krsmith17

Comprehension is hard. Never once said that Sproul is as good or better than Daley. What I'm saying is that Sproul isn't that much worse than Daley that we go from basement to playoff team. I would say Nyquist and Tatar are better than Svechnikov as well, but once again, replacing either with Svechnikov "would not move the needle that much". Common sense. Great! Let's continue making the playoffs and getting bounced first round. You know what makes more money? Stanley Cups. The goal should always be the Stanley Cup, and when winning it all is no longer within reach, you SHOULD start trying to build it back up again.

You really think having Daley In the lineup over Sproul moves the needle that much? I completely disagree. I'm also glad you aren't the GM, and wish Kenny weren't any longer either. This team needs a GM that isn't afraid to shake things up, and someone that looks beyond this season. Squeezing into the playoffs again does not help this organization. Unless Holland is able to pull off some magic (he's not), playoffs shouldn't even be a thought with this team.

How dare they... No fan base has any right questioning management. They always do right, never make mistakes...

Holland proves once again that he's still great at one thing, re-signing his RFA's to reasonable contracts. Now if he could just prove he's capable of more than that with a big trade to help out Ouellet and company on the back end...

Wouldn't mind seeing Dallas go hard after Kovalchuk. Would be one of the most potent top six', in the entire league... Benn - Spezza - Seguin Radulov - Hanzal - Kovalchuk

I would say that Johanssen and Nyquist are similar in value. Would anyone trade Nyquist for a 2nd and 3rd round pick? This isn't directed at you Lefty, because I already know your answer. Asking those that don't hate Nyquist (for some inexplicable reason). I don't think I'd do it, unless it was the difference in being able to re-sign a Larkin or Mantha. I would hope though that there would be better ways to shed the cap space. In other words, I think New Jersey benefitted from Washington's cap crunch and won this trade.

I highly doubt Coreau would get claimed on waivers.

Yes I do think it is worth it to invest in your younger players with potential. And no, I don't think Daley in the lineup over Sproul makes this team THAT much better. What is realistic expectations for Daley at this point in his career? 60 games, 20 points? I don't think that would be out of the question for Sproul. I agree that we have bigger fish to fry, and Sproul likely wouldn't move the needle that much, but neither will Daley. For a team that should be rebuilding, we should be trying to figure out what we have in our younger players, not signing stop-gap vets that will not be part of the future. We should be making small improvements now to help the team in 3-5 years from now. If Sproul were able to produce in a top 4 role (I believe he could), his value would sky rocket. At some point you need to push them in the deep end to see if they sink or swim. Again, having Daley in over Sproul is not the difference between the basement and making the playoffs. All of your other what if scenarios happen regardless whether or not we signed Daley. Look, I'm not Sproul's number one fan or anything, I'd be okay if we traded him or literally any defenseman on the roster or in the organization. But in order to trade any of them, they need to raise their stock, and to raise their stock, they need to be given an opportunity. An opportunity is all I'm suggesting he should get. It might be sounding like I'm bashing Daley, but I'm not at all. I think he's a good defenseman, and this would be a GREAT signing for a playoff team. That we are not. However, I'd like to reiterate that I'm completely okay with this signing IF it's to replace one of Kronwall or Ericsson. If it's to keep one of the kids as a healthy scratch or to waive one of them, I think it's terrible asset management. Yup, not a single top 4 (potential top 4) defenseman was left unprotected in this expansion draft...

Those are all guys that had / will likely have a short NHL career. That's not the case of all bottom pair defensemen though. I think Ouellet could potentially have a long NHL career as a solid 3rd pairing defensive defenseman. I do think Russo could go the way of Lashoff and company though. I'm just not that high on him. My biggest beef was calling Sproul a plug. Maybe he never does materialize into a top 4 defenseman, but I still think it's a good possibility, especially if he ever gets out of Detroit. He's still young enough that he could develop further, the same way Jensen did this past season.

Yeah, he won't be wearing number 6, although I think he should be able to. My guess is something with the number 6 in it. Maybe 26?...

I don't see it that way at all, and if management does, we're in even bigger trouble than we could have possibly imagined. No way they see McCollum as a suitable replacement for either Howard or Mrazek. This was purely a depth signing for Grand Rapids, or at least I hope... There's no way Holland is going to trade Howard after just protecting him in the expansion draft, and trading Mrazek when his stock is at an all time low, would be a huge mistake.

To be fair, Hamonic isn't really a top pair defenseman. I certainly wouldn't put him on the same level as players like Trouba. If we could get Trouba for a few picks, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

I'd make a significant wager that no major changes in the way of trades will be made this year, or any year until Holland moves on. I'd love to be proven wrong on that though...

