kickazz

The funny thing is, some of us (like myself) are pointing out flaws and leaving it at that, but others who are making excuses or countering the argument regarding Pulk's 'flaws' are making it out to be as though we're claiming Pulk sucks. If you look at some of the other threads this trend is already being posted by the pro-pulk posters as a defense mechanism in the debate that's been going on. "Didn't you hear? Pulk sucks" - sarcasm from the pro-pulk posters is what helps push made up narratives and really prevents holding up adult-like debates. It's never a bad thing to bounce off ideas and opinions but getting personal about it or defensive to the point where your statements are full of fallacies and ridiculous defense mechanisms (i.e using sarcasm to say "People are saying Pulk sucks").. well therein lies the problem and cause of the exaggerations you mention. People get too damn sensitive.

Some of our posters would be perfect replacements for Devellano and his minuscule brain.

The proposition is he COULD be. That's the problem, no one is claiming he's going to tank it from game one. All is being pointed out is the flaws that should/will be improved upon. There's not need to be offended by this it's just opinions. I respect your opinion and hope you are right. But then you have people making up narratives saying "Oh did you hear? Pulkinnen sucks now" Childish.

Never too soon to say Tank it. They all suck. TANK IT.

Def not a waste of roster spot based on the salary and his potential for scoring. We're merely discussing (in other thread moreso) whether or not he will be able to bloom in the NHL level. Additionally I have bias towards 2-way players in the current NHL and have held a point that he should try and get better at his defensive game so he isn't a liability if he wants to push for top 6 eventually. That's just my personal opinion though. Others here are arguing that he won't be able to take the slap shots like he does in the AHL because he can't create space or is weak on the puck against NHL D-man (as witnessed in the first 34 NHL games he played). Unfortunately a lot of Pulk fan boys are taking these statements as some sort of anti-Pulk movement. It's as though it's blasphemous to NOT be a Pulk fan boy. Somehow it's that black and white. Apparently it's a sin to be skeptical and/or analytical. Meh not really. It's obvious that he won't hit his prime for a while. To think otherwise is quite idiotic. But the reality is that the whole 1 dimensional excuse more often than not doesnt work in todays NHL. That's all I'm arguing. I'm arguing against the excuses being made for him. People should face the reality that Pulk has weaknesses instead of making excuses. I'm sure Pulk himself knows the issues and I guarantee you he plans on working on them. There is no "NOW NOW NOW, YESTERDAY" like you say. Not that black and white.

Yeah I saw this. Babs is really starting to piss me off by taking some of our coaching and staff members.. Goes to show how popular Babs really was among the organization.

Love it.

what if Larkin has a disappointing AHL season

I have no issue with this. If that's what his use is then he will fit the role well and I would be all for it. But I won't lie his 31 games or so in the NHL we less impressive to me than Tatar or Nyquist's were as far as overall performance. That doesn't mean he won't be able to adjust either.

Nope didn't say that actually. It's more like "Just so I know where I ASSUME you stand". Too much making up theories in your head my friend. Personally I would be happy if Pulk scored even 15 goals his first year and did a good job on the defensive side. An rookie that exceeds expectations on his flaws gains more respect from me and a lot of people than one that remains stagnant. But if he blows defensively (which realistically he probably will this first season). I'm expecting a very good reason to keep him. Either show us you're an asset on the power play. Or that you have the potential to be a 40+ goal scorer. Or show us that you can outplay the defense. Tatar and Nyquist did their first full seasons. Hell I still remember Tatar going around the defense and falling and getting back up and scoring a goal 2 years ago. I have watched him in the AHL (been to a few games actually) and watched his prospects reports and updates and all indicate that he is garbage defensively.

Does anyone else feel like Babs and Lou would have major personality clashes? They're basically both very hard-nosed. I guess that could also be beneficial if they are on the same page.

82 game in the NHL might do bad for his development. Jurco got screwed big time. I blame the org for that. He should have been in the AHL last year. His confidence level is a mess right now. But he's got to move on from last year and somehow play liek an NHL player this year and move on. I honestly feel liek Nyquist and Tatar was very lucky to be in the AHL all those games that they were. When they were called to play here full time they came booming. It worked out for both parties.

I just think that if you want to make it with the 1-dimensional stuff then the expectations are much higher for that 1-dimension that you play. Just my opinion.

Pulks 'first season' was last year with 31 games and 5 goals. Haven't mentioned it in comparison to Pav. But if you mean comparing his upcoming FULL season to Pavs last season, I don't see why even that can't be justified? Pulk has 34 games under his belt. And like you said it yourself. He is a "pure goal scorer" right? So why is it blashphemous to compare a pure goal scoring rookie with a "Brett Hull-like potential" (like you say), to a non goal scorer that is slow, aged and injury prone? (Datsyuk). Not like I'm comparing Zetterberg who is an ex-goal scorer (43, 39, 33, 31 goals in prime) to Pulk's first full season. I'm comparing a slowed aged veteran who is 2 dimensional NON goal scorer and still put up 26 goals to a rookie "pure goal scorer" with an incredible slap shot that is 1-dimensional

His shot is beautiful.

