Dabura

Clearly you haven't done your homework. As I said (thanks for reading), Hossa has been good ever since his rookie season. As I also said, the proof is in his playoff numbers, which are every bit as good as Datsyuk's -- and Datsyuk's had the luxury of playing on the Wings his entire career. And even then, he's still had disappointing showings. Point being, it goes both ways; if there are concerns about Hossa, there are concerns about Datsyuk. Of course, for those of us who prefer not to talk out of our asses about such things, we know neither of them is a question mark going into this season. It's not a stretch to say Hossa could become this team's #1 forward.

About the same level play for about half a million fewer dollars at a time when the team's pushing the cap limit and there's a logjam on the blue line.

Not to sound like a hater, but if Lilja's assets are as valuable to this team as people claim they are, he wouldn't be staring down the barrel of a training camp battle.

Hossa is not a question mark; he's consistently put up solid numbers throughout his career and is currently both an elite offensive threat and one of the best two-way forwards in the game, right up there with Zetterberg and Datsyuk. The guy got a ******* hat trick against this Wings team as a Thrasher and was a royal pain in the ass in the SCF. Anyone who wants to give him a hard time about his playoff record needs to put down that cup-o-Haterade and look at Datsyuk's playoff record. And seriously, the Hull comparison is garbage.

It will be tough. Winning the Cup is tough. The Wings are in excellent shape, though, and they should repeat. The Stars and Sharks are their biggest threats. The Habs haven't done anything in the playoffs for ages and are coming off being owned by a depleted Flyers team (LOL!) The Pens' best player against the Wings in the SCF is now playing for the Wings. Life is good.

Sammy is one of the best bargains in the league. Helm would not be an adequate replacement and Leino's not even a lock to make the team (actually, neither's Helm for that matter).

Interesting. I didn't expect Babs to make some of those moves. But the logic is pretty obvious.

The argument can be made that it wasn't "fair" (obviously I'm not terribly fond of this word) to pretty much every Wing whose status with the team is even a little uncertain. Hossa takes up a roster spot (which will never be forfeited via healthy scratching, a la Drake) and 7.4 million. I'm sure that has some guys a little worried about their individual situations. As for Lilja, I'll ask my question again: how is shipping Lebda and Sammy any more "fair" than moving Lilja? Yes, I know, it would feel wrong -- but so would telling Lebda and Sammy to take a walk. Lebda's about as good as Lilja and he only make 650. Sammy's more valuable than either of those and is also a better bargain. Lilja would get more ice time on any other team in the league. Besides, Lilja is, apparently, a "viking warrior" and Kenny's the best GM in the NHL. They'd both survive -- somehow, some way!

...and they get blown away by the Wings. As opposed to just getting owned. Like I said, I expect them to come out of the East again. To me, it's almost a given. The question is, how do they stack up against the Wings? And I think to myself, "OK. Marian Hossa was one of three, maybe two Pens who actually bothered showing up in the SCF. He was pretty much a royal pain in the ass. Now the Wings (virtually the same roster that just won the Cup) have him and the Pens don't. Malone wasn't exactly a force, but he made his presence felt here and there. Satan and Fedo? Unequivocal downgrade." But like I also said, adding Gaborik would really help.

He was a difference-maker in the postseason, arguably their best player. You take him out of the SCF series and the Wings win much more easily.

Again, how is shipping Lebda and Sammy (the next "best" option in terms of addressing the cap and roster space issues) any more "right" than moving Lilja? I'm not saying I like sign & trades, but this is an uncomfortable situation to begin with, so the solution will need to be a "lesser evil" kind of thing. Let's not forget: adding Hossa wasn't terribly "fair" to everyone, but Kenny still pulled the trigger on the deal.

