gcom007

Not sure Leino's going to be equal to Sammy right away, but in any event, Leino + Sammy sounds better to me. Helm is definitely better than Kopecky, knock on wood. While I very much doubt it, superstition makes me feel like it's going to bite us in the ass just b/c we've railed on him so hard.

I'm actually quite excited. While we're not going to have as strong of a team as we did last year at least on paper, we still have plenty to be positive about with this team. On top of that, the West has really beefed up on a lot of fronts which should make for a much more entertaining regular season and playoffs. Hopefully our D stays tight all season and Osgood stays true to his word and doesn't have a repeat regular season performance. If we can manage that, we'll win a lot of games. And it'll be great to finally see what some of these young kids can do with a full season. I can't wait to have Ericson, Helm and Leino up with the club for the full season. I'm not expecting too much from them, but they'll definitely add a spark and freshness to a team that always seems to just avoid feeling a bit stale. It'll be a good one especially for the West.

This is your second thread today that's based on an extremely loose interpretation of history. You need to stop making this into a bigger deal than it is. You're just throwing punches underwater with no idea even of what you're aiming for. Let it be. Correction: 3rd thread today...

Hardly. I'm not a bandwagon fan by any means and don't ride hype trains. Never have. Hell, I was one of the few people saying chill to pretty much the board on whole about this team through last regular season and especially in regards to Osgood. I'm not throwing in the towel by any means and I think Detroit will be right there. But there's no arguing that in the playoffs this last season, the #2 team in the West is getting stronger while the #1 team in the West is getting weaker. On top of that, Draper, Holmstrom and Maltby are going to be even older. We still could lose Sammy and Hudler. Hollands concerned about Lilja long-term as he's still having issues. I've been saying for days that it's going to hurt us a lot more than we realize losing our scoring depth in Hossa and Sammy as well as possibly Hudler. But what makes it worse now and brought this thread on is who we happened to lose a superstar player to, that being the Blackhawks. They got closer than any other team in the West last year. They're going to be stronger this year, we'll be weaker. Thus is it really so unreasonable to bring the matter up for discussion? I don't think so. I find it far more interesting to discuss than the countless "HOLLAND SIGN LAKDFJKLASFJKLASDFJASF" threads. It's just speculation...just good-spirited conjecture. I don't mean it to be anti-Wings or anti-Holland in any way. I am not pissed at Holland and I haven't made a single post suggesting he screwed up big time and needs to sign every player under the sun. I'm just tossing something else to discuss out there. Simple as that.

They're a young team that did a lot last year and I felt they were poised to continue in this fashion towards a Cup victory in the next five years. I said this awhile ago. Adding Hossa is going to help them a lot in many ways. He'll make them that much stronger offensively and ideally lead the way in improving team defense, leading by example. They would've had a stronger team of skaters making no moves with every bit of experience helping a really young team. They're also likely to be more confident for having gone as far as they did this last year. We may have tossed them around a bit, but how many people thought they'd even be there in the first place? They proved a lot to not only the rest of the league but to themselves. And sure, without a doubt, Huet's going to be the wild card in the equation but I'm not ready to count him out yet. He's not going to have to be great with this offense and don't doubt that the Bowman influence will see them addressing other needs when and where they can be it this off-season or at the deadline. This team that was one of the last two teams standing in the West has a lot going for them heading into next season. Meanwhile the Wings lost Hossa, are likely to lose Sammy and could lose Hudler before all is said and done. We're a weaker team going into next season. If Lilja is a major issue and doesn't play, that's another major hit that's been mostly overlooked thus far. So I'm not so convinced that we'll have the same time we had last year against them. Like I said, this is obviously longshot stuff from this far out, but if we hit the semi's today against them, I think it's going to be a much tougher series.

No, for certain. And the Jagr thing never helped. I'm just saying, in Detroit, it was a total disaster of a career. Once he left, he found his footing and recovered from the years of nosediving in Detroit. While he was never the player some hoped he'd be, he carved a descent career out for himself by the end of it and that happened once he left Detroit.

