Dabura

Wanted to add something to this: Zone Entries and the Red Wings [Winging It In Motown] So, again, something as seemingly small as Andersson playing a greatly elevated role for a game or two due to injuries - that alone was, perhaps, the difference between the Pens and Bruins in the first round. Point being, again, it's easy to say the glass is half-empty for the Wings and that they're barely a playoff team in the weak East. But I personally believe that's selling the team - and its architect - short.

It's mid-August. News is slow. Happy Kevin Hayes Day, NHL [Ryan Lambert, Puck Daddy] I've talked up Hayes a couple times on these boards. Kid is good. Very good. I assume Kenny will make a push for him, but, well, Dan Cleary. Calgary does seem to be the logical front-runner. Where do you think he ends up?

frank, you were there this past season. The injuries were a nightmare. They won't be that bad this season. Don't say they will, because there's no way they can be. There's absolutely no way. I say that as a hockey fan, a sports fan, not just a Wings fan. Do you know what a slightly healthier season and/or fewer boneheaded mistakes from Kyle Quincey and/or better luck in the shootout means? Well, for one thing, one more point in the standings gets us the Penguins in the first round. (We ended the regular season tied with the Jackets in terms of points.) I remember very cleary - we wanted the Pens, because we knew we stacked up well against them (even without Zetterberg and Ericsson), and the Pens fans didn't want the Wings, because they knew the Wings stacked up well against the Pens (even with Crosby and Malkin and Neal and Kunitz and The Mighty Matt Niskanen and Future Hall of Famer Brooks Orpik). The Pens were let off the hook and given the Jackets. Because of a tiebreaker rule. Because Johan Franzen and Joakim Andersson spent time as our top center and our heart-and-soul leader had surgery and...Jared Cowen*. (*Don't say we need an enforcer.) Seven more points? We're even with ZOMG CUP CONTENDERS THE MONTREAL CANADIENS. Eight more points? We're even with ZOMG 2015 EASTERN CONFERENCE CHAMPIONS THE TAMPA BAY LIGHTNING. The Flyers? They finished a whopping one point ahead of us. The Rangers, who went to the Stanley Cup Finals? They finished a whopping two points ahead of the Flyers, three points ahead of us. Look, I get it. We're the Red Wings and the Red Wings are Cup-or-bust, no excuses. But this is our first real protracted dose of Adversity in two decades, and we're still right there, knocking on the door. It's really easy to say the glass is half-empty for the Wings, I know this better than most here. I registered here in 2004 and I've been complaining ever since. I could make - and have made, countless times - a really compelling case for why Ken Holland should be fired. But, at the end of the day? If I'm being honest and objective? If I'm looking at what I think is the bigger picture, the bigger plan? I give Ken Holland credit. I think he's doing the right thing, for the most part. If any GM in this league has earned the benefit of the doubt, it's probably Holland. He knows success. Chicago and Los Angeles win two Cups and everyone's talking like they're the greatest teams imaginable. The Wings were contenders for longer than some of the people on these boards have been alive. We came soul-crushingly close to winning back-to-back Cups in '09. We probably should've won it all in '07. We beat the Ducks and had the aforementioned Blackhawks on the ropes in 2013. We have three or four years to win one last Cup for Datsyuk. With Zetterberg, Kronwall, Franzen, Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan, Jurco, Mantha, Pulkkinen, Athanasiou, Sproul, et al. in the system, I'm liking our chances. I'm not just saying that. I think about this stuff every day. I obsess over this stuff. I definitely have my problems with Ken Holland's decision-making. I definitely have my concerns. I definitely don't like seeing the Wings as anything short of serious contenders. But in due time we're going to be looking back on all this and laughing. I believe that.

