PavelValerievichDatsyuk

And yet you spent yesterday pushing a completely different viewpoint in multiple responses to me in the defense thread: Anyway, I'm in line with your optimism in this thread. Hope Mantha keeps it going and is not only kept in the NHL for the rest of the year, but kept on scoring lines.

Well, he could be still on the Islanders who are at the bottom of the conference so he has that for perspective...but, yeah, that should be his linemates Those lines are irksome. Even just switching Larkin and Sheahan they look a lot better. Did something happen to Sproul? Why did he get the hook? Even he's not available, I would've expected Jensen rather than Lashoff.

You only read the 2nd half of my post if you're responding "exactly." I think we have some good assets - just I don't think we have ones we could part with that would bring back a #1D (and in the first half of my post I said few do have those expendible assets). For instance, I'd bet if we offered someone Mrazek and Larkin we could get a pretty good D man. But it probably wouldn't be worthwhile.

Not so fast - my post doesn't back your point at all. What I was arguing against was that you seem to be using your list as examples of Holland's failures. I guess we do agree that a trade for a 1D is unlikely, but that's pretty much a given: not many #1 D men are traded anywhere in the league. Few teams have good enough assets to trade for a 1D - you pretty much have to trade a cornerstone player yourself or multiple high picks. Even fewer are willing to give up those assets. As for your question of who's "in charge of the portfolio?", I'm not sure what you mean. If you're asking who controls trades and make the plan for the team, that would be multiple people with Holland being the final decider (probably a final okay from owners on major decisions).

I was leaning that way for a while, but I'm not sure where I stand on that now. Chychrun was recently a healthy scratch for the Yotes in 5 straight games. He's a very young player so that doesn't say much about where he'll end up, but it does say that he wouldn't have been a boost for us right away and that he wasn't as NHL ready as was reported at the beginning of the year. Anyway, we wouldn't have had roster space and so we wouldn't have seen him for a year with the most optimistic thinking. We'll have to wait to see Chychrun and Cholowski develop. Chychrun has 4 pts (1 goal) in 16 games and a -3 Cholowski has 7pts (all assists) in 14 games in the NCHC and a -3 He's listed at 185 lbs and 6'1". I don't think that's really skinny for an 18 yr old. http://www.eliteprospects.com/player.php?player=247137

There's many valid criticism of Holland, but calling him an imbecile is way over the top. Just listing D trades that happened doesn't mean that we missed out on them. Only a couple of those could be possibilities and it's even debatable if they could have happened. Trading for a top D man happens very rarely and you have to give up elite talent to get it - which we either don't have or in the case of developing players like Larkin, Mrazek, Mantha etc. it could be argued that giving them up would create as big a hole in the greater picture. I don't think the D is as bad as it's been depicted as. I've been really impressed with Sproul and think he'll develop into a solid top 4 guy. Green is 2nd in scoring and been very solid. These 2 could supply the offence from the blue line that we've been missing in the past 5 years. And we have good depth - having a player like XO hanging around as the #7 (or #8) speaks to that. We do lack a top guy, but for a rebuilding team who've never missed the playoffs - we have young solid goaltending, a bunch of young developing forwards (AA, LArkin, Mantha). Top D man is the big search - It'd be great to pick up Shattenkirk as a UFA or pull off a trade that makes sense. Otherwise I'm glad that the young players (Sproul, Marchenko, XO) have been plenty of playing time. That has been the other big complaint about Holland and nobody's commented on this aspect of this year's team.

Think you meant Larkin. Vanek made the awesome pass.

Mrazek had 3 bad games where he let in 4 goals each game before Howard was put in. That's leeway to me. Alternately, Howard was taken out as soon as he had the one 5-0 game and replaced with Mrazek the following game. With your example of Howard getting blown out, I assume you mean the 5-0 MTL loss. The factor you don't mention is how the other goalie played when they came in the following game. After the MTL loss, Mrazek didn't play well against Tampa and we lost 4-3. Alternately, after Mrazek's struggles, Howard came in and played solid the next 3 games and we won 2 of 3 and lost the other (EDM) by 2-1. That the difference that kept Howard in - quality of play and the fact that Mrazek was struggling - not a vet bias. I was a little surprised that Howard got the 4th game in a row, but I thought it was an undertandable decision. There has been a history of the Wings keeping vets in over youth despite their poor play, but that narrative doesn't fit this situation to me.

I find that I like Vanek more each time I see him. Great positioning - does that thing where he sneaks into open spots so that no one's on him. Then, that last little play - you know he could have scored that, but tossed it off to Ott. Not the selfish player some reported him as when he asked out of Buffalo.

Haha! I guess I should have just named you. Mrazek's definitely had some struggles, but - again - thought he was solid to really good in a fair number of games. Even if you just look at his SV% game by game, it aligns pretty much with what I think see the good stretch he had in the first collection of games. I think you could roughly say the first 6 (that first game with 5 goal against, I thought he was good despite the score - team was in defensive shambles those first 2 games). Then the rough stretch... http://www.espn.com/nhl/player/gamelog/_/id/5619/petr-mrazek But, yeah, I agree that on the whole he's been a bit disappointing so far. In 4 games in a row (that he started), he let in 4 goals - that's pretty bad - and I think going with Howie in Top Jimmy form was the right move. Mrazek's playing well tonight and last game, though, so hopefully it was just a blip.

