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#41 cprice12

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 04:40 PM

QUOTE(Flip-check @ July 18, 2007 - 05:53AM) View Post

Are you saying that they're not? When it comes to the general public? There was a certain little Detroit-based hubbub about Tiger tickets this year... and all it took was the scent of success to waft into fans noses.

Main point's just this: Winners attract attention, that's the way it is.

It's not really a dumb concept, although I don't put a lot of stock into it. It's a natural concept though. Especially in the media.


That is EXACTLY what I am saying.
Detroit is not America's team in hockey...no NHL team is. Like someone just mentioned, Team USA is truly America's team. No team that represents a singular city or state should be discussed as America's Team. It's arrogant and stupid.

Winners attract attention...no doubt. But that doesn't qualify them to be "Amerca's Team". Why? Because they don't represent America. It qualifies them to be a playoff team with probably a lot of johnny come lately fairweather fans jumping on the bandwagon...that's all.

What's sad though, are the fans that wear the jersey of one of the best teams in the NHL, when they live half a country away from that city, weren't born there, and have never been there.
It's sad that some people have some pathetic apparent necessity to be associated with a winning team.
If you live in Detroit, near Detroit, have family in Detroit, vacation often in Detroit (why on earth...I dunno), or something like that...that's cool with me...root loud and cheer your team on, because you are linked with that team somehow...but latching on to a team just because they are good...I dunno...that screams lame and pathetic to me.



#42 DetroitIan

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 05:07 PM

QUOTE(cprice12 @ July 18, 2007 - 01:28AM) View Post


2) And why in the hell does it make "perfect sense" that one of the more successful teams over the past 10 years, is "America's team"? Are you saying Americans are nothing more than bandwagon fans?




First off, try 18 years. Not 10. And Im not saying all American's are bandwagoners. And OF COURSE not every single American loves the Wings. But its a FACT that out of all the teams out there, the Red Wings are most liked. Look at the beginning of the topic smart guy. There has been SEVERAL national polls throughout the YEARS about this exact subject. And what team is always getting the most % of fans around the country? The Detroit Red Wings. Its a fact buddy. We're not just talking out of our asses(unlike certain blues fans). Most Americans are not even die-hard hockey fans. So of course alot of them are gonna cheer for a great traditional and winning club. I can understand you being bitter. Considering the blues are a f*cking joke. But you really cant deny reality pal. Well, I guess you can. But its called being delusional. laugh.gif
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#43 DetroitIan

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 05:21 PM

QUOTE(cprice12 @ July 18, 2007 - 05:40PM) View Post

If you live in Detroit, near Detroit, have family in Detroit, vacation often in Detroit (why on earth...I dunno), or something like that...that's cool with me...root loud and cheer your team on, because you are linked with that team somehow...but latching on to a team just because they are good...I dunno...that screams lame and pathetic to me.



Funny thing Is I agree with you 100% on that. I hate bandwagoners. I could never live with myself if I ever put on another team's jersey. I was born and raised here. And I have been a fan for 20 years and running. But the difference with me is, I can UNDERSTAND fans around the country who are not die-hard into their hometown teams, being interested in a historical consistant winning club like the Red Wings. It's the SAME reason why the Yankess are so beloved. Yes they are hated too. But the fact remains, that they are America's team. As are the Red Wings for hockey(obviously the fan bases are different, but still). So as I said, it makes perfect sense that we're considered America's team. Especially considering the utter dominance the Red Wings have displayed over the past 18 seasons of hockey.
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#44 LeftWinger

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 06:10 PM

QUOTE(betterREDthandead @ July 16, 2007 - 09:31PM) View Post

I like how you take a flip comment by a blogger (NOT a journalist) and turn it into how the American media wants to destroy the NHL.

Anyway, back to the original point of the thread: I say, SWEET. Anyone notice that the Wings topped the Yankees, Cowboys, and Lakers in approval rating? Also, the Pistons and Michigan football also garnered a mention in their respective sports.