Ha! I knew you'd respond! I've been low on sleep the past couple days and as result I haven't been communicating my ideas very well. The Kings had a very strong foundation set in 2009; most of the key players on the Cup team were already there on the night of that Lidstrom game. About Kopitar specifically - I remember thinking at some point in late 2009 (around the time of this game, actually) that he looked a lot like a younger, bigger Zetterberg. Everyone knew he was special. And, hell, I'm actually one of those people who hates when people say the Kings won the Cup as an 8th seed and so all you have to do is get into the dance and anything can happen. But - and maybe this doesn't apply to Kings fans - I don't remember many people saying, "The Kings willl be dynasty-good in a few years," back in 2009. That's all I was really saying. As for our prospects - I'm no professional scout or expert judge of talent or Hockey Insider, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night like to think I know my Wings prospects. Not puffing my chest, just saying I don't get all my learnin' from Hockey's Future. I really, truly believe we can be a contender in two or three years, if we play our cards the right way. *sigh*

(Remember the Kings circa 2009? Five years ago? How many people thought they'd be winning their second Cup in three years in 2014, with this then-fresh-faced Anze Kopitar kid leading the way? Food for thought.)

(There was some talk about the Kings, I think it was this thread. Well, FWIW, they're showing the Lidstrom 1,000 points game on the NHL Network. 2009, home game, against the Kings.)

Well, in the long run...

I know, right?

Straw man argument. I'm not saying every prospect will turn out in a great way. I'm saying I believe we have what we need to complement the existing core and win one more Cup with Datsyuk. Beyond that, it's truly anyone's guess.

He officially won't be signing with Chicago: http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2014/08/15/blackhawks-address-hayes-free-agency-will-receive-2015-second-rounder/ They'll receive a second-round pick in next year's draft as compensation.

In that entry, Malik also notes: It makes sense, since we roll three scoring lines, one of which is sheltered.

I'm with you on this, 100%. I'm just saying: if we're talking about Lidstrom being a guy you can't replace and that fact meaning the entire team had to be re-evaluated and whatnot...I think Holland's done what he should've done, which is focus on the farm instead of becoming Paul Holmgren. Not that it's "draft and develop or become Paul Holmgren." But you know what I'm saying. I think Holland's walked a pretty fine line between trying to make immediate improvements and trying to re-stock mostly empty cupboards. I normally don't put much stock in futures, but I'm very, very high on what we have in the pipeline, largely because I think our player development is second-to-none.

TSN 1200 reports that Ken Holland's considering giving a try-out deal to Daniel Alfredsson [Malik]

Zetterberg Datsyuk Hayes JUST SAIYAN

We have issues in all three zones, but definitely the d-zone - specifically, our breakouts - is where we're hurting the most. The best defense is never having to play defense, which means never being hemmed in your end, which means being able to get the puck up and out efficiently and precisely. Which means smart, responsible wingers; a balanced mix of righties and lefties; and - above all - mobile, puck-moving defensemen who do good things with the puck. That's why we'd want a Mike Green: he might not be great at defending, but you're going to be spending less time in your end with him on your team. Plus, he's a threat in the o-zone, another thing we're lacking on the back end. I urge everyone to 1) read Justin Bourne and also 2) check out SBNation, a stats-heavy dealy where you get can find in-depth stuff like, for example, Leaving The Zone With Possession: Which Leafs Forwards Struggled, Excelled?

I dunno, harold. I think over the course of this five year drought we've always been a couple key pieces away from seriously competing for the Cup. At the same time, our prospect cupboards were empty, and the brain trust has done a really good job of re-stocking. Right now we have one of the better prospect pools in the league, and I think we're still just a couple key pieces away from being a serious contender, because we still have Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Kronwall, Franzen. I think that's rebuilding on the fly. Over the course of a few years you remain competitive, maybe trying for a UFA home run here and there - but the focus is on keeping the competitive core while building up a solid stable of very promising young players that will hopefully complement that core and one day take over. Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan, Jurco have broken through, Smith and DeKeyser should take big steps forward this season, and we're also looking at four or five very good D prospects waiting in the wings, Anthony Mantha being no more than a year away, and our goalie of the future spending his final season as a Griffin. I (want to) believe Ken Holland has been doing what he's been doing for good reason and that the past few years of "futility" are going to pay off in a big way.

I'm ok with this.