More on Shanahan's departure incase people missed this originally or don't recall it... freep.com wrote: There's a time when you cast a shadow and a time when the shadow casts you. This, more than anything, is why Brendan Shanahan left the Red Wings on Sunday and signed with the New York Rangers. "It was just a growing instinct," he said via phone from his summer home in Massachusetts. "As great as the future is in Detroit, I think I belonged a little more to its great past." This is not your typical departing-athlete statement, which more often goes: "I had to do what was best for my family." But Shanahan was never a typical athlete. More cerebral than most, more risk-taking than others, Shanahan, in his decade in this city, was keenly aware of the public thermometer. He knew how rare it was to ride a wave of Red Wings fever to three Stanley Cups in six years. And now, at 37, with the local horizon filled less with championships than with melancholy comparisons, he got while the gittin' was good. "I guess I felt my group was leaving, our era is kind of over," he said. "I think it's better to walk out the door than to have it opened for you and, you know" -- he chuckled -- "they grab you by the scruff of the neck and throw you out." This is not Ben Wallace, harpooning big money and leaving behind the teammates who made him special. Shanahan took a one-year, $4-million deal from the Rangers, for the same or even less potential money than the Wings were offering, because he feels he is down to his final seasons and he wants to play them on the ice, not against his shadow. He spoke to Steve Yzerman about it. He spoke to Ken Holland about it. Both conversations, he said, ended not with anger but with them talking about how much they had accomplished together. And while Shanahan no doubt would have made the Wings better next season -- the left wing led them in goals with 40 -- let's be honest. There already were people saying "he's not what he used to be." Or "he can't get it done in the playoffs." Or "he's not worth that much money." In New York, he is a fresh face. In New York, he brings championship experience to a team that hasn't tasted a title since 1994. In New York, he's not the first guy reporters find to ask why his team isn't living up to its usual expectations. Time moves like a river. Players, too. A true power forward "Friends of mine have been telling me the last few days, 'You know, you will always be identified as a Red Wing,' " Shanahan said. "I know that. I'm proud of all we did there." And he likely will be more appreciated the longer he's gone. Shanahan, 15th on the NHL's all-time goal-scoring list, was a big, strong, resilient player in Detroit, blessed with a rare ability to be offensive in more ways than one. He shot, scored, punched and pummeled. He could notch a hat trick with two black eyes. He was crafty. He rose to the occasion. And while his recent postseasons were plagued by the same scoring droughts that shadowed most of the Wings, you never doubted No. 14 was a big-time player. And he always made it clear how he felt about his teammates. He was on your side if you were on his. But people forget that Shanahan played nine seasons before coming to Detroit. He wore a Hartford uniform, a St. Louis uniform and a New Jersey uniform. He knows what it's like to begin again, to take on new expectations. In some ways, he relishes it. Although he and Yzerman became dear friends and a terrific captain/assistant captain combo, there was always a difference between the two. "Steve is like a born son of Detroit," Shanahan said, laughing. "I was like the kid they adopted when I was 12 years old. It was great. I have no complaints. Detroit made me feel so special. They were like, 'We'll pretend you didn't play those nine seasons before you got here.' " But he did. And now he'll play in New York, where his quick wit and media savvy will be put to good use. Shanahan is a curious guy, the type who meets movie directors and winds up doing a cameo in one of their films. Playing and living in the nation's biggest market is no doubt an attraction. And, as he said, when they see his face "with the gray streaks in my hair, they won't say, 'Man, he's getting old.' They'll say, 'That's the new guy. Let's see what he's got.' " I don't think he is big-timing Detroit. He had chances to do that in the past, for bigger money, but he stayed here, believing his core unit had more titles to win. That core unit is dissolving now. The days of Yzerman, Sergei Fedorov, Igor Larionov, Darren McCarty and Dominik Hasek are gone. The future belongs to newer guys, such as Henrik Zetterberg and Pavel Datsyuk. The Red Wings are a franchise in transition. Time moves like a river. Teams, too. The best of times "What will you miss the most about Detroit?" Shanahan was asked Sunday. "It's not so much what I'll miss as what I'll look back on and reminisce about," he said. "All the guys I played with, the interaction with the fans, the faces of people I didn't even know in the stands that I just saw, year after year, in the same seats. I'll miss whoever thought of the idea of playing the Irish jig when I scored -- except Chris Chelios always wanted me to go to center ice and actually DO the dance. ... "I don't know. The championship teams and especially that first year, when we had to take something from Colorado. All of our guys were pretty much looking for their first Stanley Cup. ... It's just amazing to think I was part of the team that was able to do those things. ... "And the bad things as well, like Vladdie (Konstantinov) or what we went through with (Jiri) Fischer last year. That stuff makes you close. Even off the ice, I know when my wife and I go back to pack up the house and put it on the market, it's going to be very emotional. We were married during my time in Detroit. All of our (three) kids were born while I was in Detroit." He stopped. He sighed. There was emotion in his voice, but not regret. More like acceptance. Shanahan, more than most, understands the way the business works. It is part of why he was so effective during the labor stoppage in getting different parties together and helping to reshape the game. He knows glory. He knows defeat. And he knows that all players eventually reach that bracing moment when they face a hook: Either they hang their skates on it, or they are given it by management. He didn't want that happening in Detroit. He leaves with a good decade behind him, locked and laminated. It's the smart play, maybe as positive an ending as he was going to get as a Wing. Detroit has lost three major stars in the past week. Each had his own story. Yzerman was canonized. Wallace was jeered. Brendan Shanahan, when the smoke clears, will be appreciated -- and missed. You can be happy that he has found a team for his closing chapters, or you can be angry that he didn't make it Detroit. But he didn't leave spitting. He didn't wave a bundle of cash from the train. He spent a lot of time on the ice over the years anticipating a pass or a punch, and when he anticipated his end here, he saw more shadows than light. He made a choice. And he's right about one thing. An era has passed. Time moves like a river. Ours is called the Detroit. And his, now, is called the Hudson. Contact MITCH ALBOM at 313-223-4581 or malbom@freepress.com. Catch "The Mitch Albom Show" 5-7 p.m. weekdays on WJR-AM (760). Also catch "Monday Sports Albom" 7-8 p.m. Mondays on WJR. www.freep.com/mitch

