kliq

So does this mean that KFQ was the anchor of our D last season lol

Exactly. If we were 2-0 right now, would that make us Cup contenders? Of course not. For the same reason, going 0-2 does not mean we are headed for a dreadful season. Our play these first 2 games has definitely been discouraging, but its wayyyyy to early. If anything, hopefully this poor play forces management to re-evaluate the roster (ie. getting Miller out of the lineup, and actually trading for a d-man).

I understand your point, but Lapointe isn't really a good example. You have even said it yourself, pre-cap and post-cap are two different worlds. In the pre-cap era good to elite players hit unrestricted free agency all time time, so losing someone was never really a big deal as it was easy to sign someone to replace them. Now a days its different. you lose Abby, you can just go out and sign a Hull and Robitaille to replace him. Availability wise, and cap wise you would run into issues in 2016. I personally don't have an issue with the Abby contract, sure I wish it was 5 years and not 7 years, but I think he brings a lot to the table that other guys don't on this roster. A gritty leader who can score over 20 goals, and 40 points. Its the contracts surrounding him that are the problem.

You got to think as well, if the Wings saw any real value in him they could have just waived Ott and kept him on the roster. I look at this move as the Wings essentially giving up on him. With hindsight being 20/20, I do wish the Wings traded him right after his big AHL year, but at that time they must have still had hope in him rounding out his game. They were obviously wrong.

I got Datsyuk, Lidstrom, Vladdy, Howe, Holmstrom, Veron

I actually consider you a good contributor to this board, I have no issue with you posting. All I ask is if you want to complain about Helm, go into the Helm thread. If you want to complain about Holland, go into a Holland thread. Every single thread is just filled with comments like "so....darren Helm is fast" "Holland is a moron" "this guy needs to be fired", "GET RID OF ERRORSON" "Nyquist is soft and NEEDS TO GO!!!!!" etc. It derails every thread.

Read my posts Lefty, I have been more then clear on my thoughts on the moves that KH has made in the past few years. There are plenty of things I am not happy with. You just repeat the same sentiments every single day acting like things you have complained about 50 times already are something new. Doesn't matter the thread, doesn't matter the topic, you have this need to complain about the people on your s*** list. We all know your thoughts on Holland, Helm, Franzen, E, and Nyquist. You don't need to keep bringing them up. Or google "Holland sucks articles" and keep posting them, I don't care.

LOL, that was good! I wish there was audio on the players when he hit them in the ankles or when he grabbed the one players Gatorade.

I should always fact check before posting lol. I usually do. Either way, I think in 2016 unless you have 3 guys all on ELC's playing extremely well, it would be very hard to duplicate those kinds of numbers, especially when you take into consideration your good point there in the style of play. I have zero issue with people criticizing the OMG line, personally I am not a fan (but I will give them a chance to make me one). But if someone is going to criticize them, using the grind line is not really fair as we are talking a legendary 4th line. If anything compare them to the 4th lines of the Hawks, Pens, Kings etc.

You're comparing pre-cap vs post-cap, when you have zero salary restrictions its a completely different world.

1) Jacub Trouba is traded to the Red Wings for Tatar and DD in November after a being a late holdout 2) Nashville wins the Stanley Cup against the Washington Capitals 3) Florida Panthers have a huge regression and do not make the playoffs

Man, calm down. I said I think your probably right, and I am not anti metrics by any stretch. The implication of my comment is that if we are forced to use these three as our 4th line, I hope you are wrong and they can contribute in their own way. I am not saying I think they are better then a line of say Glen-Helm-Sheahan. lol, that is not me.

I hope you are wrong lol, but you probably aren't. Time will tell.

I dont disagree with you, but I will give a perspective that Ken Kal gave on the radio yesterday. He feels (or at least says) that the OMG line gives the Wings something that they have not had in years which is a tough and gritty 4th line that they can role out and give themselves another dimension. Personally I wish they didn't sign them either, but I can understand this line of thinking as people have been complaining about how soft we are for years.

All this is, is some writer complaining about the same crap you complain about 20 times a day. There is nothing new here.

I agree with who should play vs shouldn't play based on who is on the active roster. But I don't agree an NHL head coach should have the power to decide who should be sent down vs who shouldn't. If a GM wants to have a kids play a big role on the AHL team, that should be the GM's decision, not the NHL coaches decision. In your scenario, if Blashill wanted to play say AA 3min a game in the NHL, and Holland wanted him to play 22min a game in the AHL, Holland would have no say.

