kickazz

I think this quote from Nyquist clears up at least part of what happened in that locker room. "He's the one that raises his voice here in the intermission, tells us we're not good enough and he comes out and scores three and I'm assuming he had a couple assists too (just one), I don't know how many points, obviously led the way for us and that's what he does," Nyquist said. "We're lucky to have him." via foxsports: http://www.foxsports.com/detroit/story/zetterberg-s-hat-trick-lifts-red-wings-over-sabres-011815

Zetterberg's 6th career hatrick tied for third best in the Red Wings franchise with Sergei Federov. Number one and two and Yzerman and Shanny. Atta boy Z!

The only person I would pick MAYBE as a captain over Zetterberg is Jonathan Toews. But even that is a stretch. Z is a workhorse and get its done even with a subpar roster. Toews' got a good roster to shine with. Plus Z is more committed to our home city than 99% of the NHL players are to their cities. Shouldn't even be a discussion really.

Ummm 1:17 of the video, the Ref got nailed in the head by webber. Lol.

Haven't seen a thread on this (hope I'm not breaking any rules).. Of course I don't need to say this but just a friendly reminder for everyone to vote for our Red Wings for the all star game! Personally I've throwing a lot of votes for Zetterberg as he is our captain and is one of the most underrated players in the NHL and truly deserves to get a spot after carrying the team for two years straight since Lidstrom departed. I know Z is on a bit of a cold streak, but aside from that he needs more recognition from the league! We all know Pavs already making that roster!

Because they have no legitimate enforcer. Simply said. Yes, the red wings have very skilled players who have speed. But when teams like Ottawa and Boston are out there out hitting your players 2:1 or 3:1 ratio night after night, (and I don't mean small checks, I mean big massive hits), you cant expect them to last long. Perhaps Ken Holland needs to FINALLY invest in some muscle? I cant think of any out there obviously, and Tootoo wasn't much of a success unfortunately.. but it makes you think. How much longer do the players need to get pushed around till someone gets a head or back injury. O wait.. Zetterberg just had a herniated disk....... Datsyuk got concussion symptoms, oh and so did Franzen... There's a reason the Detroit Red Wings are injury prone folks. It's cuz other teams run around and hit em. If there were enforcers, teams would think twice before laying the hits on star players. That's my 2 cents on the situation. Please share!

None of the "fallacies" pointed are relevant to the discussion as I mentioned in OP to discuss the topic. So congratulations you wasted a post. Since you consider yourself a pro-enforcer, perhaps give an input to the discussion? I can easily accuse you of "Red herring" in the thread. Worthless post,, it's supposed to be discussion not granny gran butting in. And you shouldnt commit the fallacy of appealing to authority by stating that "most people on LGW" know their **** because I would disagree seeing as though most people still havent given a reason as to WHY enforcers cant prevent injuries or bring positive aspect to game.

Why are you getting so upset and insulting over an online forum? Relax sean avery. You're refutation has been illogical. My OP said enforcers can put big massive hits. Further i gave example of how Zetterberg's herniated disk is a result of beating he's taken over the course of the season. Star players on average shouldnt be getting hit as much as our team's players do. If we had enforcers they can reduce the amount of bullying the Red Wings players take. Go read the posts made throughout the thread. Take your head out of one dimension and keep an open mind to a debate. Just because I made an OP with an introduction to a topic doesn't mean i wont add further thoughts on the topic. And is ESPECIALLY doesnt mean i can't point out other strengths of having an enforcer. Additionally, since you decided to make it personal (as anyone with clear psychological insecurities does in an online forum debate). I will continue to add further points: Enforcers not only provide protection and prevention from star players getting injured over the course of the season, they can also bring momentum to the team. The Detroit Red Wings are a soft team that still thinks they can manage with puck possession. However, due to the losses of great players over the years, they are no longer the dominant team of the NHL as they once were. Being in a new conference, with new players and lower skillset, they must adjust. Having an enforcer can add to this, it can protect the veteran players from being abused on the ice which leads to long term injuries, i.e injuries such as Herniated Disks that are caused from wear and tear of the spine. Now please, unless you have something relevant to say about hockey instead of mentioning "high school logic" we can continue. I'm sure there are forums online for that kind of nonsense. But this is a hockey forum.