Tough to count Shanahan if you ask me. The guy's on the tail end of his career. He didn't leave because the Wings were falling apart and he saw a better opportunity to win elsewhere. He left out of respect for the fact that the Wings were changing and he wasn't a part of the future. He knows he's on the way out and he had his eyes on a future job for the NHL. Heading to New York was a decision that had more to do with his career after hockey and the simple fact that he's an east coast guy off the ice. You can't knock a guy for winding down in his own way and furthermore, I give the guy a lot of credit for not hanging on to the Wings any longer than he did. I think the decision shows a lot of integrity, wisdom and respect for the organization. I was always a big Shanahan fan and it was tough as a fan to see him go and Yzerman go as well, but as the emotions settled and I read more about the decision, it made a lot of sense to me and my respect for him went up even further. There are a few guys under contract still now that I kinda wish had the same idea...

Yeah, I would say it's more like Primeau's career appeared once he left Detroit. He struggled immensely here to get going and always had the whole Jagr thing hanging over his head. Once dealt, he found some calm and became a steady leader and pretty descent player.

I agree about Kozlov and Federov, but gaining Knuble helps a lot. He's a real solid guy to have around and will probably be a better leader than Kozlov or Federov in terms of providing that veteran calming influence. I don't think they're done or will be done come deadline day. I think they'll add guys and plug up some holes and then you've got to wonder. Again, look how close they came to beating Pittsburgh this year. They would've taken care of Carolina and then they're in the Cup against the Wings. Too bad it didn't happen. We probably would've won...but anyways, I think they're closer than people are giving them credit for.

I am not sold on Boston. In my mind, I think "Sharks of the East." Something just doesn't feel right with them. Detroit will likely have a shot as they're still a real solid team, but it's not the given it was this last year especially if we lose Sammy and Huds. And if Lils is a long-term issue and doesn't play...time will tell how they bounce back, but like I said, I don't have the same confidence I've felt for the last few years going into this season. If we keep Sammy and Hudler and Lils is back at 100%, I'll have that confidence back. But right now, it's not there. Not saying it's out of the question at all, just saying, we're losing pieces, other teams are gaining pieces. Our divisions going to be tougher which could make for more difficult early rounds. Again though, Lilja. I don't like the fact that Holland's worried about the situation. He's become a bigger part of our D than many realized. That was a huge loss for the playoffs and will be a bigger loss over the course of a season.