Fact is, the Red Wings are not just America's hockey team, but the world's. Apologies to Peter Forsberg and Jaromir Jagr, but we have the world's pre-eminent Swedish player and the world's pre-eminent Czech player suiting up for our team. And once upon a time, the world's pre-eminent Russian player, too. On this site alone we've got fans from Sweden, England, Scotland, Finland, the Netherlands, Hungary, Italy, Russia, and Australia and that's just what I can think of off the top of my head. Maybe Poland? Switzerland?

Now, it's worth noting that this blogger is based out of Flint. So maybe, some bias. But still. I'd call it just another nugget of proof that Detroit is the epicenter of the sports world in America. Best sports fans, best sports town, period. Not Boston, not Dallas, not New York, not Los Angeles, not Chicago. Detroit.

...I totally agree, too bad Kwame and his croonies don't give two s***s about the city and because of that, Detroit is not the media mecca that it could be. I went to Toledo twice last week and for pete's sake Toledo, yes TOLEDO is a nicer city than Detroit. I looked around and couldn't find one broken out window or barred up doors. Sure there were some buildings that weren't occupied, but they didn't LOOK abandoned, like MOST of the burned out, busted up old Hotels and apartment complexes in Detroit. If Kwame (I don't care if I spell his name wrong) and the city council would actually care about this city, instead of just crying about afirmative action and what the USA isn't doing for them, they could actually make this place desirable. I tell you what, if Dennis Archer was allowed to do what he invisioned (city council voted against most of his ideas) this place would be rocking! The original idea to put all three cansino's on the river was great! Who decided not to? they are so far apart, you cannot safely walk from one to another, so you are pretty much stuck at one place all night. No mass transit system. The new DTW termial in Romulus is one of the biggeset and best in the country and yet, it is not connected to the city what-so-ever. Could you imagine the visitors we'd get if, for one, the city was nice to visit, but also just flying in for a game to see. They could fly in, catch the train to the city, walk to the Ballpark, Stadium, Arena and casino's and drink and party, then take the train back to the Airport, hop on their return flight and have a wonderful time here. They would ALL make money, the City, Northwest Airlines, Red Wings, Lions, Tigers, casinos. But most of all, Detroit could be a desired destination, with or without the big three. It all starts at the top, so Kwame and city council, c'mon, how can you let Toledo be a nicer place than the "D?"

...sorry about the political rant, but even though we are America's team, could you imagine how much more popular we'd be if we had an American Class CIty, instead of slum capital of the world?

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#45 DetroitIan

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 06:35 PM

QUOTE(LeftWinger @ July 18, 2007 - 07:10PM) View Post

...sorry about the political rant, but even though we are America's team, could you imagine how much more popular we'd be if we had an American Class CIty, instead of slum capital of the world?



Yeah I hate that. It's like, of course there is the bad area of Detroit. But there is also a very classy, upscale, suburban area as well. And in several area's just outside Detroit. A few months back aol.com released the 10 best city's to live in America list. Bloomfield Hills ranked #3. And West Bloomfield Hills ranked #4. In the NATION. I wish that was a more widely known fact in America.
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#46 LeftWinger

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 06:39 PM

QUOTE(Defenseman13 @ July 18, 2007 - 02:26AM) View Post


BTW, I thought THIS was America's team...

IPB Image

...dude, get over it, that was America's Team for the moment. They never ever returned to their greatness or even came close to competing with the rest of the world on a international arena, until that is, the Olympics were watered down with professional players, now it's like watching a bunch of different all star games. Totally bogus, I give no credit to ANY medal won by a team that is filled with NHL players...

...sure 1980 was a cinderella story, and yeah, it was America's Team. But that was the past, just like everyone on here ******* about others living in the 90's with the Wings, we cannot, as Olympic fans, live in 1980 forever...

...fact of the matter is, behind the Canadiens, the Wings are the second most popular NHL team in the WORLD, so there actually is water to the term "America's Team." I will tell you, we are more of an America's Team than the Atlanta Braves EVER were, allthough that was their marketing term for most of the 90's...

..and it will be a cold day in Hades when the likes of the San Jose Sharks surpass the Wings in popularity (outside of San Jose) in America, let alone the World...

