Dabura

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Everything posted by Dabura

  1. Dabura

    Official 2018 Off Season *Rebuild* Thread

    LUKE WITKOWSKI 1ST LINE WINGER LET'S GO JAGR IGINLA BILL RANFORD RAY WHITNEY PTO RECLAMATION PROJECTS LET'S GO LET'S MAKE SURE WE HAVE A REAL GOOD SUMMER HERE LET'S GO
  2. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    Right. Would probably cost a bit more than #6 + #30/31 (in this hypothetical scenario), but yeah. I'd say Svechnikov is widely considered the #2 player in this draft class -- BUT, there's no shortage of people who feel Zadina is the superior player, and it does seem like the people who love him really, really love him. He is, perhaps, the more viscerally exciting player; he gets people's HYPE! juices flowing maybe a little more than Svechnikov does. I wouldn't say "Svechnikov wouldn't fill an organization hole. Zadina would." But I guess I can see where the Wings are coming from, maybe. Svechnikov is kinda-sorta like Mantha, Pacioretty -- kind of low-key dominant. Zadina? He's more of an Oshie, Pastrnak, Hall. High-octane. Gritty, hard-nosed, aggressive, flashy. Absolutely lethal shooter. Can stickhandle in a phone booth. Surprisingly good two-way game for someone with his sniper skillz. *shrug*
  3. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    My understanding is that the talk is based on reporting by Craig Custance and Khan : Red Wings open to moving down from No. 6 slot, plus draft combine tidbits [Craig Custance, The Athletic, 5/30] Paywalls r dumb. Red Wing willing to trade No. 6 pick in NHL draft: report [NHL.com, 5/30] The Detroit Red Wings are willing to trade the No. 6 pick in the 2018 NHL Draft, general manager Ken Holland told The Athletic on Wednesday. "I'm open to possibly move," Holland said. [ . . . . ] "I've started to talk to some teams about a lot," Holland said. "As you work your way toward Dallas at the draft, draft movement possibilities, I think at this stage in the game, everybody is kicking tires as to what might be out there." [ . . . . ] "If somebody on your list starts to slide, then you start to work the phone," Holland said. "We like a lot of players in that range, in that 30-35 range. We think there's some pretty good players. Do you package two of those picks and try to move up? Possibly, if somebody high on our lists starts to slide and starts to fall." Detroit Red Wings trying to move up in draft [Ansar Khan, MLive.com, 6/2] The Detroit Red Wings have the sixth pick in the June 22 draft, their highest selection since 1990. But it might not be high enough to suit them. A couple of the players they covet, right wing Filip Zadina and defenseman Evan Bouchard, might be off the board. That's why the Red Wings are trying to move up the draft, to as high as No. 3, a league source said. Will Detroit Red Wings make pitch for Ilya Kovalchuk? [Ansar Khan, MLive.com, 6/4] Red Wings will try to move up in draft Q: Do the Wings plan to look for a lot of trade-up opportunities at the draft and use extra picks to move up? – Tom A: They will try. They would like to move up to No. 3 for a shot at right wing Filip Zadina or No. 4 or 5 to get defenseman Evan Bouchard. If they do trade up or down it would happen during the draft on June 21 and of course depend on what transpires ahead of them. What would it take to move up? At minimum, in addition to swapping the No. 6 pick, the Red Wings surely would need to relinquish their other first-round selection (30 or 31, depending on whether Vegas wins the Stanley Cup) or one of their second-round picks (No. 33 or 36). ___________ Bonus: Petrella's Pre-Lottery Look at the Red Wings' Options [Clark Rasmussen, DetroitHockey.Net, 4/20] For what it’s worth, the Wings seem to be leaning Zadina, who The Athletic named as the one guy they’d go off-script to grab, if given the chance. More on that later. [ . . . . ] Craig Custance had a really great article on The Athletic a few weeks ago. In it, he identified a pool of eight players that, even in the worst-case scenario where the Wings move down to 8th, one or more will be available for selection. They are the same eight players listed above (before discussing Wahlstrom and Veleno). Custance also mentions that Svechnikov and Tkachuk don’t fit any organizational need. And then there’s this tidbit: “The Red Wings like both players but the crucial need is on defense and it would be hard to pass on a potential top pair defenseman for another winger in the system. The one exception would be Filip Zadina. The organization is well aware they need a game-breaker to compete with the best teams in what’s becoming a one-goal league. Zadina is that guy.” ___________ A couple of days ago I said I doubt the Wings are truly serious about moving up to 3. But where's there smoke, there's usually fire -- and there does seem to be smoke here. Maybe Holland feels it might not actually take a king's ransom to move up to 3. "In what world would it not cost a king's ransom?" Maybe no one's willing to pay out the ass for that pick and so Bergevin could be willing to settle for a smaller return. If Bergevin wants a player he fully expects to be available at 6, then he should trade back. He can tell GMs he won't trade the pick for anything less than a king's ransom, but if he wants to get something (anything?) out of the situation, he might have to settle for a return that we might actually be ok with paying. Let's say Bergevin wants Kotkaniemi. He could get Kotkaniemi + a king's ransom...but maybe he couldn't actually get that ransom, because maybe no one's actually willing to pay that price. So he could be looking at two options: A) Kotkaniemi or B) Kotkaniemi + pretty good haul.
  4. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    I'm sorry to hear that. Best wishes.
  5. Dabura

