kickazz

Agreed. I believe Z will as well (maybe not 1 PPG but around .92-.95 PPG or so). Except Z is much more streaky in his production, he goes on mini goal scoring bouts to practically none. His assists tend to be streaky too but they are mildy consistent. Funny thing is, Z has always been that way, even when he was a 30+ goal scorer.

True. But I also dislike our stupid "All I do is win win win" song. It's old, annoying and it's not even epic enough to play and overplay as much as the Joe has. They need to get another more epic win song already.

I don't think Babcock ever said he no longer considers Helm a center

Aye but we have a plethora of centers at this point. Zet, Pav, Weiss, Sheahan, Glendening, Helm. All perm roster spots too. Also losing Andersson on penalty kill doesn't mean babbers can't use someone else. We have plenty of players who can kill penalties. Hell even Franzen was killing em in 2013 (and did pretty well too actually).

Maybe not this season but I can see him being a perm addition sometime next season. Can't forget that Helm's supposed to be back soon. Would love to keep Pukk on roster but can't get ahead of ourselves. Remember what happened last year in playoffs? Our young players basically got shutdown even though they were thriving late in the season. Playoff hockey is a whole diff ball (puck) game. If Pukk should replace anyone on that roster, imo it should be Andersson.

"After last game," he said, "we had a players' only meeting and we just said, 'enough is enough. We've got to go out and play and enjoy playing.' It was like everyone was a little afraid out there." - Zetterberg http://www.freep.com/story/sports/nhl/red-wings/2015/03/15/detroit-red-wings-pittsburgh-penguins/24807125/ Looks like a players only meeting worked. Hopefully they can keep it going.

Didn't get a chance to watch the game. Did Babcock try putting Pav and Z on the same line? I'm wondering if that's something that could help bring energy to the team. Have Shehean center the second one with Cole and Tatar?

1. Who said back issues don't end careers? Where are you getting that from? The point made was concussions affect brain health and have long term effects on cognition. And I specifically mentioned a "hernatied disc" because you were on about Zetterberg I never mentioned anything about a "back injury" as your trying to claim here. That's extremely vague. This was my exact statement "A herniated disk doesn't equate to concussion and brain damage" 2. As a medical doctor you should know that doctor's can only give medical expertise and not breech patient autonomy. A patient has the right to do whatever they feel as long as no harm is coming to anyone else in society. Additionally as a medical doctor you should be able to critically think your way through his concussion history and extended length of time out per injury. This is a pretty bad set back for him. I mean the guy is getting symptoms even after 2 months have passed. That certainly doesn't sound too good. It would be one thing if it wasn't a yearly thing for him. But lately it has been. It may be PCS but that could be a stretch to diagnose. Franzen's a great player with some bad luck. So is Zetterberg. Z could have easily continued to be a great goal scorer if his back injuries didn't slow him down. But no, a herniated disc would never cause me to think someone's career is over lol. Repeated concussions would.

I suggested he retire based on his injury. Meaning a concussion. Concussions are bad. They have long term effects. My point has nothing to do with whether or not he will PROBABLY retire. It's about whether he SHOULD retire. I still stand by my statements. My suggestions come from a medical perspective about a human being repeatedly being concussed not based off "Franzen is injured, who cares, his career is probably over" Don't include me in the Franzen bias. Lol that's pretty silly. Just because you have a concussion or 20 concussions doesn't mean you can't continue to play the sport. It's a matter of whether or not the costs outweigh the benefits for his health. You need to brush up on common medical knowledge if you're a sports fan. A herniated disk doesn't equate to concussion and brain damage. Lol. If the media reports it as a concussion, the conclusions fan are coming up with are based off that. If the media has lied and Franzen did NOT suffer concussions then how is that anyone's fault? We were given a supposed fact and we went with it. On information regarding Concussions and it's different grades : http://www.webmd.com/brain/concussion-traumatic-brain-injury-symptoms-causes-treatments?page=2 Further studies on long term effects of concussions: http://journals.lww.com/neurosurgery/Abstract/2007/08000/LONG_TERM_AND_CUMULATIVE_EFFECTS_OF_SPORTS.13.aspx

^ What's your point? My "quote" still doesn't change that fact that the concussions he's suffered is detrimental to his long term health. That's just common sense you learn in human physiology in high school or college.