QUOTE(DetroitIan @ July 18, 2007 - 07:35PM) View Post

Yeah I hate that. It's like, of course there is the bad area of Detroit. But there is also a very classy, upscale, suburban area as well. And in several area's just outside Detroit. A few months back aol.com released the 10 best city's to live in America list. Bloomfield Hills ranked #3. And West Bloomfield Hills ranked #4. In the NATION. I wish that was a more widely known fact in America.

...right, but that is Bloomfield Hills, not Detroit. When I go to Chicago, I stay and play in Chicago. Same with Toronto. I want people to be able to come here and stay IN the city, have fun IN the City, not the Suburbs...

Edited by LeftWinger, 18 July 2007 - 06:39 PM.

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#47 DetroitIan

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 06:46 PM

QUOTE(LeftWinger @ July 18, 2007 - 07:37PM) View Post

...dude, get over it, that was America's Team for the moment. They never ever returned to their greatness or even came close to competing with the rest of the world on a international arena, until that is, the Olympics were watered down with professional players, now it's like watching a bunch of different all star games. Totally bogus, I give no credit to ANY medal won by a team that is filled with NHL players...

...sure 1980 was a cinderella story, and yeah, it was America's Team. But that was the past, just like everyone on here ******* about others living in the 90's with the Wings, we cannot, as Olympic fans, live in 1980 forever...

...fact of the matter is, behind the Canadiens, the Wings are the second most popular NHL team in the WORLD, so there actually is water to the term "America's Team." I will tell you, we are more of an America's Team than the Atlanta Braves EVER were, allthough that was their marketing term for most of the 90's...

..and it will be a cold day in Hades when the likes of the San Jose Sharks surpass the Wings in popularity (outside of San Jose) in America, let alone the World...


100% agreed. And I totally respect that 1980 USA squad. And I love the story. Hell, "Miracle on Ice" is still one of my favorite movies. But that was over 25 years ago. Any sort of clout they had, has definitely faded considerably over the years. If we're talking about the present. Then we're talking about the Detroit Red Wings as America's team. And its not just our opinions. It's a fact.

QUOTE(LeftWinger @ July 18, 2007 - 07:39PM) View Post

...right, but that is Bloomfield Hills, not Detroit. When I go to Chicago, I stay and play in Chicago. Same with Toronto. I want people to be able to come here and stay IN the city, have fun IN the City, not the Suburbs...


Yeah downtown might not be the greatest. But there are nice suburban areas in Detroit as well. Maybe not Bloomfield Hills nice. But very upper-middle class. And Bloomfield Hills is only about 15 min away from the Joe/Comerica Park/Ford Field. Not too shabby.
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#48 GoWings1905

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 08:32 PM

QUOTE(WingsZR2 @ July 18, 2007 - 10:48AM) View Post

Notre Dame, America's team? Nope. Most overrated? Yup.


I have to jump on this because you are so wrong it is laughable. Don't let your hate for Notre Dame blind you from the facts.

First off, for the overrated claim, it is absurd. Who owns the most national championships in college football history? Who is tied for the most Heisman Trophy winners ever? Where is the college football hall-of-fame located? Who is the only team with their own TV station? Do I need to go on?

Notre Dame is easily America's team in college football. Nobody's fan base spans as far around the country like Notre Dame's. The fact that they are easily the most hated team proves they are America's team. Look at the poll results and you will see no one even comes close in terms of popularity to Notre Dame.

I'd like to hear who is more fitting in college football to be America's team if it isn't Notre Dame. Actually, I don't expect a real answer. Go ahead and throw the Charlie Weis fat jokes, or the bowl game losing streak at me. It's always the same rhetoric from people that can't stand Notre Dame.

Edited by GoWings1905, 18 July 2007 - 08:37 PM.

 
 
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#49 theman19

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 10:25 PM



...sure 1980 was a cinderella story, and yeah, it was America's Team. But that was the past, just like everyone on here ******* about others living in the 90's with the Wings, we cannot, as Olympic fans, live in 1980 forever...