No, it's not. It's the postseason I care about, and they haven't done damage there in ages. Bottom line, they're getting the attention they're getting because the East has all of two good teams: them and the Pens. The Pens just lost big and seem to have dug something of a hole for themselves this offseason, so naturally the spotlight is now on the Habs. Which is fine if we're just talking about the East. But being a serious contender means stacking up well against the best in your own conference and the best in the other conference. Frankly, I don't think they stack up well against any of the West's big 3. Both the Wings and Stars would play a stifling defensive game and expose the Habs' holes on the blue line, as well as Price's inexperience. The Sharks can match the Habs' fast, flashy style, and they have an edge in the physical department and between the pipes.

The Wings-Yankees comparison is outdated, and referencing another Detroit sports team is just lame. The Habs have done nothing to prove they're a serious contender. This, don't forget, is the same team that had its collective ass handed to it by a depleted Flyers team, which then went on to have its collective ass handed to it by the Pens, who then went on to have their collective ass handed to them by the Wings. Putting the Habs at #2 might as well be affirmative action; they'll need Sundin, a revelatory run from Price, and a lot of luck before even thinking about winning it all. People can blabber on and on about Crosby and Malkin and "learning from the loss" and "needing to lose before winning" until the cows come home, but the bottom line is this: right now, the Pens are looking to be an inferior version of last season's team, even with their "hard lessons" learned. They're going to miss Hossa and Malone; their defense is still shallow; and anyone with half a brain can tell there's tension behind the scenes. Furthermore, Crosby's going to have to start playing the PK, which should take a toll on him -- both physically and mentally. Having said all this, I expect them to come out of the East this season. Landing Gaborik would go a long way in helping the cause. With the addition of Blake, Boyle and Todd McLellan, the Sharks are looking to be a more defensive-minded team -- which is what they need to be. But in the battle for the #2 spot in the West, I give the edge to the Stars, who've been playing a solid defense-first game for a little while now and have crafted an identity around it. This could be a shaky transitional season for the Sharks, which, in theory, would be good for them in the long run, but maybe not so great in the short run. We'll see. I'd take them over the Pens in a best-of-seven. I'm not sure the Pens even know what defense is, even after that clinic the Wings put on. The Stars are, in my opinion, the biggest threat to the Wings' quest for a repeat. If a team is going to beat the Wings in a best-of-seven, they'll need to play the kind of game the Stars play -- that is, a grinding defensive game. Their downfall last season was a lack firepower on offense. They haven't addressed this issue (yet), which is a bit puzzling. Still, I expect them to finish second in the West. And just to keep up the theme of East-bashing: they'd beat the Pens or Habs.

LetsGoXenophobia.com

My point was two-fold: 1) It's not necessarily "worse" if we're talking in terms of fairness and 2) Kenny wouldn't lose any sleep over it. To expand on the former, I'll echo what I said before: Lebda is arguably just as good as Lilja and makes less than him, and Sammy is one of the best bargains in the league (i.e., a third-line checker who has been asked to bust his ass and overachieve on the secondary scoring unit while being paid in, relatively speaking, peanuts). So, what, you're going to tell those two to take a walk so Andreas Lilja can stay? I don't see how that's any more fair than moving Lilja for the good of the team -- and hell, possibly for the good of his career. If Lilja is as valuable as some people are saying he is, then it stands to reason that he deserves more ice time, which he would undoubtedly get on pretty much any other club in the NHL.

And we're anti-enforcer. Don't forget that part.

The Sharks worry me a bit more, but honestly, that's rooted mostly in past matchups. In the here and now, if a team is going to take down this Wings team in a best-of-seven series, it will need to play a grinding defensive game -- and play it really, really well. This Stars team is, I think, better equipped to play that kind of game than this Sharks team is. The past few seasons, the Sharks have favored a pretty wide-open, end-to-end game without the foundation of a strong identity/system. Todd McLellan will help instill a stronger commitment to defense, but I think the Sharks are still going to favor that wide-open style -- i.e., skating fast, hitting hard, and getting to pucks first. With the emergence of Mule and the addition of Hossa, the Wings top-6 looks to be much more imposing than the one that faced the Sharks (and still beat them) in 06-07. Size, strength, speed, snarl, scoring prowess -- it's all there. And if the Wings can impose their will on this sharks team and, through puck-possession, make the series a defense-oriented one, the Wings have the definite edge there -- and it's not one that'll just magically crumble if Joe Thornton decides to start running our D, not with Kronner and Stuart laying fools out.

