joshy207

Wow. No. Not in reality, not in NHL '13. That's a TERRIBLE return for New Jersey. Lamiorello isn't brain-dead.

I'll agree, the major problems have been lack of postseason scoring and soft defense. Those have been the problems since 2009, but Holland's done little to nothing to address those issues.

You say how under-rated the Wings forwards are, then the things you say in defense are "ifs" and "shoulds"... Yeah, IF Nyquist and/or Brunner contribute, that's a big help, and some (not all) of those players you listed SHOULD hit 20 goals... Franzen, Zetterberg, Datsyuk (had 19 last year but missed 12 games), Filppula, if they stay healthy, should hit 20, but I don't see any of them hitting 30. MAYBE Franzen, if he finds motivation. I think if one of Bertuzzi (14 last year), Cleary (only 12 but played hurt), or Samuelsson (14, missed a third of the season) gets close to 20, that'll be a big bonus. 13-16 for each is more likely. The top 6 lacks a consistent goal-scoring threat, someone who can hit 40 regularly, and of the top 7 forwards, Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Franzen, Filppula, Samuelsson, Bertuzzi, and Cleary, only ONE (Filppula) is younger than 31, and he's 28. Most have battled injuries to one degree or another over the last couple years. Hudler (28) is gone, Nyquist (23) and Brunner (26) are unproven, and all of the others are either not top-6 quality or not ready for regular NHL duty (or there just isn't room for them). Almost every other team in the league has younger forwards leading their charge. The Wings have some enticing prospects, but they can't be counted on to pick up the torch if the current leaders fall off drastically. The Wings' forward group isn't bad if everything goes right and if they all stay healthy. But all it takes is a couple guys not producing, or Datsyuk or Zetterberg to get hurt, and things go badly.

Egads, that's a recipe for disaster... Filppula would struggle to get over 50 points on that line... no way Franzen and Helm can play together, total contrast in style. Helm won't get the puck to Franzen nearly enough and Franzen won't work nearly hard enough to keep up with Helm... and Bertuzzi isn't getting paid over $2M to play on the 4th line. I think he'll see most of his minutes with Datsyuk again. Also, I think Abdelkader is more effective on the wing, but he seems to have been anointed 4th line center by Holland and Babcock (for now).

The Rangers wouldn't trade Girardi to Columbus for RICK NASH, what makes you think they'd trade him for any of the Wings' players? And if they did, I'd have to believe they'd be looking for Kronwall in the return package.

I like Hannan. He's 33, but can play 20 minutes a night, kill penalties, block shots, and he's decent in his own end of the ice, which is more than we can say collectively for last year's group. With no real defense prospects on the horizon, he could be worth a 2- or 3-year deal in the $2M-plus range. I also wouldn't mind taking a chance on Cam Barker, if he's healthy. He'd be the kind of guy, if still available in September, you sign to a cheap deal or bring in on a tryout. If he works out, you can waive Kindl; if not, you waive or don't sign Barker. At 26, Barker is 10 months older than Kindl, so he's still on the younger side of things.

And now it's neither Doan NOR Semin. Semin to Carolina, 1 yr, $7M, and per Aaron Ward on Twitter, the Wings are out of the chase for Doan because the asking price is too high. Sweeeet.

Don't forget Kronwall, he's signed through 2019, when he'll be 38.

Modano didn't have "it" when he played here 2 years ago. He didn't have "it" his last 2 seasons in Dallas, that's why they stuck him on the 4th line. He had half a season to "get it going" and couldn't. He's been washed up for 4-5 years, who in their right mind thinks he has anything left to offer? Mike Modano WAS a great hockey player, one of the best in the league during his time. But his time is over, and has been for some time. It needs to stay that way.

If by "many" you mean 2, then you're correct. As of right now, there are 2 teams (Boston and Minneosta) within $800K of the projected cap for next season. Everyone else has at least $3M in available space. 23 teams have about $7M or more. Granted, that does not take into account Weber's offer sheet or any RFAs that still need to be signed. But my point is, most teams have at least *some* room. Also, part of the NHL's proposal is a 22% rollback to all salaries. The cap in the initial proposal is 24% lower than it is today. So, with the exception of Boston, all teams would be OK if this were to pass. ***NOTE: I don't think the owners' proposal will, or even should, pass as it stands. But they'll get the players to lower their share of revenues, and they'll get a corresponding rollback in salaries to keep everything proportionate. I don't foresee teams having to dump players to get under the new cap. I will agree, though, that it is still too early to pass final judgement on Holland's offseason. There are still trades and free agents available. But he's off to a bad start...

No. No. No. Last July, Holland didn't like what he saw going on with the available free agent crop, so he waited for 2012, when Suter, Parise, and a LOT more guys were going to be UFAs. Well, what happened? Most of the quality players re-signed with their teams during the season, so the 2012 free agent pool ended up being very shallow after the top 2 players. And we all know what happened with them. Next year will just be more of the same. Holland needs to find the right moves and act NOW.