That's a ridiculous thing to say. Just like the 72 summit series to Canadians, the 1980 Olympic team transcends the sport entirely. It's not about the game, it never was. It was about a group of college kids going out and beating the greatest team to ever lace up the skates. Remember this is a team that destroyed an NHL team with a hall of fame roster. It's a metaphor for everything that is right in sports. To dramatic? tough, it's true. I love my team alot, but lets face it. In a hundered years no one will talk about our 1998 cup win, (maybe the 97 one). In 50 years provided there is still ice hockey, this will still be relevant.

#50 Flip-check

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Posted 19 July 2007 - 12:33 AM

QUOTE(cprice12 @ July 18, 2007 - 05:40PM) View Post

That is EXACTLY what I am saying.
Detroit is not America's team in hockey...no NHL team is. Like someone just mentioned, Team USA is truly America's team. No team that represents a singular city or state should be discussed as America's Team. It's arrogant and stupid.


I actually agree that they aren't, I was just asking "are you saying general fans aren't bandwagoners?" wink.gif But I didn't put it right, my bad.

I don't find it all that arrogant or stupid, but in the context of "Olympics are huge - Recognize this - National teams are what deserve the title" you're right. No one (that is, broad America and the media) cares about that though, and no one really cares about the Olympics until they roll around every two or four years depending on how you count summer or winter. I think it'd be great if that kind of seriousness were paid to Olympic competition, believe me, and I don't know how it is in other countries (smaller ones I bet there's a lot more pride invested consistently), but here...

Olympic glory is mostly gone. If the NHL and NBA didn't exist, then maybe people'd care again, but right now those are our stars.


No, it's definitely excitement.

#51 cprice12

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Posted 19 July 2007 - 01:07 PM

QUOTE(DetroitIan @ July 18, 2007 - 10:07PM) View Post

First off, try 18 years. Not 10.

I wasn't aware Detroit won a cup back in 1989. Wait...they didn't.

QUOTE
And Im not saying all American's are bandwagoners. And OF COURSE not every single American loves the Wings. But its a FACT that out of all the teams out there, the Red Wings are most liked.

They are also the most hated. So take that for what it is worth.

QUOTE
Look at the beginning of the topic smart guy. There has been SEVERAL national polls throughout the YEARS about this exact subject. And what team is always getting the most % of fans around the country? The Detroit Red Wings. Its a fact buddy. We're not just talking out of our asses(unlike certain blues fans). Most Americans are not even die-hard hockey fans. So of course alot of them are gonna cheer for a great traditional and winning club. I can understand you being bitter. Considering the blues are a f*cking joke. But you really cant deny reality pal. Well, I guess you can. But its called being delusional. laugh.gif

I really don't give a rat's ass how good a team has been or how many people like them or what poll says what...my point has nothing to do with any of that.

Once again...you are obviously not understanding what I am getting at, so I'll say it again just for you... It's assinine and arrogant for a team that represents a singular city or state to be labled, "America's Team".
Tthe Red Wings are not America's team...no NHL team is.
If people want to label a certain team, "America's Team", then it should be Team USA. Period.

And how are certain Blues fans, "talking out of their asses"? Where did that comment come from? I think certain Wings fans are taking some stupid, pointless poll and making it out to be more than it is and running with it.
Does the term, "unscientific" mean anything to you?

And just to clarify...I am not bitter at all. What do I have to be bitter about? I've enjoyed my team's colorful and rich history, even though it doesn't include a cup. I wouldn't trade those memories for anything. I couldn't be happier with my affiliation, which is why I run the website that I do. So the joke's on you...smart guy.


#52 DetroitIan

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Posted 19 July 2007 - 01:22 PM


QUOTE
I wasn't aware Detroit won a cup back in 1989. Wait...they didn't.


I never said they did. I said our DOMINANCE start 18 years ago. The 1990 season was the start of a long era of fantastic Red Wings hockey.

QUOTE
Once again...you are obviously not understanding what I am getting at, so I'll say it again just for you... It's assinine and arrogant for a team that represents a singular city or state to be labled, "America's Team".
Tthe Red Wings are not America's team...no NHL team is.
If people want to label a certain team, "America's Team", then it should be Team USA. Period.


It's not like us Wings fans are declaring them as "America's Team." We're just going by facts, jersey sales, memorabilia sales, SEVERAL national polls, ect, ect. It's called reality buddy.