Remember what he added in Pittsburgh? And I was saying over a month ago in the series that they'd win a Cup in the next 5 years. I think they just pushed things up a bit with the Hossa acquisition. And I'm not thinking they're winning this year. Maybe the year after if they pull off a cap miracle... And my guts telling me watch out for Washington. They'll keep addressing needs. How close were they to beating the Stanley Cup finalists this last year? Real close. And are they a better team with Knuble? Absolutely.

Well, I'd say that's certainly the big "if" for Chicago. Their defense isn't hte best for certain, but they've got a hell of a lot of firepower to combat that issue now. Will Huet have to be as good as Bulin with Chicago's offense plus Hossa? Probably not. I've never been big on Huet, but if he can keep things somewhat tight, Chicago's going to win a lot of games based on their offense.

I don't know...sure, there's questions, but at this point I think every team has questions. In the east I think it's pretty easy to think it will be between Pittsburgh and Washington. The West is a bit more of a crapshoot. While it's easy to suggest that the Sharks will blow it again, heaven knows when they decide to shock the world and actually do something in the playoffs. They've got the talent. The Ducks could be in the thick of things again. The Wings will still be there. Edmonton will be interesting to watch if they land Heatley and now with Bulin. Flames look set to stay strong. But the Hawks are still right there in the thick of it. They proved a lot this last year and they're only going to be better with the experience and Hossa and anything else they manage to pull off. I trust that Bowman's influence is heavily at play here and the guy knows how to put a winner together. You think about that and you think about the guys they've had and now Hossa...this is clearly going to be a better team and a more confident team. They know they can go a ways in the playoffs now and they're only better. And as I've been saying for awhile, I'm expecting Hossa to be a big force in next years playoffs. He's got it in him despite what many fickle people say here. Time will tell in the West, but after today, I really think Chicago's as good of a bet as anyone at this point to head to the Finals in the West. I still think they've got to get that far and lose before they learn how to win, but I think they've got a good shot of making it this year.

He got dealt to the floundering Whalers and "he was good" is really relative. Coffey was on the tail end of a long career and even suggested that he'd retire if traded. Fans might not have been thrilled at the thought of losing Coffey, but the second Shanahan was introduced as a Wing in a game the night of the trade, they instantly forgot.

And Paul Coffey was 90 when he left, wasn't he? His career was already over. This thread is absurd.

Ummm, Hossa's been a superstar player for awhile now. His one season for the Wings was par for the course for him and not even his best. Nice try though.

They might also know Hossa at $5.2 million for life won't be the hardest thing to deal away either. Sure, the term is long, but the cap price is right. The Wings might've been able to do this deal if it was next year. A $5.2 million cap hit for a guy like Hossa is still an absolute steal. I don't know what Chicago's going to do in the next few years though...it'll be an interesting situation to watch.

The Hawks have Scotty Bowman in the decision making process. They got Hossa at a great price. You're out of your mind. Hossa is officially profoundly overrated at LGW. This will hurt us next year. A great Hawks team just got a hell of a lot stronger. Hossa's a defensively responsible veteran who works his ass off and is taking a discount to be with a team longrun and ideally be successful. That's a great thing for this young Hawks team to have to look up to. They may be the team to beat this year in the West.

Yeah, LGW > Scotty Bowman when it comes to putting together a hockey team. Oh wait... I'm no Kopecky fan, but I fear and respect Bowman and he's in the thick of this Chicago madness. Out of respect, I trust that he knows what he's doing. And that scares me.

Wow. And yes. I've been saying "Scotty Bowman" since the Hossa to Chicago rumor first took off.

No, not really.

This makes my stomach turn a little bit as I said numerous times during the Western semis that I wouldn't be shocked to see Chicago win a Cup in the next 5 years. They were a great team before that was only getting better and gaining a guy like Hossa is huge. And again, Scotty Bowman...

Scotty Bowman.

Grow up.