Goaltending is about the last thing you can blame for the Wings losing the series. -The Wings were absolutely atrocious in their own zone. Turned the puck over way too much and couldn't cover anyone in front of the net. Howard had no chance on half the Predators' goals. -The Wings' forwards were just as bad. They couldn't score in a house of ill repute with a truck full of $100s. They wouldn't go to the net to create in-tight scoring chances or battle for rebounds. They were smaller and slower than Nashville, and it showed, bigtime. -The Predators were so motivated for that series. That team was built to beat Detroit. They succeeded. That may as well have been their Stanley Cup, because Phoenix walked all over them as easily as they walked all over us. -The Wings appeared to not be motivated at all. Missing Helm was a part of that. Nobody else brings his energy. How many games in the regular season was Helm's line the team's best? (The answer is WAY TOO MANY!) But another part of that is, I get the sense that these players know they'll be here year after year, they aren't traded away, they are re-signed as long as they fit under the cap, and they aren't really forced out the door until it's painfully obvious they need to retire. If they don't win the Cup, a series, whatever, they think, oh, it's ok, we'll be back next year. There's no price to pay for underachieving, and that's what drives me crazy.

I think the owners are fully prepared to do what the NBA did, and lock the players out for the first 2-3 months of the season if they need to. I think their first CBA proposal was over the top, but it's just that, a first proposal. Ideally the new CBA shouldn't be a whole lot different than the current one, a few tweaks here and there and a slight reduction of the players' share of the revenue, and boom, it's back to the ice. But the owners will hold out until they get their way, or at least as close to it as they feel they can get. The players should "win" this one, but I don't know how they really can.... it could get ugly.

Your first sentence is where we differ. I think, while the teams have always been good enough to make the playoffs, they haven't been real Cup contenders. I think that shows in some stretches, where the Wings can't score goals despite firing 40+ shots at the goalie. Their style of play is great for the regular season, but everyone knows the playoffs are a different brand of hockey, and most years, the Wings just don't have that game in them. Too many shots from the perimeter, not enough driving the net, not enough ugly goals, and they don't change their style or play with any desperation until it's too late (see Anaheim 2003, Nashville 2012, and a few in between). Yes, an 8 seed beat a 6 seed this year, but both teams had the right mix of players, coaching, goaltending, and health to win. A lot of the games were ugly. I just don't see this Wings team having the right players to win the Cup as they stand right now. And, while I will admit I am not a Holland fan, I'll tell anyone who asks that this offseason is far from over, he has plenty of time to make trades and sign free agents to improve the roster.

Please go back and re-read what I wrote word-for-word. I said THE FRANCHISE EXPECTS TO COMPETE FOR STANLEY CUPS EVERY YEAR. That is something Ken Holland says all the time. I don't say that, nor do I think they're going to win every year. Besides, missing the playoffs once every 5 years or so gives you a chance to reload with better draft picks while still giving you plenty of opportunities in the postseason. One big thing Detroit lacks right now is young players who are major contributors.

Couldn't agree more!!! This can be said for people on both sides of the argument. You mean both the defenses that just played for the Stanley Cup? Granted, neither are standout D corps and Detroit's isn't terrible, but both NJ's and LA's are solid. Not true. While it is the longest ACTIVE streak in the North American Big 4 pro sports, it is only tied for 5th in NHL history and tied for 6th overall, behind Boston Bruins (29 years), Chicago Blackhawks (28), St Louis Blues (25), Montreal Canadiens (22), Syracuse Nationals/Philadelphia 76ers (22), and tied with Montreal and Portland TrailBlazers at 21 straight years. (via Wikipedia) As someone already stated, White spent most of the season paired with Lidstrom. Most of these players would have had at least similar seasons, if not better, than White's. He was not the same without Lidstrom. And Cam Fowler is what, 20? When's the last time Detroit had a defenseman good enough to play in the NHL at that young age?? Since he didn't have to do anything to have the team make the playoffs again. Question is, is just making the playoffs good enough for a franchise that says they expect to comepte for the Cup EVERY YEAR? Is it good enough for you? And whose fault is it that they didn't have anyone tradeable in 2010? Certainly not mine... not yours... it is Ken Holland's. That's a pretty easy statement to make when there's no way to prove it right or wrong... That first sentence is an outdated cliche. Every organization scouts Canada, the US, and Europe/Russia thoroughly. Gone are the days of slipping Pavel Datsyuk through the cracks because nobody else saw him playing in his third-tier league. Long gone are the days of drafting Nick Lidstrom and Sergei Fedorov anywhere outside the top 5 because you weren't sure you could get them to come to the NHL. Detroit was a pioneer in Europe, but the rest of the league has followed. And every team produces late-round gems, not just Detroit. Actually, if you compare every team's draft history over the last 15-20 years, Detroit's does not really stand out, there are a handful of teams I'd put as equal or better in the scouting/drafting/developing department. And yes, the Wings' organization treats the players VERY well... they're generally sheltered from the media and public, the Wings were one of the first teams to fly a private plane, and there are a lot of little perks we don't get to see. But that falls largely on Ilitch, it's his organizational policy, not Holland's. Holland is a benefactor of that policy himself, being a former minor-league player turned scout turned GM. He's been a part of the organization since 1983. He's just following along the company line. My biggest issue with "keeping homegrown talent" is that, despite obvious shortcomings in some postseasons, the same players are kept around year after year after year. Holland has said (and I don't know where to find the quote, so I'll paraphrase) that he "doesn't believe in trading away assets. Once you get them, you hang on to them." Well, sometimes those assets underachieve when they're being counted on the most. Sometimes trading away one asset (for equal value in return) can inject new life into the rest of the remaining players, as they may decide they don't want to be traded away too, so maybe they better pick it up. Just because you have a recipe that works, doesn't mean you don't tinker with that recipe a little, including removing an ingredient and replacing it with something different. Because right now, I think the Wings' core is very, very complacent, and that's not a good thing in my opinion.