QUOTE
Does the term, "unscientific" mean anything to you?


Does the term, "delusional blues fan" mean anything to you?

QUOTE
And just to clarify...I am not bitter at all. What do I have to be bitter about? I've enjoyed my team's colorful and rich history, even though it doesn't include a cup. I wouldn't trade those memories for anything. I couldn't be happier with my affiliation, which is why I run the website that I do. So the joke's on you...smart guy.


HAHAHAAHA! Yeah the blues have such a strong and rich tradition. laugh.gif rolleyes.gif You're gonna downplay the Red Wings success over the past 18 years, then you have the nerve to act like the blues have been around for ages and have an awesome tradition. LOL Dude, welcome back to reality. Correct me if Im wrong, but havent the blues only been around since the 70s??? If you want to talk about teams that have a rich history, try talking about the Montreal Canadiens, the Toronto Maple Leafs, or the Detroit Red Wings. Not thef****** blues. So actually buddy, you just made yourself look like a fool. And the only joke out there is you and you're s***ty blues. laugh.gif
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#53 HockeyCrazy3033

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Posted 19 July 2007 - 02:47 PM

nevermind.

Edited by HockeyCrazy3033, 19 July 2007 - 02:51 PM.

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#54 YoungGuns1340

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Posted 19 July 2007 - 08:10 PM

I was just in Uruguay about a month a go, and a guy that I met down there - never even been to the United States, never even seen a hockey game at any level - he knew who the Red Wings were and was able to describe their logo perfectly to me. It was the only team he knew.

QUOTE(cprice12 @ July 18, 2007 - 05:40PM) View Post

That is EXACTLY what I am saying.
Detroit is not America's team in hockey...no NHL team is. Like someone just mentioned, Team USA is truly America's team. No team that represents a singular city or state should be discussed as America's Team. It's arrogant and stupid.

Winners attract attention...no doubt. But that doesn't qualify them to be "Amerca's Team". Why? Because they don't represent America. It qualifies them to be a playoff team with probably a lot of johnny come lately fairweather fans jumping on the bandwagon...that's all.

What's sad though, are the fans that wear the jersey of one of the best teams in the NHL, when they live half a country away from that city, weren't born there, and have never been there.
It's sad that some people have some pathetic apparent necessity to be associated with a winning team.
If you live in Detroit, near Detroit, have family in Detroit, vacation often in Detroit (why on earth...I dunno), or something like that...that's cool with me...root loud and cheer your team on, because you are linked with that team somehow...but latching on to a team just because they are good...I dunno...that screams lame and pathetic to me.


Why are people making such a huge deal of this. They arent talking about which team in the history of the sport is "Americas team." In this sense "Americas Team"="Americas Favorite National League/Assoc. Team." That team is the Red Wings, and the only teams who are probably even close are the Rags and the Bruins. This isnt about the Olympics. This is about the 4 major NL/As


One of the things you arent mentioning is that the majority of people who are bangwaggoners ARENT real hockey fans. Same goes with every sport. People who arent real fans of a sport dont want to go through the trouble of finding a team, figuring out who their players are, knowing how they play the game, etc. They want to be able to be a "fan" with minimal involvement. Thats why people like the Red Wings - they win, therefore they are talked about a lot. Their success brings coverage and fame. And people can get acquainted with the Red Wings a lot easier than they can with, say, the Atlanta Thrashers, whom nobody talks about. On top of that, people want to watch a team who they know will win. Who wants to root for a team thats going to lose in a sport they only half care about? Bottom line, those people who are bandwaggoners want to watch said team purely for entertainment purposes, and watching a team kick the crap out of the opponent rather than getting their asses beaten is simply more fun.

Edited by YoungGuns1340, 19 July 2007 - 08:13 PM.

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#55 HockeyCrazy3033

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Posted 19 July 2007 - 08:24 PM

QUOTE(YoungGuns1340 @ July 19, 2007 - 09:10PM) View Post
I was just in Uruguay about a month a go, and a guy that I met down there - never even been to the United States, never even seen a hockey game at any level - he knew who the Red Wings were and was able to describe their logo perfectly to me. It was the only team he knew.