And moving Lebda and Sammy over Lilja would be more fair? Lebda's arguably just as good as Lilja, but plays for only 650. Sammy has overachieved -- in regards to his pay and his projected potential -- every step of the way. As has been said, Lilja was signed primarily as an insurance policy. Now that Stuart has been locked up (and Hossa has signed, and Chelios will be back, and Quincey will probably be back, and there are cap issues, and there's a logjam on the back end) Lilja is a prime candidate for shipping. It's not tremendously fair, but Kenny's done much worse.

swiss_fan, What are you smoking?

Familial dynamic and a commitment to winning.

Calm your ass down, Chris. I never said Hossa should replace Lilja on the PK. My point was that adding a guy like Hossa will help the PK effort -- and that's regardless of whether Lilja goes or stays. Moreover, no one is hiding behind the salary issue. I like Lilja, never had much of a problem with him. But, as eva has been pointing out (apparently to no avail, sadly), money is an issue, as is the availability of roster spots. Chelios will be returning, as will, from the looks of things, Quincey. That would give the Wings a couple dozen roster players and would, in a best-case scenario, put them over the cap by about half a million. That will leave Kenny with a couple options: 1. Lose Lilja 2. Lose Lebda and a forward If Lebda gets moved, the team's in the cap clear by only about 150k -- too close for comfort. That would necessitate cutting a forward free in addition to axing Lebda. In light of this, it would be better to move Lilja. He's not so much better than Lebda that this should cause the kind of righteous indignation that I'm seeing from some posters. Lilja is not much more valuable than Lebda, if more valuable at all. Certainly not enough to justify the price tag difference. Then you factor in the youngsters waiting eagerly in the wings, one of which could one day be a first-pairing guy in this league, hopefully with this team. Like I said, I don't really have a problem with Lilja -- but considering these points, it wouldn't exactly break my heart to see him go.

That too. Kudos.

Things change with time, often times in unexpected ways. It's a fact of life. You think Kenny was counting on Hossa's agent calling him up and saying, "Hossa wants in for one year and 7.4?" Losing Lilja will help this team's financial situation and will not hurt the team in any painfully obvious ways. ("Why are we losing?" "Obviously 'cause Lilja isn't here anymore!") Yes, it would be something like a sign and trade, and yes, we'd lose his PK minutes. But as eva has explained quite well, it's a cost-benefit matter, and Lilja, in a logical world, is on the losing end of that stick; he would not be a substantial subtraction, especially considering the fact that all three of the logjam guys are capable of stepping into the lineup. Additionally, Hossa is capable of playing on the PK. I don't call him one of the five best two-way forwards in the game for nothing.

I'm sorry, but saying the Sharks are pretenders and the 'hawks are a serious threat is just silly. Bottom line: when you look at the hierarchy in the West, it's the Wings at the top and the Sharks and Stars battling it out for #2 status (although one could argue the Stars are the clear #2, having soundly beaten the Sharks this past postseason). The Blackhawks haven't made the playoffs in years. All they've done is play the Wings hard for a couple straight seasons. I expect the Central to be competitive this season, and I expect that to take a toll on all of the teams in the Central. No more of this "We'll save up our energy for when we play the Wings. We know we're not gonna make the playoffs anyway, so we can afford to put in an honest effort for only, like, 8 games out of 82."

I'm going to echo eva again. Lilja is not considerably better than any of the guys he's competing with, yet his paycheck outclasses theirs. The team currently has a logjam on the back end and a less-than-desirable cap situation. These problems would be solved by shipping Lilja and using the cash saved to retain the other guys. Lebda may not be infinitely better than Lilja, but he gets the job done for 650. Meech has a good package. I like Quincey's size and the potential he showed in his postseason stint. Ericsson has great size and bona fide top-4 potential within this organization, and he could probably step into the lineup this season and do alright for himself. Lilja should go.