More or less what I was expecting, but I disagree on your Sproul assessment. I still think he could be a serviceable top 4, similar to a Johnny Boychuk. I'd just like to see him given a legit shot once he becomes healthy, and hopefully that ACL tear doesn't effect his game too much. I think Ouellet is a serviceable bottom pairing defenseman, and same goes for Russo.

Seriously? I don't get that comparison at all. To me, they couldn't be further from comparable style players...

I'd love to revisit this post in 5+ years from now. Not saying you're doing be wrong, but I think Mantha has the potential to be borderline elite. I can't say the same for Athanasiou. I think Mantha could become a 70+ point player. I think Athanasiou tops out at 50-60.

I'd rather give up Glendening and Nastasiuk for Trouba. Unfortunately though, that's not the way trades work.

Fair enough. How do you feel about Sproul and Ouellet. I would think you probably fall somewhere in between my opinion (still young, top 4 potential if given a legitimate opportunity) and kickazz' opinion (plugs)... You also said you're okay with the Daley signing if he's taking the spot of Kronwall / Ericsson, and I agree. What about the more likely scenario, taking the spot of Sproul or Ouellet? Just curious. Although, I think I know the answer...

I disagree. Sproul is a better hockey player than Jensen in my opinion. The offence that he can generate far outweighs any defensive shortcomings. But then again, the same reason Smith wasn't a great fit here, and is proving his worth with the Rangers, Sproul may never pan out here either. This organization clearly values defense far more than offense, and unless a kid is a stud defensively, they won't get the minutes he probably should. And that goes for forwards and defensemen. I still think Sproul has top 4 potential, and can be a major asset on the power-play. I think for a team that should be rebuilding, that's exactly what you do. Give the guys with a ton of upside and potential an opportunity with big minutes to see what the got. Do you really think Daley vs Sproul in the lineup is the difference between squeaking into the playoffs and "tanking"? Not at all. The last part is the scariest part about all of this. Holland wants to take shortcuts to get this team back in the playoffs. What's the point? We need to build this team back up, and that doesn't happen through free agency, and squeaking into the playoffs every year, picking outside of the top 15...

I think a package of Nyquist / Tatar, Hronek / Saarijarvi, and a 2nd round pick could bring in a legit number 2/3 defenseman. I think we'd have to use one of Athanasiou / Svechnikov to have a chance at a number one defenseman though. And I'm talking young guys with potential, not established guys in their prime.

Defensemen age is not equivalent to forwards. Meaning it takes longer for defensemen to develop. Correct? But Ouellet and Sproul aren't good and never will be at the age of 24? Virtually every single person on here was ready to give up on Jensen until he got a legit shot with the Wings this past season, and proved the naysayers wrong. Myself, LeftWinger and one other person (I think it was Jesusberg), felt that Jensen could become a legit NHLer if given the opportunity. Almost everyone else thought we were crazy because he was already 25 years old. Now Sproul is 24 and you've already determined that he is a plug. We should give up on him too right? But yet Sproul has been better than Jensen at every level prior to the NHL, and has a measly 0.02 points per game less in their small sample sizes with the Wings. Jensen - legit top 4. Sproul, Ouellet - plugs... Got it.

Nyquist - Zetterberg - Mantha Tatar - Larkin - Athanasiou Abdelkader - Nielsen - Frk Helm - Sheahan - Glendening / Witkowski Daley - Green DeKeyser - Jensen Ouellet - Sproul / Kronwall / Ericsson Mrazek / Howard

I didn't say he was, and I somewhat agree. I do think he's a better option than McCollum though.

Why? This would make no sense. Coreau has very little trade value, and McCollum isn't an NHL quality goaltender, even as a 3rd option backup.

Hicketts and Cholowski can be ready two years from now, and they're not the only ones. Why are you so confident none of these guys will be in Detroit in the next 2 years? They will be ready by then, but signing old vets will keep them down. Signing Daley IS taking something away from Sproul or whoever else would have been on the 3rd pair and is now scratched. Signing a player, whether he's top pair or 2nd pair, slides everyone else down, and effects everyone on the depth chart. The thing is, I would love a young top pair guy having that effect on the roster, but not an old 2nd pair guy. Why should Daley be Green's replacement? I'd much rather re-sign Green to another 2 year contract after this season than have Daley for that time. Why let the better of the two vets go? That makes no sense to me. Like I've said, if Daley is Kronwall or Ericsson's replacement, great. But if all 3 of Daley, Kronwall and Ericsson are in the lineup every night it's a terrible signing.