Why are people making such a huge deal of this. They arent talking about which team in the history of the sport is "Americas team." In this sense "Americas Team"="Americas Favorite National League/Assoc. Team." That team is the Red Wings, and the only teams who are probably even close are the Rags and the Bruins. This isnt about the Olympics. This is about the 4 major NL/As


One of the things you arent mentioning is that the majority of people who are bangwaggoners ARENT real hockey fans. Same goes with every sport. People who arent real fans of a sport dont want to go through the trouble of finding a team, figuring out who their players are, knowing how they play the game, etc. They want to be able to be a "fan" with minimal involvement. Thats why people like the Red Wings - they win, therefore they are talked about a lot. Their success brings coverage and fame. And people can get acquainted with the Red Wings a lot easier than they can with, say, the Atlanta Thrashers, whom nobody talks about. On top of that, people want to watch a team who they know will win. Who wants to root for a team thats going to lose in a sport they only half care about? Bottom line, those people who are bandwaggoners want to watch said team purely for entertainment purposes, and watching a team kick the crap out of the opponent rather than getting their asses beaten is simply more fun.


Best post on here. Finally someone gets it. clap.gif

Edited by HockeyCrazy3033, 19 July 2007 - 08:24 PM.

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#56 auxlepli

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Posted 20 July 2007 - 09:51 AM

Pardon me all over the place. Just in my mind when I think of America's team I think of first the 1980 Olympic hockey team and then any other Olympic team representing the United States. I also think it's a misnomer to call any team representing a city or state, America's team. Sorry if I've offended anybody, try not to get your panties in a wad, that's just my opinion.
On another note, that blog also mentioned Notre Dame, which is not a pro team, but on second thought I guess people could argue it is.

#57 Kira

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Posted 20 July 2007 - 11:43 PM

I remember when they were touting the Dallas Cowboys as "America's Team". And all I could say was, "They ain't mine."

I think it's kinda silly. There isn't one team that everyone is going to like, I don't care what sport it is. You like who you like, and in my case there is only one team out of the bunch mentioned that I give a damn about, and that is my beloved Red Wings. I never liked the Yankees because I think they're a bunch of arrogant jerks. I don't watch football and I don't watch basketball, so there goes the other three. But my Wings??? That's another story.

And yet I know we're not universally loved. I've gotten dirty looks wearing a Wings shirt in Jersey, but I've also gotten smiles in San Francisco. And I just had a friend come back from Ireland and he saw a Wings hat there, and a couple of Tigers jerseys.
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#58 SouthernWingsFan

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Posted 21 July 2007 - 08:15 AM

QUOTE(DetroitIan @ July 19, 2007 - 01:22PM) View Post

HAHAHAAHA! Yeah the blues have such a strong and rich tradition. laugh.gif rolleyes.gif You're gonna downplay the Red Wings success over the past 18 years, then you have the nerve to act like the blues have been around for ages and have an awesome tradition. LOL Dude, welcome back to reality. Correct me if Im wrong, but havent the blues only been around since the 70s??? If you want to talk about teams that have a rich history, try talking about the Montreal Canadiens, the Toronto Maple Leafs, or the Detroit Red Wings. Not thef****** blues. So actually buddy, you just made yourself look like a fool. And the only joke out there is you and you're s***ty blues. laugh.gif

Actually, the Blues had a stretch of making the playoffs for 20+ seasons I believe, despite not winning a Stanley Cup. They don't have the "tradition" of an Original-6 team, but that's still shows some good consistency and historic and "traditional" things to back up on, to a certain extent.

And for me personally, I could really care less if the Red Wings are America's team, if it is the Rangers, or if it is the District-5 Pee Wee hockey team. I like the Red Wings and that's what matters most.

The Cowboys were America's football team at the time when I went to college in the Dallas-Fort Worth area in the late 90s/early 00s. Good for them. Didn't really affect me one way or the other, I've always been a Saints fan for the most part, not much was going to change that.

Edited by SouthernWingsFan, 21 July 2007 - 08:17 AM.






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