I agree. ...But, at the same time, I have to wonder if there's really much of a conflict there in the first place. Nyquist and Tatar and Sheahan and Jurco are all NHL players, and of those four, only Jurco's at risk of being sent down for any amount of time. Beyond those four, what other pretty-clearly-ready-to-make-a-big-difference-with-the-big-club young forwards do we have in the system? Personally, I'd say Pulkkinen, but I could also make a strong case for keeping him on the farm for another season. Of course, even then (him being a Griffin for another season), we're almost sure to see more of him as a Wing this coming season than we saw of him this past season (hello injuries, and hello having organizational depth so that injuries aren't the kiss of death), so he's going to get his looks. Beyond Pulkkinen, I guess there's Callahan and Ferraro, but I dunno that there's a crying need for either of them if our team is healthy. Mantha? We don't really know yet. Maybe he has a legendary camp, maybe (more likely) he shows he isn't ready. I feel it's essentially the same situation on the blue line. Ouellet is pretty solid and Marchenko had a remarkable season. I think those two are the top candidates for graduation and I imagine that's what's going to happen - by the end of the season, they'll be regulars, or maybe one will be traded (as they're somewhat similar players and we'll likely be looking to make a big trade this season). Beyond them? Personally, I feel Sproul is the most promising, but I could make a strong case for him spending another season as a Griffin. I feel we have someone special in Backman, but I don't know that he's really ready to face NHL forwards every night and look good doing it. Jensen's an option, but he missed time and development because of his shoulder. I do think Mrazek probably should've been promoted. But with Gustavsson back in the fold, we have three solid options instead of just two. That's injury insurance at the most important position in hockey. I'm ok with that. So, moves like re-signing Cleary and Quincey weren't strokes of genius and will keep a couple kids down. But I can't make a list of "Kids Who Are Totally Getting Shafted." All I can really think of is Jurco, and even he might never see the farm again.

Kronwall's arguably our most important player, IMHO.

This is a good piece: Core Values: Henrik Zetterberg at center of transitioning Red Wings [Chris Peters, CBSSports.com]

Exactly. It's cool having someone else make your argument for you!

This.

Thought this was worth pointing out: How Mike Vernon set the stage for Patrick Roy's trade from Montreal [sBNation.com] Adds a neat little wrinkle to the Wings-Avs rivalry.

Seriously, frank?

Agreed. I sort of think of it in terms of marriage and parenthood. The Wings of the 90s and early 2000s were a bachelor who was basically beholden to no one. Then that bachelor got married and became a father. Now he has certain responsibilities. Now every move he makes has to be born of a series of careful considerations. Would he like to spend every weekend with hookers? Maybe. Could he spend every weekend with hookers? Maybe. But, really, he can't. He shouldn't. Because he'd be a bad husband and father. Everything would fall apart. If it were up to Ken Holland, he'd spend as much of Mike Ilitch's money as he could. Were it up to Ken Holland, he'd trade all his draft picks for all-star acquisitions. Were it up to Ken Holland, there'd be no cap, and we'd have a dynamite team every single season, like back in the 90s and early 2000s. But none of that's doable in the cap era. Every consideration is complex. Every draft pick matters. Realistically, every penny that can be pinched, is pinched. One wrong move can wreck your team - and organization (The All-Important Bottom Line) - for years. At the end of the day, the Wings were a juggernaut for two straight decades. The cap and our empty prospect cupboards started to catch up with us, and Kenny decided to switch to a retooling plan, the idea being that we tread water for a few years in exchange for another ten years or more of contention. And even then, he's never been fully resigned to simply treading water, because he's gone for Suter, Parise, Edler, Niskanen, et al. I've given him s*** for that for the past couple of years, saying he's a hypocrite and whatnot. But I think all he really wants is to see the Wings win the Cup as soon as possible, same as us. Key thing is, though, he has to be responsible. He has to take a long view of things, has to know when to exercise restraint. He has to do what's best for the club in the long run and in the big picture. I have to give him a lot of credit. Were it me, I'd probably be more like Paul Holmgren, wheeling and dealing but never really getting his team anywhere, and, actually, probably hurting them more than he's helping them.