Echolalia

I'm confused by the title of the thread, are we comparing Hudler when he was a Wing to Tatar? Cuz last season Hudler put up like 76 points, which I would say is definitely better than anything Tatar has done in the NHL. But if we're going with just their time as a wing, I feel like Tatar is more involved in the play, more noticeable, and doesn't seem to care that he's the smallest guy on the ice, which is refreshing to see in anyone. As far as points go, they're kinda in the same area, although Tatar's sample size is only two seasons, and he could easily become a more reliable scorer than Hudler was here. So I think Tatar has/will have more of an impact here than Hudler did.

That may be my favorite goal of all time. Top shelf, far-side backhand from the perimeter of the zone. Just filthy. To add to that, Datsyuk's backhand shot may be the best I've ever seen, and it probably goes unnoticed or is underrated cuz Dats is generally known for his playmaking and stickhandling.

The problem i see with Pulkinen isn't that I don't think he has the potential to be a solid goal scorer (I do). I'm concerned that he may not get a sufficient opportunity to develop his skills at the NHL level. When Pulkkinen isn't scoring, there really isn't much else he brings to the table, and with the Wings' roster saturated with forwards, if Pulkinen isn't helping the team out, someone else will take his spot and do their thing instead. Jurco is a big body that can be effective on the forecheck and in the corners. Anderson and Miller and Glendening are all solid defensive players who can eat up minutes and kill penalties. Maybe Callahan can bring energy to the game every night and provide a little sandpaper in front of the net and along the boards. Maybe Ferraro decides he liked playing in the NHL and keeps improving to hold onto that job. There are a lot of guys who can help the Wings out in a lot of different ways, and many of these guys have found at least one thing they can do on a nightly basis at an effective level. Pulkkinen's niche was goalscorer and he hasn't been able to translate to the NHL yet. The question is how long will Blashill keep Pulkkinen in the lineup to try to adapt that aspect of his game (and provide very little else in the meantime) and hold someone else out of the lineup who could potentially be a bigger help to the Wings in some other aspect of the game? I don't know the answer to that. Maybe Blashill is willing to be very patient with him and keep someone else scratched for the potential long-term investment, or maybe Pulkkinen learns to be a solid two-way guy or penalty killer to round his game out a bit and give Blash another reason to keep dressing him. At least it looks like Datsyuk won't be in the lineup to start the season, and who knows what's going on with Franzen, and there's sure to be an obligatory injury or two to someone else, so at the start of the season I think Pulkkinen will see ice time. But if he doesn't find a niche he can be effective in by the time people start getting healthy again we might see him scratched out of the lineup before he has a chance to become that right-handed sniper we've been wanting to see on the squad.

do we get compensated for each person who leaves the organization, or is that limited to certain roles?

I just found out I'm doing a surgery rotation with Alex Delvechio's grandson lol (for real). I don't know how closely he follows hockey.

I mean... Yeah. But owners are businessmen first and foremost. And none of them would be billionaires with hockey teams if they played the generosity card and didn't fight for every penny. It's a bummer that the city was dealing with this, especially during the whole bankruptcy fiasco, but it's not at all unexpected.

I don't see anyone getting moved. Holland will take the team into training camp over the roster limit, and a couple injuries will happen and then all of a sudden nobody needs to be moved. Then by the time these injured players recover, a few more go down to LTIR. It seems to happen every year.

I was thinking more along the lines of the mathematical def of irrational, ie pi, square root of 2, etc

Are there any rules against irrational numbers? Serious question

I'm not giving up on the guy. And I certainly hope and expect that he will improve with time. But what I said is 100% applicable to the case. His claim to fame is being an elite sniper in the AHL. That hasn't happened at all in the NHL. And what he really has going against him is that unfortunately he doesn't bring anything else to the table if hes not scoring. So he can either round out his game a bit and become a more complete player, or he can continue to bang his head against the wall until he becomes an elite NHL goal scorer. Both will take time, particularly the second option, and no coach will dedicate a spot in the lineup for very long for him to try and improve if he's not contributing in some way. So from how I'm seeing things, Pulkkinen is in a hard spot right now, and it's even tougher because Holland likes to have 30 forwards on the team competing for a handful of spots. And a lot of those guys can provide at least something on a night to night basis, which right now is more than what Pulkkinen can do.