Howard's better than most backups/1b goalies so I think it would logical that he would play more than other backups. Also, Mrazek's still struggling with consistency so it's no surprise we use Howard to help out through those rough stretches. I think Mrazek will still play a fair amount more than Howard, but with a solid second option I think it's great that we won't have to force him into the workhorse role so early.

Loved the guy waiving his finger behind the coach at the penalty And sweet goal by Mantha

I think that you might just be stuck on the idea of a starter being a finite static distinction. It's not like being labeled #1 means that you're entitled to play all but a handful of games. If you're playing bad you'll be given a break. I also disagree with those saying that Mrazek has sucked this year. I think he was good at the beginning and stole a game or 2. Then he had 4 or 5 rough games so go with very capable other goalie who's playing well. All is good. Roll with the punches and adapt.

Didn't see the game and was curious about these hits people are talking about. I only found video of the Bertuzzi one and thought I'd put it here for anyone else curious. To me, when a guy is making a hard turn with speed in the corner like that, you should let up on the hit, but the hit itself isn't dirty. Emelin does have a history of these kind of checks at that dangerous distance from the boards. Sometimes they get a boarding call out it. I do think some of it is on Bertuzzi to be aware of his situation and can't put himself on that angle (not to blame the victim, but it's something he'll get used to in the league). There was one similar hit I remember that Emelin made on Larkin were he got called for and then Abby fought him, but I don't think it was in the corner.

I didn't say he's playing well injured. We lack offense and Tatar is usually a good offensive threat. He's not expendable to me until Larkin, Mantha, AA and Nyquist are all lighting it up.

He's playing injured.

I think that's going a bit far. Petr has shown great stretches beyond that one month and recovered in the playoffs. I also think he's been good this year - just a few bad games. I think it's quite a lot for people to expect him to be a consistently good at this point. Price, Varlamov, even Hasek (and I'm sure many others) took a few years to establish themselves as consistent starters. Mrazek's only actually been on the NHL roster for just about 1.75 years now

Boxing's popularity is at or near an all time low. I know very little about UFC, but I feel like it's audience is a small segment. If tourists have the option of hockey games I think they'll be pretty well attended. But anyway, pretty much everything is sold out in Vegas, from my experience. From my one trip there many years ago, we went to a sold out Carrot Top show and a sold out Magic show even though we were enthusiastic about neither because every show/event in Vegas was sold out unless you booked far in advance. I think hockey would be sold out and the tickets will be pretty well used either sold or as they're passed around as hotel/casino perks. As for your one comment: "I know for me going to a Wings game would be down the list of things I'd want to spend my money on if I was there." That seems really weird to me. Hockey's my favourite sport and Wings are my favourite team - I feel like most people on the forum are like that. I'd jump at the opportunity to see them, but besides that, All the Celine Dion/magic show/elvis impersonator/ forms of entertainment that were around were pretty lame in my opinion - hockey would have been a much bigger draw for me.

Trading him and then re-signing him obviously brings us the most assets so that would be most ideal, but there would have to be some verbal agreement in that situation. I like him and I'd re-sign him for 3 or 4 years since he's only 32. It really depends on the fate of Howard, Kronwall, Sheahan, Smith, Tatar, though, to know if he'll fit under the cap (also how much it rises). If we get rid of Ott and Miller we do still have roster room with Mantha, AA, on the team. There has been some who have been quick to put him in the pile of players who sign big contracts and then lose motivation. That doesn't really seem to be the case if you look at his stats. He played for some very bad Sabres teams after his contract there and still produced - his only real down year was last year and there could be other explanations for that (I've read he was put on low lines and not given PP time).

Missed this one. Good to see Game Over Green has returned!

In NHL.com's projected Vegas lineup they have Howard and Jarnkrok: https://www.nhl.com/video/the-vegas-golden-knights-roster/t-278308694/c-46724103

Let's Go WIngs! Let's hope Quincey will score another sweet own goal tonight. With who's healthy, I think I like the forward lines except Abby-Neilson-Glen. Seems like one of those wingers should be switched with Tatar to even out the skill+piano puller balance. I know people cringe that Glen's that high in the lineup, but I'd rather have him up there ahead of Sheahan and Ott based on recent play. Bertuzzi's been a little hit and miss in the games he's been in, so I sort of understand the placement of him as well.

As much as looking to build for the future, Vegas will be looking for respectability and someone to be a face for their team. There's many reasons to think they would jump at the chance to get Z. In their bid to sign UFAs having a player like Z would be attractive, rather than someone looking at a team that's pack of young guys without leadership and experience. Also, they'll be a team looking to get to the cap floor and Z's contract and the idea that he might not fulfill it, could actually be a positive to them even if they think he's not worth it in those final years.

Though I think Green's been very good and I'm not arguing against him being the best so far this year, but he was pretty horrible in overtime this game. Buffalo had a pair of good opportunities where Green was literally standing beside the play at the net doing nothing. I like Larkin on that line too. Him transferring back to being successful at center will be really important for us.

Sweet goal by Vanek. Looked he was was just messing around. Also nonchalant by Nyquist. Good to get a win!!!