Holland was relatively inactive last offseason, citing the lack of quality free agents and the high prices of those who were available, and was holding off on spending big until this summer, when the UFA class was much better. Well, look what happened... most of the top pending UFAs re-signed during the season. We were left with two big players, both of whom Holland just missed out on getting. Now he's likely saving for next off-season, but who knows what players will actually be available?

Solid, solid signing. This will be the best move of the off-season, no matter what else they do.

IMO, the Wings can't afford to give up the first-round picks it would cost to sign Weber.

Maybe he hopes defensemen will be distracted by how disproportionately ENORMOUS his face is. Way too big for his head!

1. Why sign ANOTHER 35+ guy to a multi-year deal? Especially if health is a concern. 2. Why a no-trade clause????? Enough with these already! (Although, Holland doesn't realize you can actually trade players on your active roster.) 3. Why 3 million dollars per year????????? This guy is on the decline and should not get a raise over his last contract! 4. Why Mikael Fing Samuelsson?????????? I'm assuming this either means the Wings are going all-in for Nash and will need players like Samuelsson to fill roster spots because they're going to gut the roster, or they aren't getting Parise, Semin, or anyone else of any quality at all. Also, I bet this buries Nyquist at Grand Rapids for the year. This is so stupid. I didn't expect much today, but I didn't think I'd get pissed off, either.

See what the summer and first part of next season bring. He's probably the Wings' most desirable roster player in a trade scenario. This team can't stay the same forever...

I think this off-season will go very far in defining Ken Holland as a GM. It will show whether his inactivity at the last 2 trade deadlines and last summer were smart move (saving cap and roster space for a big free agent push this summer) or if he lacks the ability or desire to make necessary changes to the makeup of his club in order to stay competitive. I've been pretty critical of Holland's moves (or more specifically, lack thereof) when it appears the Wings are stale and in need of a wakeup call. I feel he's hung on to some players for too long (Chelios, Maltby, Holmstrom, and now Bertuzzi) at the expense of critical NHL development time for some of the younger players, I think he lets prospects sit in Grand Rapids for too long--Brendan Smith should have been with the Wings for most, if not all, of last season and basically been Nick Lidstrom's shadow, playing with him in all situations (what better way to learn??), and I can't take him seriously when he says he expects his team to compete for the Stanley Cup every year, but there are no repercussions for players who woefully underperform when the team falls short (i.e., nobody "essential" gets traded away, which sends a message to all remaining players). I can't give credit to Holland (as GM) for the '97 or '98 Cups, as he was in the process of being handed that team just as they reached the top of the league. The '98 team was on a mission after the limo accident. The '02 Cup, he'll get credit, but he had Ilitch's open bank vault and fit the right pieces into place. The '08 Cup and '09 final, that's all him. 21 straight playoff appearances is very impressive. But the last 4 Cup champs were teams that missed the playoffs in the first season after the lockout, and 3 of the 4 Conference finalists this year missed the playoffs that season. Those teams have had better chances to restock their systems with higher draft picks. In my opinion, Holland cannot afford to miss out on the best players available, whether it's through free agency or trade. Time for change, time for improvement.

If a team moves, it's still the same franchise. The Browns were a special circumstance, the NFL allowed Cleveland to retain the name, logo, colors, history, etc. when the "new" Browns returned to the league.

Guys like Helm aren't uncommon, but he fits so well here, it'd take a lot for me to trade him. I'd say he's the 3rd most important forward behind Datsyuk and Zetterberg. He drives the bottom 2 lines, as already stated. Miller was useless without him late in the season, and Helm's line was the Wings' best on a lot of nights (far too many, really). I would have Franzen out the door before I could hang up the phone if I was in charge, though...