I was pretty anti-Howard back when we still had Lidstrom. But after his playoff performance in 2013, I was pretty impressed by Jimmys play, he was def the MVP end of that season and post season. Point is, Jimmy has it in him. He has A LOT of weak points, but he is pretty solid overall. I think Mrazek is the alpha to his omega. Mrazek is strong at things Jimmy is weak at (puck movement, closing off tight gaps when players come around the corner, etc). I believe both of them will complement each other very well and could be a dynamic duo after this season if we let Gus walk. Babcock could easily use Mrazek over Jimmy with certain teams that he believes they need a 3rd defenseman moving the puck around with.

That doesn't relate to anything i mentioned lol. The future has nothing to do with the current season. You're basically making the same point that I made. I'm just saying that there is no need to be excited to have Mrazek at the moment. He's 22 and not at an elite level yet. Let's not assume he's somehow going to do any better than Howard and Gus. The only thing positive coming out of him being called up is puck movement. As far as going from a starter (Howard) who screwed up in Calgary to a backup who let did pretty bad today (Gus), to a 22 year old who will have a "few hiccups" (since he's young) isn't really a quick fix or anything to be excited about for the present time. Weiss' mistakes didnt really help Gus today. The team as whole needs to play tighter and finish the season strong. Doesn't matter who is in net at this point because all three are prone to screwing up in some way. We dont have a Lunquist on this roster. Maybe Mrazek could be in the future, but right now is 2015 and 2015 playoffs looming around.

Idk why you guys think Mrazek is going to do any better than Howard did against Calgary or how Gus did tonight. Have you forgetten that Mrazek too has let in 4-5 goals per game. MULTIPLE times. I think he went on a stretch (3 games in a row?) where he left 4,5 goals in consecutively. Yes I do believe Mrazek is a great goalie but lets not get too excited that he's some elite goalie that's going to save us. The wings have to play tighter in general in order to prevent these massacres from occuring. I am definitely looking forward to Mrazek's puck handling to help the D out in a few games down this stretch tho.

I truly think the Red Wings CAN match up to Boston. They have the potential to play big. Babs has to really drill it in their heads if we do match up with them in playoffs. Problem is i dont think Babs himself is a fan of relying on playing big.

Pav and Z should kill penalties once in a while. I dislike how Babs stopped doing that.

Zetterberg needs to play like he did the last 5 minutes of this game for the rest of the season and playoffs. Weiss needs to get his sh*t together.

Lol havent seen Zetterberg this pissed before. Terrible game.

Meh it doesnt help when ur teammates dont get in open spots. Kronwall finally got open and he passed it and the kronwall shot was good but Svedberg saved it

WOW i miss the days Datysuk and Zetterberg killed penalties. That was domination on a bruins powerplay.

You got me. I concede.

1. I don't think you read the previous posts. Your basically taking bits and pieces and not looking at the entire conversation and trying to pick a debate over something you didn't look at in perspective. I mentioned stats because Kip posed a scenario about how certain posters may consider Smith as the glorified Keith Yandle. I mentioned not only this years stats but previous years stats as well. You went on to mention that I was "enamored" by Marechenko's numbers when nobody even mentioned about his number's.. Where did you come up with that conclusion? The topic is just about whether or not he's useful as a right hander going into playoffs. Stats were mentioned in response to Smith being compared to Keith Yandle. Just in an unbiased-purely looking at numbers-matter-of-fact way. Stats aren't being mentioned to make a claim that Smith is worse than Quincey, Dekeyeser or literally anyone on the D line roster for that matter. The topic is handedness. You need to read previous posts and take things into perspective before you jump the gun bud. 2. Where are you getting this from??? Lol. Please show me a quote where I mentioned "Marchenko isn't playing above his blah blah" 3. Again read original posts. I cannot make it any more simple than that... It was a topic of discussion of WHETHER or not he will, and what his quote to the media meant. I don't pretend to know how a player will develop nor do I pretend to know how the organization will pan out. The only one with knowledge of that is the coaching staff. Until that it's all fanfic. I can't have a discussion with someone making up conclusions on my behalf bud. You're kinda puttin some words in my mouth. Im better off talking about whether or not chris osgood is hall of fame worthy with Kip