    Official 2018 Off Season *Rebuild* Thread

    Should've hired Hossa instead of Andersson. It's a mistake Kenny will never live down.
  6. Dabura

    2018 NHL Stanley Cup Playoffs Thread

    I heart Las Vegas.
  7. Dabura

    Official 2018 Off Season *Rebuild* Thread

    Hakan Andersson is lazy and he sucks.
  8. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    "So you're a left-shot forward." "yeh" "You sure about that?" "Um, pretty su--" "THEN EXPLAIN THIS!" [whips out an old polaroid pic of the player where he's holding his stick like a righty] "How did you get that p--" "I'M ASKING THE QUESTIONS HERE, BUCKO!"
  9. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    Here's the piece reporting the Zadina thing, just so we're all on the same page: http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/2018/06/detroit_red_wings_trying_to_mo.html#incart_river_index Personally? I doubt we're really serious about moving up to 3. Like @krsmith17 said, it would be way too high a price to pay. And we'd be paying [insert way-to-steep price] to the frking Habs. Frk that noise, man. To me, the bigger "story" here is that Khan has again named Bouchard, Dobson, Kotkaniemi.
  10. Dabura

    Rumors Thread

    Thx for the quotage. I was gonna pull some select quotes, but there's a lot of good stuff there and it would've been hard to narrow it down to just a few. Plus, I'm lazy. This interests me as a Wings fan because the Wings and Canucks are basically in the same position now re: their respective rebuilds and needs, and the Lottery Gods basically gave them equal treatment this time around. 6th and 7th overall are good spots to be picking, but -- and Friedman touches on this a bit -- I guess you could make the case that the odds of a 6th or 7th overall selection becoming the kind of player the Wings and Canucks desperately need aren't actually all that great. Maybe it makes sense to swap Hughes/Boqvist/Bouchard/Dobson for a more proven talent. Two years from now, those four prospects will be breaking into the NHL (assuming they make it there at all), and it'll be another few years before they really get their feet underneath them. Hanifin already has three years of NHL experience and he's shown improvement each season and could be right on the verge of really breaking out. If we're really keen on Kotkaniemi, maybe we could use one or two of those pieces in your Faulk proposal to instead help us move up from 30th/31st and grab him.
  11. Dabura

