kliq

Im sure all the double posts are part of the reason for that lol.

Fair enough lol. I dont want to be "that guy".

Oh I agree, its stupid. The kid is the future, but there is no denying he is struggling.

I'm a Mrazek fan as well, and I think he is the future, but when you have to cheer a save I think it speaks volumes to the fact that there is a problem.

You realize Jimmy is still sporting a 1.95 GAA and 93.4 Save %. Still damn good, pretty much identical to Carey Price. Nielsen!!!!!

Holland has 3 options. Wait for our kids to develop, keep making little moves to improve us a bit, tank/complete rebuild. Which do you think the 87 year old Illitch would want?

Ughhh that was ugly

NIce!!!!! This is what I want to see!

Who knows. That is what I find most frustrating, when you see them play games like they did against Arizona and LA you know they are so much better then that which they are showing tonight. I can take losing when full effort is given. When you lose and look like you are barely breaking a sweat, that is frustrating. Maybe Blashill feels the heat. What are the lines tonight? I know they are on page one, but Jurco is not listed there.

I have to say, this is the best I have seen them play in weeks!

XO!!!!!!!!

Nice post! Its cool getting a chance to see behind the scenes.

Last year in the playoffs Sheahan/Glendenning/Abby did good against TB's top line. Not sure about Sheahan/Ott/Miller though.

I saw both of those live, Taker loss was worse lol.

I haven't been to every game this season, but I have been to 5 and I sit upper bowl. I can tell you first hand that its pretty full. Maybe not 100%, but I would say 95%. The Arizona game being the exception, there were empty seats for that one.

Your original post had nothing to do with people attending or not, your original post was: "Its just the lower bowl corporate seats that are empty" - Same excuse for the last 5 years. No its not the corporate seats." My point to you is that you are wrong mocking those who say the empty seats are corporate.

oh for sure lol. My section is always filled with students.

If your argument is going to be the stats are wrong I'm not going to even bother debating with you. Empty seat does not mean the seat is not paid for. My entire point from your original post is that mocking those who say its the corporate seats is just ignorant because they are right.

Looks like it. I think when its above 100% that means they sold standing room. I've been to 5 games so far this year, and they have all been pretty much full.

I dont really get the argument that the Tigers are a reason for anything. Its not like he's spending less money on the Wings because he owns the Tigers.

Why dont you actually look at the facts rather then mock people who actually know what they are talking about. This year we rank #3 in the NHL in attendance with 20,027 fans per game. http://www.espn.com/nhl/attendance AND we are the 6th best draw on the road.

Exactly. If I had to give some reasons off the top of my head, I would say: - Being good for so long leads to an inevitable downturn, no team can escape it - Not having a top 5 pick for decades (though this kind of coincides with my last point)\ - The Wings have always tried to improve their team every off season to try to give themselves the best shot possible. Even while we are not contenders this mind set stays and can stunt the development of some of the kids. - Mike Ilitch has always had a "go for it and win or fail" mentality. Trading away players at the deadline is just not something he is ok with. (again, DD/Tigers situation) - Ken Holland with all the factors above, is not a GM in 2016 who can make up up for it with a blockbuster trade (though I have come to the realization that trades just dont really happen anymore so I am not sure if I even blame him for this) - Babs was a very good coach, and switching to Blashill has led to a major regression. - We have too many of the same type of player. - IMO probably the biggest reason, our vets regressed before our kids developed into superstars. Everyone knows that Holland doesn't view Helm/Abby as superstars, and their contracts dont reflect that. He locked them up to give the team stability. Just look at our performance since they have been out. They are good players and are not the reason we are not good right now. People like scapegoats, and unfortunately some have chosen them. The Illitch family cares, saying they dont care anymore is simply a comment built from frustration.

Wow.....crazy to see how many 1st round picks end up doing nothing. Kudus for doing the research Dickie. Not that you did Dickie, but I hate it when people list Grigorenko as a bust. Saying he is a bust would be like saying Konstantinov was a bust post '97. You can't blame a guy for almost dying in a car accident. Holland and co. really do a better job in the latter rounds. Or maybe they do a very good job developing lower end players.

I feel like if you ever saw Helm and Abby in public, you would great them in a similar fashion to Jerry Seinfeld greeting Newman lol. I voted Blashill, hes just not doing a good job with the talent he has. Number 2 is an exaggeration. I dont think the Ilitch's don't care. If anything the Tigers are in a much worse spot then the Wings. They have an aging roster that cant win now, with zero prospects in the minors because DD traded them all. If you wrote "Ownership doesn't grasp the post cap nature of the NHL", that I feel would have more merit and could get some votes.

2 years ago, fans were saying that the Sharks were done and they needed to re-build. Fans of the Pens just a year ago were saying that the team was in decline and changes needed to be made. Its so easy for fans to sit from afar and scream "hit the reset button". Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, more often it doesn't. I have watched the Detroit Lions "rebuild" for more then a decade, top 5 pick after top 5 pick that led to nothing as the team just got stuck in a negative/losing culture. Things appear better now (knock on wood) but how many years did we suffer disappointment after disappointment. Its funny as for years the criticism of the Lions was they had elite players in CJ, Suh, Stafford, but lacked balance and depth. I get why some fans of the Wings were saying "tank!", you see the Kings and the Hawks, and they become the template of how to turn your team around. The countless other teams that tried the same thing and failed (ie. Thrasher/Jets, Hurricanes, CBJ etc) are simply ignored. Havent the Blue Jackets been re-building since 2000? The reason why I get so annoyed when people whine and complain about Ken Holland is I try to think to myself, how would I react if I were in his shoes? If I had an owner in Mike Ilitch that was anti re-build (I think the DD/Tigers situation made that clear) and I did a re-build on the fly before that successfully that led to a cup, I cant see how I would do anything but. Alot you can say you would this, or you would do that, but if Mike Ilitch looks at you and says "make this team better THIS YEAR!" BS you would tell him no. Criticizing Holland becomes the easy and the lazy thing to do. If ownership wanted a complete re-build/tank job, it would be happening. GM's DO NOT have more power then ownership. With all that being said, do I think Holland is perfect? No. I didnt like any of the UFA signings this past off season (though Vanek has turned out well, props again Lefty lol). In retrospect, we probably should have have held onto Datsyuk, not signed Neilsen and drafted Chychrun. But hindsight is always 20/20, and we just couldn't pass up the chance of landing Stamkos, especially when experts were pointing at us a favourite. I still remember threads with people saying "If Holland cant trade Datsyuk's contract, fire him!!!!!!" Our last crop of talent (Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan, Glendenning, Smith, Sproul, XO, etc.) for the most part turned out to all be good secondary players and role players, unfortunately none became elite and under Blashill most have regressed to 3rd line level players or worse. Now the test becomes, what happens with the development of guys like Larkin, Mantha, AA, Mrazek, Svechnikov etc. We need these players to get to an elite level, or we need to pull a trade out our asse, or we need to hope to find some gems in the draft. Come the trade deadline, if we have not done a 180 from where we are right now, it would be a good idea to sell, I wouldn't trade everyone, but I would move some guys. Completely tearing things down to the extreme and going the route that some want to take could be a very very ugly road with no light at the end of the tunnel. Something a lot of people on here claim they can handle it, but based on the poll that was made and the freak outs about our decline, I don't think the majority of fans could take. Exactly right! More the reason that comparing this team to the Dead Wings era is hyperbole.