1. You basically proved your own first sentence wrong.. You compared Smith's PPG to Marchenko's and then contradicted yourself saying that Marchenko's 13 games is too small of a sample size? Btw who is enamored by that?? I think the only statements that were made were comparing Smith's PPG to current top 6 defensemen and how hes actually producing less than some of the more "defensive minded defensemens I.E Quincy and Dekeyser. So where does Marchenko come into those stats? He's only played 13 games, you can't really make a judgement on his ability to produce at an NHL level. I haven't seen anyone even post about Marchenko's production. The only thing people are speaking about is using his right hand in a strategic sense for puck possession and to avoid having a weakness in the lineup that could be exploited by the opponent I.E lack of more than one right handed Dman. 2. Apparently that's your opinion, not necessarily a fact. You're entitled to it. But I wouldn't jump the gun and say "I doubt he will be better in the future". You don't know what the future holds for either of these players. Did people think Zetterberg could be a top 10 player coming into the league at 7th round draft pick? No they didnt. 13 or so years later hes one of the best players in the world and the captain of the best franchise in the league. Same goes to Datsyuk's situation. 3. And that's where we disagree. Babcocks put in plenty of rookies for other higher paid players in the past. Look at the 2013 season. Additionally, I don't think Smith has a "higher ceiling". He's not THAT much better than Marchenko. You may not believe it but I bet in Smith's own mind he knows to up his game in order to stay in that line up. Even last game, where he played excellent, you could tell he up'd his game. These thoughts go through players heads all the time. Anyone who has played team sports at any level knows the feeling. Competition is an everyday thing in sports. Keep an open mind, I'm sure Smith is too especially when he hears Babcock and Holland praise Marchenko. 4. Just my opinion. see below Kronwall - Marchenko Ericsson - Zidlickey Dekeyser - Quincey You don't think Kronwall is good enough to make Marchenko better? Ok lets say you don't. Then: Kronwall - Ericsson Dekeyser - Zidlickey Quincey - Marchenko

Actually your refutation is flawed because you're claiming that peoples feelings (including yours) towards a player trumps my argument. People's feelings wont change my mind. Statistics will and practicality will. Quiet simply logic will.... Smith has 11 points in 57 games and is -2 and Kindl has 11 points in 33 games and is +1. Almost HALF as many games as Smith. Kyle Quincey has 13 points in 53 games; more PPG than Smith. Does this mean Quincey is superstar Keith Yandle mode and Smith is semi Keith Yandle? He^l Quincey isn't even known for offense! I mean we can even take this to last season and compare Danny Dekeyser to Smith. Dekyser is a defensive minded defensemen yet he tallied more points in less games than your "two way playing stalwart" Smith. You need some legitimate data to claim a hypothesis to be true. Not feelings. Regardless with the above mentioned stats I stick to my opinion on the matter. Marchenko could very well replace one of the left handers if Babcock thinks its viable. At this point the only one I can think of is Smith as the other defenseman (except ericsson) have played pretty well, including Smith. But Kronwall wont be the one to go. Neither will Dekeyser or Quincey pairing. Obviously not Zidlicky. Maybe Ericsson? Doubt that.

I would agree with you only if Smith and Marchenko were miles apart in skills. They arent. Yes Marchenko is a prospect and can learn a lot more. Yes Smith has played pretty well. But B. Smith is not THAT MUCH better than Marchenko. I don't think of Smith as a difference maker on the squad. Don't get me wrong, I don't hate the guy but I dont think losing him would ruin the roster. Additionally it's more practical to have a righty over a lefty in our current situation. If we were talking about Marchenko (righty) and whether he should replace say Kronwall (Lefty) then the obvious thing to say would be.. NO WAY IN HE^L WOULD MARCHENKO REPLACE HIM!!. But that's not the situation. We're comparing an average defenseman (Smith) to a prospect whose surprisingly done well in his 12 games. And I dont think its unfair to assume that the coaching staff is at the very least CONSIDERING the same thing. I.E they MAY be wondering if cutting Smith and putting in Marchenko would slightly help, or slightly hurt us. I mean it's a gamble both ways. Do you only keep 1 righty on your blue line when you're trying to make a deep playoff run. Or do you take the chance with a prospect just so you dont have a weakness that opponent can take advantage of (the weakness being the lack of a right hander on 2 of your 3 D lines). Lack of a right stick on the corners can be an easy weakness to exploit imo.

The reason it's a discussion is because both Holland and Babcock have said a lot of great things about Marchenko and basically stated they like him in the lineup. It's a question of whether or not they like him enough to keep him on there at this point; that point isn't clear and no one can really speculate it either way. Of course everyone is entitled to opinions. I'm not sure if I would jump to the conclusion that Marchenko is #7 quiet yet. Neither Babs not Holland have truly hinted at Marchenko being inferior to Kindl or Smith. They've just spoken positively of him thus far. All we can do is wait and see what happens when Marchenko is healthy again.