    Rumors Thread

    Friedman expands on Hanifin-Canucks trade notion [Chris Nichols, FRS Hockey]
  12. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    Sorry, the correct response is "You forgot Poland Pulkkinen." -9,000 points Gryffindor.
  13. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    Bouchard and Dobson talking to the media at the scouting combine: https://www.nhl.com/redwings/video/nhl-combine--bouchard/t-277443416/c-60517503 https://www.nhl.com/redwings/video/nhl-combine--dobson/t-277437404/c-60517603
  14. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    Be that as it may, we need an affirmative action program for right-shooting forwards.
  15. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    I've harped on this before, but, again, it really is kind of nuts. The deficiency, I mean. It's to the point now where I'm wondering if there's a philosophical/strategic reason behind it. Frk, Vanek, Brunner, Alfredsson, Glendening, Witkowski. Those are the recent right-shooting forwards I can think of off the top of my head. That's it. And all of them -- with maybe one or two exceptions -- were/are specialists, as opposed to really solid players you could really count on to play big minutes in tough situations and such. I remember Babcock talking about how important he thought it was to have left-shooting defensemen playing the left side and right-shooting defensemen playing the right side. And I remember joking to myself that when Holland traded for Zidlicky, Holland called Babcock and said, "THERE. YOU FINALLY HAVE YOUR DAMN RIGHT-HANDED DEFENSEMAN. YOU HAPPY NOW? YOU PROUD OF YOURSELF? THE THINGS I DO TO MAKE YOU HAPPY. ALL I DO IS GIVE AND ALL YOU DO IS TAKE."
  16. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    Depends. Which hand has it gotten completely out of, left or right?
  17. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    There's also the possibility that the Wings identify a player that they want very badly and Holland determines, via the magic of Working the Phones on the Draft Floor, that this player is going to be available at 9th or 10th or whatever. Or there's the other possibility that the Wings identify a player that they want very badly and it's someone we wouldn't expect. We're all assuming the Wings are obsessing over the very same pool of names we're obsessing over, but maybe they're not.
  18. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    All good responses, some tasty food for thought. I like @LeftWinger's idea of getting two of the Rangers' three 1sts, including #9. I guess for this kind of thing to work, it wouldn't be enough for the Wings to be "whatevz" about who they take with that first pick -- the trade partner would have to be of the opposite mentality, i.e. they feel [x player] is much more desirable than [other players] and they like him so much that they're willing to pay a price to get him. I dunno that any of the teams in the 7ish-10ish range will be That Team, but the Rangers did trade up in last year's draft to get Lias Andersson and paid a pretty steep price for the privilege. That doesn't necessarily have any bearing on this draft, but at the very least it's a precedent. I doubt we could get a Stepan-caliber player from any of the potential trade partners, but getting #9 + #26/28 and still being able to draft one of Hughes, Boqvist, Bouchard, Dobson could be more than good enough. Maybe. I also like Edmonton as a potential trade partner, if only because Chiarelli is Chiarelli. Klefbom, anyone? Yamamoto?
  19. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    So I was thinking. What if the Wings are more-or-less equally fond of Hughes, Boqvist, Bouchard, Dobson, Wahlstrom? What if they don't have their collective heart set on any one of them? I mean, I'm sure they'll come to a general agreement on what their specific preferences are, but what I'm wondering is if they'd value getting their first or second preference more than they'd value the potential return they could get for trading back three or four or five spots.
  20. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    Right?? I think it was Holland who said this draft is, for the Wings, basically two drafts in one. I like that way of looking at it. I just hope he and his draft team don't take a single pick for granted.
  21. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    Never got to see him, sadly. Like you, I'm really intrigued by him. Seems like there should be more buzz around him than there is, yeah? Put up pretty good numbers for a 17-year-old 1C on a weak team. Decent size. Shoots right. I've read he's a tireless worker all over the ice (plays that 200-foot game) and he can be electric with the puck on his stick. With that kind of profile, you'd expect him to be taken before 30th/31st overall. But maybe the lack of buzz in the media speaks to a lack of buzz among amateur scouts and their respective NHL organizations -- i.e. maybe he's available at 30th or 31st, or maybe even the top of the 2nd round. I'd thought for sure Brandon Carlo would go in the 1st round (2015), but he ended up being selected 37th. Seems there's a Carlo or two or three every year...and this is an unusually deep draft.... (*fingers crossed for multiple sleeper gems falling to the Wings next month*)
  22. Dabura

