drwscc

Voted no. I agree with Jonz96. Can't speak for anyone else, but I think they have alienated a LOT of fans this time. IMHO this lockout will keep a lot of fans from coming back. Voted no because another lockout will surely kill the sport. I've been watching hockey since the 70's and have been on many roller-coasters with the Wings. I'm pretty much done with these douchenozzles. All of em. I don't really care if they get it figured out. If I watch any games at all, it will most definitely NOT be my number 1 priority as it has been in the past. I won't be giving the NHL any of my money this year. That trickles down to the Wings and then the players. I don't care. I am angry and bitter that the sport I love above all others has taken this road again.....I wouldn't let anyone or anything else in my life threat me this s***ty. I hate that I am reduced to this, but I can't allow myself to be treated this badly again. Bastards.

TSN's Scott Cullen with the "elephant-in-the-room" tweet...

Lets put it this way....

If the shoe was on the other foot, and the players were making 43% while the owners were making 57%, how many people would be crying foul if the players went on strike in an attempt to get an even split of revenues?  The ownership in that case would not be gaining anything either.

I speculate that both the NHL and NHLPA had terms in mind right from the start that they would be willing to settle on, if forced. It would seem that the 50/50 revenue split was one area that both sides could settle for.... I wonder where that settle point is for the rest of the topics.

It would seem at this point that the NHLPA's mindset from the start was "If we concede the 50/50 revenue split, we will NOT move much at all on contract right's issues.".

Just mindless speculation because I’m bored...

Well, Sherlock Holmes mostly used abductive reasoning.  That might be your problem.

If anything, the articles from the Times and the Post quoted one page back make it sound like the NHL are the ones who won't concede on contract issues.   I'm hoping they're not true.  

If both sides get to 50/50 and can agree on make whole, the NHL needs to give up most of their ridiculous contract demands except for the one eliminating cap circumvention.

I don't have a "problem", thanks. Back off.

No way Ovechkin stays in Russia. He likes North America too much.

In Russia North America likes you.  Seriously, I believe it's just posturing on the part of our Russian players.  They are using whatever leverage they believe they have to take a jab at the NHL (Buttman).

Ultimately Bettman is the captain of the ship and if the ship runs aground 3 times he needs to take responsibility.

That's why he's paid $8,000,000 a year.  He doesn't need to be coddled or given excuses that the other side is tough to negotiate with. He's in charge and ultimately failure or success rests at his feet.  This lockout is unquestionably a failure from many perspectives.  Only the hardline group of 6-8 owners and Bettman himself seem to be happy with the situation.

he's paid 8 mil a year to be the whipping boy so that the owners don't take all the flack. if the owners didn't like him, he wouldn't be commissioner.

Lastly, you're getting one thing completely backwards. I don't think the way I do because I support the PA. I support the PA because I think the way I do. It's not about what has or hasn't been done wrong on either side, it's what has and hasn't been done right. The PA making the right (IMO) offer, makes any wrongs I might have had a problem with meaningless. They can only be wrong insofar as they contribute to making the offer wrong. If the offer isn't wrong, the actions leading to the offer aren't wrong. The actions themselves are meaningless. All anyone should be concerned with is the offers. You don't agree with the offers. You have your theories on what you think has contributed to those offers (or more accurately, the lack of better ones), but don't let that confuse your true issue.

I will say you make some valid points, especially on your method of thinking.  In my mind, both parties are going to be to blame in this lockout.  You say that you don't think the way you do because you support the PA.  You support the PA because you think the way you do.  I think the same way when it comes to my disdain for both parties and the way they conduct business.  It disgusts me, and as much as it disgusts me, I know that I won't be able to change the minds who are firmly on one fence or the other.

As I said before, we are going to have to agree to disagree on many of the things we discuss.  This isn't a bad thing.  We just have two opinions on the way that these negotiations should be run and my thoughts differ from yours.  After 20 pages of discussion, this is the way it always will be from the looks of things.

With all this being said, let me throw out another thought that has to do with what you mentioned.  You are right, I shouldn't expect anyone who likes apples but hates oranges to smash the apples they have.  Same goes for the opposite.  I mention this because you substitute the NHL for oranges and the NHLPA for apples, and you get the situation we have right here.  I cannot expect you or anyone else that matter to change.  You have your reasons for being where you are today, just as I do.  The likelihood of us meeting in the middle or changing our minds are nill.  Even though I hate the owners and the PA for their actions in this, I can't expect people firmly on one side to follow me in my thought process.  There is a reason you are where you are at right now.

