Nightfall

This is the replay that I saw. As a ref, just seeing that video means that Toronto should have reversed the call. Is it possible that Legace knocked the puck in the net when he reached back for it? Yup. If thats the case, then it is a good goal. I can understand it had to be irrefutable proof. So I can understand how that is a good goal. The Wings have benefited from gifts like this in the past. It would be different if the Wings NEVER got a gift like this. I say quit whining about it. Its hockey people. Sometimes, teams or players do get breaks.

I think you have to be a fan to be a blind homer. You do realize that right?

75% of the LGW forum members would rather have this attitude. I remember back in 2008 when the collective fans were all up in arms about the Wings chances to win the cup. They bitched about certain players, especially Dallas Drake who everyone wanted to sit because he was considered to be a detriment to the team. Then, when the Wings won the cup, everyone in this forum stood and cheered Drake for winning his cup. Everyone had faith when the Wings lifted the cup. 25% of them had faith when the playoff started. This season its even worse because the Wings aren't going to win the Presidents trophy which means that they aren't a favorite. Its easy to jump on the "failwagon" when your team isn't the favorite. I play hockey all the time, and I love being the lower seeded team and winning in the playoffs. My team won a game 2-1 last year against a 2nd ranked team and we were #7. One of the best games I played, but we as a team played an awesome game. Its amazing how when you have an optimistic playoff performing team, how anything is possible.

1. Agree 2. Once again, consistency has nothing to do with playoff success or failure 3. Leighton was a question mark last season, and he led his team to the finals. Halak was also a question mark, and led his team to the conference finals. Look at all the goalies this season who are question marks. Luongo hasn't had a lot of playoff success. Neimi won the cup last season. I think the Sharks have the inside track here. Howard is a question mark. Crawford is a big question mark. Rinne is a question mark. Point is there are no guarantees. Howard could pick it up and carry his team to a stanley cup. Then again he could falter and they be out in the first round. Every team has question marks. 4. Totally agree. Detroits defense is really going to need to step it up. Their goals allowed makes me nervous as well. I just look at the pedigrees of the players on this team and they are all playoff tested stanley cup winning players. Kronwall, Stuart, Rafalski (multi cup winner with the Devils and Wings), and Lidstrom as our top 4? Thats just great, but I do agree they need to improve. 5. Agree I think we can both agree it really just matters if you are a glass half full or half empty kind of person. I am a glass half full guy, and I believe in the Wings just looking at the stats and figures from playoffs past. I can also see how a pessimistic person could look at the stats and think the Wings are doomed. We won't know any of these things until the playoffs are over and we can look at the results and discuss them.

I haven't levied one insult your way since we started having an informed discussion. I haven't been insulted either, so lets focus on the discussion at hand which I really am enjoying. If you got the impression I was insulting you just now, I apologize for that is not my intention. I totally agree with you on your last paragraph. Do I feel the Wings are the favorite in the West? Nope. I still think that Vancouver has the inside track to that. Watching Washington on Center Ice this season has also been enjoyable. Their transformation was like watching Detroit back in 1996 when they had to change from a finesse team to a defensive team. As you said, there is a hell of a playoff class this year. IMHO, anyone can win this year. I could see the Hawks taking 8th spot and getting to the finals again this year. My point is this, the Wings fans can be pessimistic all they want, the fact of the matter is that regular season domination does not lead to a cup. Struggling at the end of the season doesn't mean the Wings are dead and buried. When the playoffs hit, its a new slate and thats the time to grade this team.

No, it doesn't give a fair indiciation that the Wings will or won't be upset. You just don't know until the playoffs hit what is going to happen. Certain players find their grooves when the playoffs arrive. I could point out countless instances of teams who had strong regular season finishes or winning consistantly throughout the regular season only to find themselves out in the first or second round. Once again, the regular season success does not mean your team is going to be successful in winning the cup. Same goes for substandard success in the regular season. Even a 7 or 8 seeded team can win playoff series against top teams. Look at Edmonton back in 2006 when they beat out all the top teams in the Western Conference and then lost to Carolina in the finals. If Roloson wouldn't have gotten hurt, they would have won the cup that year. We could go back and forth on this. Every team has a chance to win. Some players elevate their games to a new level. I firmly believe the Wings will do that this year and make it to the Conference finals. Once again, I ask you, knowing all this information, can you say in your pessimistic heart that the Wings are dead and buried come playoff time?