What Red Wings have you been watching? We are no longer the puck possession team we once were. There's a reason why we lost to Ottawa, a team where really on paper we're more skilled than. You want evidence? Go watch the Ottawa games this season. Zetterberg and Datsyuk both shutdown by big bodies. I don't need to find the evidence for you, Mickey Redmond does most of the talking at the games were the euro twins get shutdown by big guys.

Part of my OP: "But when teams like Ottawa and Boston are out there out hitting your players 2:1 or 3:1 ratio night after night, (and I don't mean small checks, I mean big massive hits), you cant expect them to last long." I explicitly mentioned being outhit by massive hits aka quality hits. Darren McCarty was an enforcer and played games and almost all playoff games for the red wings when he won the cup 4 times. Bob Probert was one of the biggest enforcers in NHL history and was a regular season and playoff player for the Red Wings. Hell so was Gordie Howe to a certain extent.

Quiet honestly, i would like to see Franzen and Zetterberg stand up for themselves a bit too. Datsyuk does it on occasion but its uncommon. Steve Yzerman was a hell of a captain. Guy had finesse and would stick up for himself and teammates during a scrum. http://www.sbnation.com/nhl/2013/12/3/5170736/henrik-zetterberg-injury-red-wings-herniated-disc "An MRI revealed an issue similar to the back injuries he sustained in 2008 and 2009, but developed in a different area." He missed 19 games in 2006-07 with an inflamed disc, seven games in 2007-08 with back spasms and sore back, and three in 2008-09 with back spasms. From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20131203/SPORTS0103/312030073#ixzz2nlSc8ysw Not only different areas but different diagnosis.

Wrong. The herniated disk he currently has is not the same area of the spinal column were he was hurt in the past. Unrelated anatomically. It's like comparing your thigh to your knee.

Let me take your own numbers and prove you wrong. Justin Abdelkader has 103 hits in 34 games played this season. He's no where close to being a legitimate enforcer. "Hits" counted on NHL.com don't define the quality of a hit. Simply said, we need an enforcer that protects our smaller guys and retaliates when needed. It's a simple tenant of hockey. Quantity of hits dont mean anything, they register a small check as a hit. Need a quality enforcer. Yes you guys are right that was in the regular season. In any case i do know Lapperierre got owned twice in the same game. I see your point but what im trying to say is: Injuries like Henrik Zetterberg's are due to prolonged stress on the body. If he had some protection he may have lasted longer in the season, not get hit as many times. Now we can't compare a hit like Kronwall's were he was boarded into the glass. That's just one play and bad luck. But with Zetterberg's case, this is an injury caused by additive stress.

Here's wikipedia for you: "Enforcer is an unofficial role in ice hockey. The term is sometimes used synonymously with "fighter", "tough guy", or "goon". An enforcer's job is to deter and respond to dirty or violent play by the opposition. When such play occurs, the enforcer is expected to respond aggressively, by fighting or checking the offender. Enforcers are expected to react particularly harshly to violence against star players or goalies." You seem to be stuck at the idea that it has to be a fighter? Enforcer can do whatever to provide aggression. And i dont mean silly checks that players put at on the way to the puck i mean big open ice hits that send a retaliation message when our star players are hit. Let me put this scenario for you. A. Zetterberg gets hit by Chara. He gets up keeps playing. Next shift: Chara decks Zetterberg again. He continues to get up and keeping going. That's the Red Wings currently. Here's an alternate scenario. B. Zetterberg gets hit (open ice clean hit) by Chara. A good one too. Z gets back up and goes after chara to let him know he's got it too. Obviously Z is not that type of player. Ok perhaps on that SAME shift our "enforcer" that we still need to have on this team, sees Chara hit Zetterberg and goes after Chara to hit him (a good clean hit). Or if Chara's hit was brutal, the enforcer challenges Chara to a fight. We have NEITHER. No clean open ice hitters and no fighters. No enforcer whatsoever. What we did have was this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GE7oh315Rb0 and this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO1uhorF5LA Konstantinov didn't fight nearly as much as players his size did at the time. But he was a well known open ice hitter that alleviated the momentum for the team and/or sent message to the opposing team. Oh and btw when the wings did have these types of players; they won cups.