I mean, until he's actually able to rip off his canon of a shot in the NHL, I think he's technically a zero trick pony.

Yeah, I think a few years back there was a conception that arbitration equals player, agent, and GM are butting heads and it's a power play, but I think I recall Holland saying its a routine process and it's for the best for all groups because it kind of encourages both sides to prioritize getting a deal done instead of putting it off. I tried looking for the exact quote but if I'm not making it all up then it was from a few years ago I think... Maybe someone else remembers this?

I just don't think a deal is on the horizon. Even with the overflow of players and the lack of NHL roster spots for them all. We've been down this road a couple times in the past and LGW (myself included) have expected a trade because we have more players than roster spots. Then we hit training camp and a couple players get injured. They go to LTIR and suddenly no one needs to be moved. Eventually those guys get healthy but then a couple more guys are injured, and it turns into an LTIR ferris wheel and Holland never ends up having to address the issue of too many players. He's a man who values depth for exactly this reason, and I suspect this year will be similar.

I don't know about top pair.

I think the maple leaf is his favorite type of leaf.

I mean, he was an awful skater, terrible shot, no offensive or defensive prowess, but oh my god his skill at the top of the crease. He's deflected in goals mid fall from a cross check to the back. He's deflected in goals while flat on his back. He's deflected in goals off his back. He's has goals called.... back.... not to mention one of his most under appreciated skills was just being in the right place for the shot or the rebound. I don't play in a competitive league by any means, but I can appreciate how tough it is just to position yourself on the right side of the defenseman, so the pucks bounce your way and all of a sudden you're the one boxing the defender out, and the puck is coming off your stick. He was phenomenal at this aspect, and for all the praise he gets for deflections and screening and just creating chaos, I think this aspect of his game deserved more attention than it got. Homer is a legend

The numbers obviously aren't that scewed, but it's a valid point to bring up that these guys earn a finite amount of money between 20 and 40 (if they're lucky), and whatever that number is, for many of these guys that has to last a lifetime. There are only so many assistant coach and color commentary positions available after they retire. My coach from back in high school was a financial advisor at Smith Barney and many of his clients were Red Wings (which meant a lot of awesome perks for our team), and he would tell us some horror stories about some players living like celebrities during their career and having no long-term game plan, and everything falling apart within a couple years of retirement. On the opposite end of the spectrum, he had some stories about some of his clients who took their finances so seriously they would notify my coach of literally every purchase, even if it was going out for a carton of milk (lol I wish I remembered who he was talking about in this case).

I agree 100% especially pertaining to the opportunistic part. Bowman is excellent in putting himself in a position to be successful. I think that's his greatest attribute.

I don't know who this player is

This whole thread is classic number 9. He knows exactly what he's saying. The best part is that an actual debate broke out from this thread.

This makes more sense. If chelios wants to be coach, fine, but get his feet wet in a non NHL league and let's go from there.

who?

Things can't go any further south than Tampa, Fl.

I think you're overestimating Bowman's influence and underestimating the strength of the Blackhawks' roster. Bowman didn't join Chicago's office until after they had acquired Toews, Kane, Keith, and developed a solid supporting cast to help out these generational talents. I'm sure when his son wants his advice on something, Scotty is happy to help him out, but I hardly think that the Blackhawks' success is a result of Scotty Bowman's mastermind. I think a more accurate scenario is that he's just going along for the ride. Yzerman also inherited some franchise pieces in Stamkos and Hedman. And if we're looking for reasons why the Blackhawks and Tampa made it to the finals and the Wings didn't, I think the first place you have to look is at the core of these teams. As I alluded to, Yzerman's core is in their prime and wouldn't be possible without having those high draft picks. Chicago's core is in their prime and wouldn't be possible without having high draft picks. The Wings' core is aging, and is entirely a product of later picks in the draft. The supporting cast is there for the Wings, but the core isn't what it used to be. Bringing Yzerman or Bowman or Nill back to Detroit won't change that scenario. They aren't going to magically bring in players of Toews' and Hedman's calibre, not without the Wings suffering an epic collapse for a few years in a row. After all, that's how Chicago and Tampa Bay got their elite talent.