I have to complement your post Frank, this was a very well written assessment. I give you you crap at times lol, so I have to give you credit when you make a very valid point. I have mentioned on here numerous times that I believe the Wings are going through a re-build, and I stand by that. With that being said, I do agree with your assessment that their isn't a crystal clear direction. I do believe that Hollands mandate from ownership it to 1) make the playoffs, 2) build for the future. While I do like the strategy of building on the fly, certain signings (ie. Ott, Vanek) to me are just blocking younger talent like a AA or a Frk. I think that sometimes Holland acts on a "fear of not making the playoffs" opposed to doing what is best for the long term success of the team. Again, I am not pro tanking and I do not want the Wings to trade every player under the age of 25 hoping to get lucky with lottery picks, but I do wish that their veteran to ELC contract ratio was a bit more on the side of ELC's. Though I do not think Helm/Abby/Glen are the problem. If I were Holland/Blashill I would do the following: - Try everything I could to trade E and if you cant and he plays bad put him in the press box or waive him. - Same thing for Jimmy.....I think that Holland hangs on to him as a safety net for Mrazek because of the fear of not making the playoffs. Though who knows, maybe nobody is biting. - Not have signed Vanek, played AA in that spot - Not have signed Miller or Ott, and had a 4th line of Glendenning/Helm/Sheahan or at least not signed one and had Glendenning-Sheahan-Miller/Ott and let helm centre the third line. - I would fill the other 2 top 9 spots (if we didnt have Ott/Miller) with Jurco and Mantha. (or a guy like Frk while Jurco was out). - I would find a way to get XO and Sproul in the lineup even if it means benching vets that are under-performing regardless of contract. A guy like Kronwall doesn't need to play 82 games. - I would do what I could to trade for Trouba (though this is easier said then done if Chevy is demanding Larkin and Nyquist).

That is what a GM does, his job is to assemble a roster for a coach to utilize. You can't have a GM have full control on who he trades for, picks up on waivers etc. if he doesn't have say on who is on the roster. If your way was the way it was done, theoretically a GM could trade for a player, then the coach could waive him only for him to be picked up by another team.

The only thing I can think of, is right now is probably the easiest time to waive someone without them being claimed as every team is dealing with trimming their roster and the least amount of injuries they will likely deal with since the season has not started. Had Holland waived Frk in a month, I would guess the probability of being claimed goes up. Obviously a moot point though since he was claimed. That's just a theory though, I could be dead wrong. At the end of the day, I don't think losing Frk is a huge deal. I'm pretty sure anyone asking for Holland's head for this was asking for his head before the claim.

Do you have a link?

Why do you keep saying this in multiple threads? Are you hoping to get into a Darren Helm debate for the 50th time since July 1st?

Do you really think the mandate for the streak is coming from Holland and not ownership? Thing about it logically, Illitch is 87 years old, he has already won 4 cups, I believe he feels there is one thing left to accomplish, the all time record for a playoff streak. Its obvious how important this streak is to the team. The narrative on Illitch in 20 years will be a guy who took over the Wings during an awful era, won 4 cups, and set the all time playoff streak, keeping the Wings competitive for 30 years straight. This is what I believe he wants to be remembered as. In 20 years nobody is going to remember that they were not elite for the last 5 years of the streak. People can say fire Holland, but I cant see this new "savior" doing anything different working within the same system. If anything I would worry that the drafting wouldn't be as good as that is one of Holland and co's strong suits. The fact that Holland is able to acquire so much good young talent while keeping this team competitive (ie. low pics) IMO is very impressive. I have said this before, I am a GM in real life (not as anything close to as big as a sports team lol) and being a GM can be very frustrating because everyone puts every decision on you, however you do answer to an owner. I can tell you first hand, ownership usually doesn't "get it" like they should and at times you have to implement poor policies or make poor decisions because of mandates from ownership. I'm not saying Holland can do no wrong, there are plenty of scenario's where I have been upset with his decision making (the cujo/hasek situation made me furious), but things are generally more complicated then what we the public see.

As long as Illitch is the owner of this team, this is not going to happen. I'm not sure if you follow baseball Frank, but last year at the trade deadline the Tigers GM Dave Dombrowski wanted to sell as the Tigers were not going to make the playoffs. Long story short, word is that Illitch was so pissed at this, it led to DD's ousting as GM. I believe Holland has 2 mandates from ownership...1) Make the Playoffs, 2) Build a winner. It is very hard to to do both at the same time. With that being said, I am not for tanking. I think many teams try this and fail miserably creating a losing culture for a long long long time. However, I do think there are some moves that we make that do hurt long term. I personally wish we didnt sign Vanek and played Mantha top 6 or top 9, I wish we didnt sign Ott, put Sheahan on 4th line and played AA on the third line, I would bench E for XO, and I would rotate Sproul into the lineup somehow. I didnt love the Nielson signing, but I dont hate it as it gives Larkin some time to mature into the role of 1C. I agree that we do need to find a top caliber d-man. Hopefully other teams balk at Winnipeg's demands and we somehow pull-off a trade for Trouba.

Not sure what this has to do with my post. I said that Miller/Ott are the reasons why Frk was waived.You can argue that helm should be 4th line, but he's not. Since he is not, he has nothing to do with Frk being waived, its the guy that are on 4th line playing forward that are the reasons (Miller/Ott). If you want to argue Helm is blocking someone's spot, it would AA. *edit* Just reading some scouting reports on Frk, and from what I read he not that good of a skater or defender, I guess not really ideal for our 4th line. With that being said, I guess I wish we traded him for a pick.

How do you figure? Whether or not they kept Frk, Helm is playing third line. If they didn't sign one of Ott or Miller, Frk would have the spot they have now. That spot being 4th line winger/reserve player.