Actually he took liberties BEFORE. Once Downey stepped in not only did it provide furhter momentum for the Red Wings, but it also sent a message to Colorado. What's so hard for you to understand that? It's high school deductive reasoning...

What's your point? I merely said wings become less prone to being injured and abused with someone, an enforcer, to protect them. Hitting and fighting is part of the game, something the Red Wings have lacked the past half decade which has cost them at many times. Some hits can cause immediate injuries. However, multiple hits over extended periods of time can also cause injuries. If the wings players weren't constantly laid out on ice, which more often than not, they are, perhaps they would last longer throughout the season. It's wear and tear, and when you are outhit every night, it takes a toll on the team. The hits per game can be reduced with an equal oppression against opponent team that allows you to send a message: "Hey don't hit my guy again cause im coming for you" Unlike Ottawas game recently where Zetterberg got abused atleast 3 -4 times open ice. Actually yeah. Herniated Discs can be caused due to prolonged injuries to the spine. Likely, Zetterberg being hit night and day caused wear and tear. Google it, its basic science.

So you go from my claim on hits per game to fighting majors. Cool. Enforcers dont necessarily have to fight they also put aggression towards opponents through hits. And it's a known fact in hockey (if you play, which i feel doubtful seeing your reactions to a basic aspect of hockey; aggression, aka what the sport is KNOWN for) fighting and hits can curve momentum. Hits can send messages to opponents. Hits make people think twice before opponents go after your star players. Hits are a non-verbal way of saying " you hit my guy, i'll hit you and embarrass you." Case and point http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLX3299cVEg Laperriere hit Lidstrom. Downey took revenge. Lappy was a mouse the rest of the series. Wings went on to continue dominating.

The segment with Helm, Abs, Quincey and Smith was one of the most fakest things I've seen on TV. Really? A conversation about Datsyuk? God try to be more original. Obviously it was a set-up conversation. Probably HBO camera guys fed up of not getting crap for coverage and told em to talk about Datsyuk or something. The Alfredsson segment was much better. He was very natural and so were his kids (little goofballs) that's the kind of stuff you want to see. Not fake conversations for the cameras...

Datsyuk came off the injury tho and I would have liked to seen a few words from him. I thought HBO would take advantage of the injured players and have more time with them (Zetterberg for instance). Cmon I want to see behind the scenes stuff about two of the best players in the world! Then again Dats and Zet lack of coverage could be because they're quiet guys in general..

Incredibly let down. Where is the coverage on Datsyuk and Zetterberg? Those are celebrity status players in Detroit... Not Smith, Quincey, Helm. Maybe theyre saving best for last who knows.

This is the kind of crap that happens when the rest of your team does terrible and you have to carry them. The herniated disk can be career ending if he doesn't take good care of it. One of the articles mentioned it was a small one so lets hope he recovers well. Unfortunately just when Z was going back to his old 08 performance days he gets a back issue. However, on the brightest side of things, at least they know what the exact issue is unlike in Helms initial case.

Is this true? I found a Swedish article (translated to English) speculating he is. Not sure if there are any concrete English articles out there.

Well as I said the Swedish article confirms its Zetterberg. For some reason I can't link it here.. (Probly admin block on non-English sources). We'll find out if its true soon enough I guess.

For Pavs standards it was an above average year for him but not a stellar season.

But you're not the coach of the Detroit Red Wings and Babcock is, and he prefers a hard working cleary over a floating filpulla. It's as simple as that.