Yeah. Just pointing out though that you can improve your game. I guess I could even bring up recent players like Tatar. Tatar has slowly been getting better on the defensive side of things. No one compared Pulk's first season with Pavs season last year. Stop making arguments up that don't exist please. Yes, that's my point. No reason not to develop your game. If I were Blashill I wouldn't be telling him "Pulk you got that slapshot just float on ice and take it when yeh got the chance" Then again I'm not Blashill and have no idea how the guy will coach in two months.

Again with your make belief assumptions and made up theories. Who exactly is trying to prove that he "stinks"?. Show me. I challenge you to pull out proof that this is what the intension is. You can't because most of the stuff you say comes out of your wild assumptions. And why exactly should he not be compared to Datsyuk? Is Pulk seen is a future bottom 6 player or a top 6 player? Do we simply turn our cheeks to every player that walks thru and say "well you can't compare them to Datsyuk or Zetterberg". No actually you can and you should because this is the teams future as the aging stars depart they need replacements. The proposition was that Pulk's one-dimensional play is ok as long as he puts up 15-25 goals. I say that's an excuse because a 2-way aging player put up 26. Pulk should and probably will work on his defensive game. That is my opinion and probably the Red Wings opinion since the organization is all about 2-way style of play. I'm not supportive of not working on fixing your flaws in your play. There's no reason not to improve. Yzerman fixed his defensive game many years into the NHL. It's not impossible.

Interesting to see how Lou and Babcock work together. Their personalities may clash..

Pav is 2 dimensional and easily put up 26 goals last season in only 63 games. As a 36 year old. I dont buy the whole "one dimensional = okay because he can score" Just sounds like an excuse to me. But with that said, if it doesn't hurt our team then sure. But at the same tIme I wouldnt want a one dimensional player being out on ice for too long unless its the powerplay or up against much easier matchups. 19 minutes a night for a one dimensional player is a huge liability in current day hockey. I can probably go back and pull out a plethora of posts of people complaining about nyquist or tatar not backchecking and how it cost us this goal or that goal. And nyquist and tatar's back check is actually not too bad either. So imagine someone who is even worse.

I could counter that and say that Pulk could do better on 3rd line because he would be up against less competition and probably have more space for his shot rather on the top lines where he could potentially get out skated and ran over. Additionally Pav and Z do well with players that are big or have speed. Pulk has neither. So, no I don't think Pulk would be at the same advantage Franzen would on top lines (powerish forward with good wrist shot). The IF's may work for Franzen, but they don't necessarily work for Pulk. Not yet anyway. Z - Pav - Pulk line would be atrocious to even think about to be honest.

Plus you could counter the argument and say maybe we called up Jurco TOO early and should have kept him in AHL an extra year because look at his perfomance last year. He came into the roster at much young age than Nyquist and TAtar and his nunbers were disappointing. Just playing devils advocate.

Kings also grow full beards down to their neck, like Zetterbeard

Its because Nyquist had a better upside than Pulk when he came into NHL games. He was a playmaker, goal scorer, and his two way game was a bit below average. Not to mention Nyquist is much better in his skating speed.Pulk below average in all those department except his slap shot. Which imo is one of the best Ive seen in the minors. These are the reasons why people are skeptical and have the right to be. Atleast until end of this season.

I vaguely remember you suggest Z retire because he was out of gas during the tampa series. 34 year old captain retire who consistently leads team in points year in and year aside from his twin (pav)? Proven player at all levels but ya turned on him. Pulk hasnt proven himself, if anything being skeptical towards an underexperienced player is more justified than turning on someone because they had one bad playoff series. 5 goals in Pulk 31 games wasnt very promising if I was truly unbiased. But I have hope he can do better with 82 games. Hope, not wild assumption. And ill take a bet with you that if Franzen played healthy this season he puts up more points than Pulk.

I think people fail to see the point here. The one year deal is in the organizations favor. Pulkinnen hasn't had a full NHL season yet. Chances of him playing superstar status and putting up a ton of points are low. He might put up okay numbers. But most likely he won't see the minutes nor put up the numbers that Nyquist did on the top line with Zetterberg or Tatar with Datsyuk. Ergo when his contract is up next year; the organization can basically get him back for a decent deal if they want. If he ends up sucking like a lot of posters here predict; we don't need to pay some crazy amount This is his year to prove it. I think he will do decent but not good enough to warrant a crazy new contract. He's simply not NHL developed quite yet. If it was a two year contract I could see him doing much better in the second season of his contract and then asking for a hefty pay. But with a 1 year contract, it doesn't necessarily favor him.