie can just as easily block the easy shots as the D. The D needs to stop the stupid 3 on 2's and situations where the goalie has no chance and let the goalie do their job on the rest. In this instance, I think that it's a mixture. Some years we've just had such good defense that we don't take many shots because they don't even get into our zone...in this case I think we have a really good offense, so we are in their zone a lot, accounting for less shots, but our D isn't as fantabulous as years past this year...it's just not. I think right now they are trusting Ozzie more than Dom, so it turns out that most games Dom plays they pull back more, aren't as open offensively or aggressive, and are more on the defensive, which probably helps no one. It would probably be okay, but Dom's not playing well at all...so there's lots of factors going into the losses. And lots of factors going into Ozzie's wins. It's easy to trust Ozzie because you pretty much know exactly what he'll do. He's been labeled as inconsistant a lot which I've never understood because he's the most consistant goalie..does the same things over and over. Is usually in position, and you can figure he'll let in a couple of goals, so you know the benchmark you have to hit. Generally speaking he isn't getting his 2 gaa by doing shutout then letting in 4 the next game. It's easy to win with Ozzie in net, which is why he has lots of wins. Dom, even on the top of his game is sort of a rogue force, and I think he makes the D nervous to a certain extent because they never know when he'll do something crazy. Watch the way they play in front of him..more pulled back and reserved. Maybe, until recently, Dom's never been accused of letting in a softie, but you'll never know when he'll wander away or do something crazy. Right now Dom's not playing like himself at all. It's been noticeable since pre-season/training camp that he's looked older and slower. Bascially I'm saying 2 things. Dom hasn't been great, but neither has the D. And the shots don't necessarily indicate how the D is playing...it might and it might not...you have to watch the games to get a feeling for it.

I agree that being 'back-up' here makes you beloved and as soon as you're starter you take all the heat...it's always been that way. The Wings are responsible, but Dom hasn't been good. For Dom probably 90% would be bad, he's at 86% and dropping..., but he's not making saves he should make. I don't know what's going on with him...and maybe he'll snap out of it..but if Dom's not stealing games, he doesn't really have a value because that's what supposedly sets him apart from every other non-elite goalie in the league. He's not stealing games...he's not even keeping us in them

Ozzie is making himself look good, actually. I don't think anyone every loses or wins games by themselves, that's just the knee jerk reaction here in Detroit, but he hasn't played good. I hope Dom will play backup. Every other person suggests that they think he won't do it..or that the thought of him doing it is perposterous...but if he would imo that would be proper and it would raise my opinion of his attitude. And yes, Babs is definitely to blame if he keeps Hasek as starter. I'm just getting really bitter about Ozzie being called backup, because he never truly has been. It's cute, I don't mind it...but we have 2 starters...if it's not clear now...seriously. Dom would never be a true 'backup' either...he should just get less games.

I thought Dom was pretty bad in our losses when we needed him, personally. That Selanne shot that was unstoppable...would have hit every other goalie in the chest. That doesn't mean any other goalie would have gone farther than him though. There needs to be no bashing of Dom. His stats speak for himself...the only controversy is that people are still saying he's starter. If he and everyone else would just adjust to his role as backup he could go back to being beloved.

Osgood is NOT an effing backup. He has taken that ROLE here because he wants to play on the team and loves Detroit. Saying he's the best backup in the league is true becuase he's technically been backing up...but he's NOT a backup goaltender...or a career backup. He's playing like the starter...he is the starter. You people must be blind. He would be a starter anywhere but here, but has been giving Hasek the reins...well...Hasek right now does not deserve to be starter. I'm honestly not trying to be mean about Hasek here...but if I hear someone suggest that Ozzie should just sit in his 'backup' role one more time I will scream. He's NOT a backup...we have 2 starters...Ozzie just plays less....and that should be rectified if Dom's not playing as good as he once was, and Ozzie's having a career season. This is simple math.

I heard at one point it was the most popular, but I guess it was wrong. I don't get why anyone would watch it. I just heard. (but what do I know...I like hockey )

It's funny you say that. A couple years ago when Yzerman was still on the team, I remarked that it was a mistake that they weren't marketing the young guys more. The should cater more to the fan favorites...the future, etc. Z, Pavs...even Ozzie as he's a favorite..whoever has personality and some marketability. Give people a team to root for...something to pull for...fan favorites.

Because anyone who half payed attention during Fedorov's career knows he was constantly jacked around by the Wings org...and that big business leaders aren't always 'right'.

I wanted Ozzie to play for my birthday tomorrow...he never does!

Nah, I think mostly people just made a split second decision based on what they know...I doubt most looked up every single players stats. As for Modano, he's been more of a face of the NHL, more name and face recognition. Still even though he's not doing as well I just think of him as one of the NHL heads even though all of his seasons haven't been remarkable, do you see what I'm saying. This is probably why perception is bad, but shows you perception at work. Also the fact that he's American, but not because I'm biased against Canadians, but probably that he's promoted more here.

I'll just put who I think should, not who will.k. Mats Sundin - Yes Eric Lindros - No Peter Forsberg - Yes (I hate his guts but yes) Jeremy Roenick - Erm....Undecided Rod Brind'Amour - no Mark Recchi - No Mike Modano - Yes Keith Tkachuk - No Chris Osgood - Yes Scott Niedermayer - Undecided Brendan Shanahan - Yes Sergei Fedorov - Yes - hell yes Rob Blake - Yes Alexander Mogilny - No, which pains me Curtis Joseph - Unsure Teemu Selanne - Yes Gary Roberts - No Nikolai Khabibulin - No

Hey, we're not homers until he doesn't win it and we say they should have given it to him anyway. At this point it's anybody's game and he is at the top. :!:

I agree, and I don't know what you are talking about sometimes

Yeah, what exactly are you in real life Eva? A mathmatician? statistician? rent-a-genius?

Me too. Haha. I also have an Ozzie one..and...it's possessed or something. It doesn't really have anything to do with anything...but sometimes I find him in different places then I left him.

I'll still go with my gut and say 95-96 but your stats astound me haha.

Jose Theodore is in the Jim Carey category. Sort of 'where did he come from?' and then 'where did he go?'

Hey, I'll admit razzle dazzle is exciting to watch...and that it does put butts in the seats..I just dislike that it's a factor of actual skill. Dom has the stats to show he's elite, that's just one of the things that bugs me.

Dom does embelish his saves..as did Roy. It makes even mundane saves look like it was amazing. I actually define this as being of the the key differences in goaltenders who are considered 'elite'. Yeah, they have to have the numbers, but they also have to have the razzle dazzle...even though it accomplishes nothing.

That's exactly how I felt. It was extremely anticlimactic compared to the other years.

I did yesterday

But I like Hasek now, Loo, he's grown on me.

You might be right about that. I definitely didn't like that team, but you have to remember that Fedorov is my favorite player too. I hated getting Hasek and I hated getting Hull...two players I didn't like. Also, losing Osgood and Kozlov...two of my favorite players...so I am biased. I'll admit. But biased doesn't always equate to wrong. I had to defend the team from 95-98 for being 'bought' and we never were...we'd drafted all our good players and so on...but in 2002 it was too much of a bought thing. I suppose there were different things behind it..but that's how I still feel. That team was probably the most stacked team. Not the best imo, but stacked definitely.