As a hockey fan, I hope this gets situated as quickly as possible.  At the same time, my fandom of NHL hockey has taken a hit.  This is coming from someone who has followed the Wings since I fell in love with the sport.  Both the owners and players are not going to feel my paltry impact on the sport of hockey.  $2000 a year on merchandise, tickets, travel, and so on don't make a dent in anything.  At the same time, I hope that both sides hear my displeasure.

I don't expect you or anyone else to see things the way I do, and its about time I start acting like it.  You and others here have done your best to make me see it from your perspective, and that isn't going to happen.  I have to just be the guy here to bow out and say, agree to disagree.  Don't take it personally, but its just the way that is the best for all of us.

Fehr - 1
Bettman - 3

AND the players offered to start the season WITHOUT a CBA; owners said no.  The preponderance of fault lies with the owners on this one.

fehr has a history of striking in times of the league's biggest revenue making season, the playoffs and also at the time in which the owners have already paid most of their expenses. coincdentally the players do not get paid in the playoffs and have already recieved their checks before then. this gives the players pretty much all the leverage in negotations

let's not forget also, the former pa head bob goodenow led the players on strike back in 1992 on the eve of the stanley cup finals.

i'm pretty sure the owners don't want to go down that road again

They want good ratings and hockeymarkets such as Hamilton, QC porovide exactly that.

no it doesn't. it might have high ratings for canda television but that's not where the big money tv deal is at.

FYI, the lowest rated cup finals since the lockout was when ottawa (a candian team was involved). having canadian teams on tv doesn't automatically get you high tv ratings here in the states (which is where the big money tv contract is)

Andy Strickland ‏@andystrickland
According to sources Don Fehr has convinced the players the longer they remain firm, the better the deal will be down the road #NHLPA

that's nonsense. the longer this goes on, the worse it will be for both sides

Want to fix mistakes? Start with firing the most hated person in hockey.

firing bettman isn't going to end this lockout or solve much of anything except please the anti bettman crowd who are under the delusion that he is the sole creator of all these lockouts

also according to this article, the union knew about the 48 hour window on friday, not just today

The NHLPA was aware Friday - not Tuesday - that players were being contacted by owners.

That day, Mathieu Schneider issued an email to players entitled “Club Officials Contacting Players & Agents”. This is what he wrote:

In the last few hours we have heard about calls today from various club officials to players and agents to discuss the NHL proposal and bargaining.  This is interesting, since our understanding has been that the League had banned club officials from talking to players since the beginning of the lockout.  


If you get a call, or if there is anything you would like to discuss, please contact me. And, as always, please feel free to contact Don about anything, anytime.

Mathieu Schneider

A contract ones again is a legal binding agreement, the contract you are signing today with all the clauses can not be modified until BOTH sides agree to it. Boy I'd love seeing ******* like Jacobs crying infront of a judge about a contract he has willingly given out and then with all his billionaire friends crying again about not being able to pay it.

Judges would rip these dirty gamblers a new one.

and I would love to see the owners stand against a bunch of greedy players and their greedy union.....oh wait.

Why did it take Uncle Gary and Uncle Bill-shut so long to do what they did today?
Uncle Gary is the greatest; just ask him.

On the other side of the coin....

Why didn't Uncle Fehr make the first major concession?  I guess Uncle Gary cared a little bit more than Fehr.  Especially after Fehr was given the last proposal and he chose not to negotiate by saying it wasn't a game of "ping-pong".

With one major move, the league has the attention of the fans, and most importantly, the players.

Taking away security from players is never a good thing!

Couldn't care less about the NBA this is hockey we are talking here.

Sent from my BlackBerry

I'm not sure I understand you not wanting to talk about other leagues that are way more successful than the nhl and the reasons why they are. There are things that other leagues do that the nhl would be smart to adopt and some things that they need to stay clear of. there is nothing wrong with bringing those facts up. I hope that the 10+ yr contracts are a thing of the past.

The players are rightfully critisizing a man, who is responsible for failed franchises, 3 lockouts Jim D throwed the players including his own ones under the bus, while portraying the greedy owners and midget as the good guys here.

Translation: I agree with the players so they are right and should keep talking.

esteef

Bettman is evil and should be called midget some more.

esteef