    2018 NHL Stanley Cup Playoffs Thread

    I am all about this SCF matchup.
  23. Dabura

    Official 2018 NHL Amateur Entry Draft Discussion Thread

    I would say Dobson has the more mature, robust two-way/all-around game but isn't as naturally gifted in the areas that Bouchard is. But Dobson's bigger and is the better skater. *shrug* I give Bouchard the edge because where people have concerns about Bouchard's skating, I have concerns about Dobson's ability to drive possession and create offense and put up points at the NHL level -- and where skating is something that can be improved upon, you can't really teach the natural gifts that Bouchard offers. Honestly tho, it's a coin flip. Depends on what you value most in a high-end Wings defense prospect in the year 2018. That's exactly how I think of him -- Larkin, if Larkin were a defenseman. And significantly smaller.
  24. Dabura

    Official 2018 Off Season *Rebuild* Thread

    Oh, definitely. Didn't mean to imply that that's the only way I'd be ok with your proposed deals. I firmly believe that Larkin and Mantha have the potential to become good enough NHLers that your proposed deals would look like steals in a year or two. I get where you're coming from and I don't fully disagree with you. I guess what it comes down to, for me, is that I'm wary of handing RFAs really long-term deals unless it's an absolute no-brainer. Personally, I don't think it's an absolute no-brainer here. Larkin's had one good season as a kinda-sorta 1C, and even then he failed to hit 20 goals. Mantha's coming off an overall solid season and he seems poised to really break out next season, but I think four years is the longest I'd go with the term. It's definitely possible -- perhaps even likely -- that a bridge deal ends up biting us in the ass, but I'd rather force him to prove himself and "leave no doubt" than give him a huge deal when he hasn't even hit 20 goals or 50 points in a seaon. (Though, to be fair, he's only played one full season.) We've got to be careful with RFAs. We've got to be careful with precedents. Also worth considering: While Larkin and Mantha are the current jewels in our youth movement crown, we have 21(+) picks across two deep drafts. It's entirely possible that we come away from those drafts with several Larkin/Mantha-caliber players. All of a sudden, Larkin and Mantha might not be quite so important and we might have several new young players who will need to Get Paid in a few years. If the Jets are The New Model, we need to find multiple Mantha-tier players (forwards and defensemen). Lockout to the rescue!
  25. Dabura

    Official 2018 Off Season *Rebuild* Thread

    I feel kinda dumb and dirty for taking the position I'm taking, because I'm basically walking back all that HYPE! I was feeling re: the way Larkin and Mantha were producing early in the season. (Then again, my opinions about everything Wings-related change with the wind.) To be clear: It's not that I don't still believe in their potential. I totally do. I'm just not 100% sold on Larkin being a player we need to lock up for eight years this summer and I'm not 100% sold on Mantha being a player we need to lock up for four-to-six years this summer. I get that it could be a risk worth taking, because if they do become top-tier players then those long-term deals would look brilliant. But will they become top-tier players? I'm not 100% convinced at this time. Mantha couldn't keep up his early-season pace and he finished with 24 goals and 24 assists. By post-Lidstrom Wings standards that's really good, especially for someone under the age of 25. But I don't think it's enough to justify five or six years. Maybe four. With Larkin, it's more just the body of work. Had a great rookie season playing mostly on Zetterberg's wing, then he struggled mightily in his sophomore season, then he took a huge step forward this season. While I'm all about the statement he made this season, I need to see him truly crush it in a demanding top-line role for at least a full season. As it is, David Pastrnak (the guy I wanted us to take with that 2014 1st-round pick, FWIW) is a pretty good comparable and he got $6.6M x 6. thx! That distinction probably explains why I have it mixed up in my head.