Take the time to answer my questions that I posed to you and actually read my post to you. I feel I already covered it in that mostly. Heck, I covered it in that post you just picked that one sentence out of. 3 seasons preseason - doesn't matter regular season - get into playoffs, otherwise doesn't matter playoffs - what really matters Washington last season, #1 regular season, out first round. Montreal last season, #8 regular season, conference finals. Philadelphia last season, #7 regular season and needed to win in shootout, cup finals. Coincidence? Luck? No one really knows how far their team is going to make it in the playoffs. Everything is a factor. I just have faith the Wings are going to make a deep run this season. To say they are going out first round or not going to do anything because of bad play now is really no indication of playoff success. If it was, teams who finish on a tear at the end of the season would win the cup every time. The top teams in the league would win the cup every year. Just the fact that the presidents trophy winners only win the cup 25% of the time should be a good indication that anything can happen come playoff time. Now, knowing this information, how can you be so pessimistic? Shouldn't you be a little optimistic or at least wait and see how they do when the playoff start until you bury the Wings?

It really does take an informed hockey fan to know that there are three seasons in hockey... preseason regular season playoffs Just because a team dominates in the preseason doesn't mean that they will have a great regular season or the opposite happens. Just because a team has a difficult portion of the regular season, but still makes the playoffs, doesn't mean that they are going to fail in the playoffs. Look at countless 7 or 8 seeded teams who beat top seeded teams. Montreal last year? Philadelphia who got in on the last shootout of the season last season? They played lazy, but still got in and then made it to the cup finals and the conference finals. How did that happen? Pure luck? The playoffs are all that matters, and in this day and age of parity in the NHL, anyone can win. The Wings are going for a deep run into the playoffs.

I don't mind if someone says something negative about the team, just make it an informed comment or post. I love discussing things like that in detail with people.

He was being sarcastic, as was I when I replied to him.

I have been attacking ignorant posters on this forum for a long time now. In short, if you have a valid point to make about a player, management, or franchise, then speak it. People who post the typical "(insert player name here) sucks" comments are going to get bashed. Those posts really don't bring anything new to the table in terms of a discussion. As for your comment, I do agree with you. If you remember correctly though, the Wings finished strong last season, and still didn't do well in the playoffs. The Hawks sleepwalked through the month of March going 6-7-1 last year and won the cup. Some teams do have strong finishes, like the Pens in 08-09 when they lost 2 games in the month of March and April combined. Still, I don't see much of a reflection on regular season performance over playoff performance. This is why some players seem to come to life and play great in the post season when everything is on the line. I can understand your pessimism, but I just think it isn't well placed. Did you have a great feeling about Detroit last year when they went on that huge tear at the end of the season? Did you think they were going all the way last year because of their finish? What about in 2002 when they played like ass at the end of the season? Finishing on a great end of season note has really no meaning when the playoffs hit. I could name many many teams who wish that were true, like Washington last season when they were knocked out by Montreal after playing so well at the end of the season.

He would have had to rob the Canes 3 more times to make it a zero-zero game. I agree, he came up with good saves, but Cam Ward stole the show. Either that or the Wings couldn't put the puck in the net. Either way, its kinda hard to win a game when you don't score.

Nope. I am one of the people who tries to inject a little meaningful hockey talk into this mess. It increases the entertainment factor by at least 10 points.

How about 2007-08 then when they dropped 10 of 11 straight games. Point is that crap happens in the regular season. The playoffs are a different animal. You should know that by now. The Wings may not go all the way this year, but I forsee a conference finals appearance this year.

I just used the top 6. McCrimmon would be #7. His defense is only blamed every 3-4 games. Howard and the Refs are hourly occurrences.

They did in 2002 when they won 1 game in their last 10 and then lost the first two in the first round of the playoffs. Course, no one remembers that string of s*** performances.

You failed to follow the common LGW blame checklist when it comes to a loss. 1. Howard 2. Refs 3. Franzen 4. Hudler 5. Kindl 6. All of the above

Gesundheit!

Zero against Carolina? Have you been watching the game?

So, the defense was not responsible at all for helping him out? IMHO, you going to roast Howard for that, you have to roast Stuart for not moving his ass over there to help him out too.

I was waiting for the SHUTOUT jinx actually. Been yelling it here at the TV for the last period.

I am waiting for the Wings to sign a goalie who doesn't give up rebounds. I guess I will be waiting for an eternity.

Damn nice goal by Skinner. He deserves the Calder.

Yup, I certainly got it. Wings down 1 goal, Ward going to pitch the shutout. You just might want to turn off the TV the rest of the game. In fact, my recommendation is when the Wings fall 1-0 from here on out, just shut the TV off and concede victory. After all, no one comes back from a 1-0 deficit, especially the Wings.

Game is only half over and you are conceding already? Wow, I must be on letsgowings.com.