Non-Calls

[pjgj13 30]

I am not posting this just because our Wings got screwed on non-calls (we get the benefit as well).

I can understand not catching everything, like stuff that happens behind the play.

But, how do refs miss the stuff that is directly involved in the play (ie the puck is in the immediate area)?

First, there was the interference (crosscheck, hook, whatever) on Zetts late in the game (just before Homer got interfered with). That, would have given us a 5 on 3 PP. Then there was the hit on Sammy in the corner (again crosscheck, boarding, whatever), no call. And last, but not least, the hold on Mule behind the net. I can understand making a judgement call on some things, but these were penalties they call EVERY GAME.

They called the interference on Lids and they were both going for the puck.

What Lebda did, was both a good and a bad play. Good in the fact the puck was heading over the line. Bad, because the PS scored the winner.

The one on Z pissed me off more than the other 2 as he had a good shot and putting a decent SOG.

Ozzie played pretty good tonight. Afterall, on 2 of the goals he was basically on his own.

[I Red Wings I 40]

http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=54647

[TheOwl 77]

Ozzie played pretty good tonight. Afterall, on 2 of the goals he was basically on his own.

No he didn't. That puck would of went right in if Lebda didn't put his glove on it leading to that penalty shot. It's the Avalanche. No Svatos, no Sakic, look at their roster. A team of nobodies. And right off the bat, 2-0.

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

I am not posting this just because our Wings got screwed on non-calls (we get the benefit as well).

I can understand not catching everything, like stuff that happens behind the play.

But, how do refs miss the stuff that is directly involved in the play (ie the puck is in the immediate area)?

First, there was the interference (crosscheck, hook, whatever) on Zetts late in the game (just before Homer got interfered with). That, would have given us a 5 on 3 PP. Then there was the hit on Sammy in the corner (again crosscheck, boarding, whatever), no call. And last, but not least, the hold on Mule behind the net. I can understand making a judgement call on some things, but these were penalties they call EVERY GAME.

They called the interference on Lids and they were both going for the puck.

What Lebda did, was both a good and a bad play. Good in the fact the puck was heading over the line. Bad, because the PS scored the winner.

The one on Z pissed me off more than the other 2 as he had a good shot and putting a decent SOG.

Ozzie played pretty good tonight. Afterall, on 2 of the goals he was basically on his own.

Like everything else and like in every other game or sport, it is a judgment call by the refs, no more/no less, and in any game there will be human error involved, because humans aren't perfect. No matter what a referee does or does not call, he is going to catch hell 99 times out of 100 by a player, coach, or fan of some team where the call didn't go that team's way.

[Guest E_S_A_D]

Enough with the non-calls stuff. The league has declined so rapidly since all of these Mickey Mouse rinky dink calls. These barely touching guys hands with a stick calls are ruining hockey. That's why hockey has lower TV Ratings than poker.

[CrossoverThrash 0]

I don't think some of those should be called but clearly lebda did not cover hit hand on the puck to stop play he pushed it into ozzy's legs and it actually squirted out and play shouldn't have been stopped.

[Rivalred 630]

I don't think some of those should be called but clearly lebda did not cover hit hand on the puck to stop play he pushed it into ozzy's legs and it actually squirted out and play shouldn't have been stopped.

This one goal game did not go in favor of the Wings and slowly this will happen even more. Even if it was a bad call and it resulting in a goal, the Wings should of been so far ahead in this game it would not have changed the outcome of the game. Seems pretty simplistic to me; the entire team plays to their abilities and there will not be an issue.

[CrossoverThrash 0]

This one goal game did not go in favor of the Wings and slowly this will happen even more. Even if it was a bad call and it resulting in a goal, the Wings should of been so far ahead in this game it would not have changed the outcome of the game. Seems pretty simplistic to me; the entire team plays to their abilities and there will not be an issue.

Zetterberg and Datsyuk were playing to their abilities, Hossa had a goal, and Franzen was dangerous. too bad Raycroft made some uncharacteristically good saves, this will happen alot and it already has happened a few times, the teams we play are playing thier best games against us, yes, other guys need to step it up, but it really is the kind of adversity that a team needs to repeat and thats one of the reasons why it happens.

[Johnny Law 15]

This one goal game did not go in favor of the Wings and slowly this will happen even more. Even if it was a bad call and it resulting in a goal, the Wings should of been so far ahead in this game it would not have changed the outcome of the game. Seems pretty simplistic to me; the entire team plays to their abilities and there will not be an issue.

Exactly, you will never be able to control what the refs call and what they don't so take care of business and it shouldn't be an issue. Remember the penguins last year bringing this up because frankly they were over matched ?

Refs let stuff go because they don't feel it impacted the play, the let stuff go late in a game, the let things go if both guys committed an infraction, they call things based on who the person is, they call make up penalties. Hockey will never be refereed with even 90% impartiality, the Wings have lost games because they played like crap not because the officiating was poor.

[Holmstrom96 347]

I agree that the officiating has been influencing the score, and has been doing so on purpose. It sometimes goes both ways, but I'm very upset that our guys in front of the net (Holmstrom, Cleary, Kopesky) seem to be in the "green zone" for oposing teams; they can interfere, crosscheck, and slash these guys as much as they want and get no penalty.

The NHL has made some good decisions such as no line change or TV Time outs on icings, but they need to realize that part of the joy of hockey is low scoring games. Fans want to watch hockey, not watch zebra's decide a game. Some of the best games are 0-0 going into the third period.

I also like the 4 on 4 overtime and the shoot-outs are awesome, no more tied games. However, I don't like that the losing team in overtime or in a shootout still gets a point in the standings for losing. I think it should be all or nothing.

The NHL needs to do something about the Refs being the star of the game, because I'll stop watching if I feel my home team is being treated unfairly. I got pissed off after the player strike\lockout and didn't watch the season when they came back, and I'm not afraid to turn my back on NHL hockey again.

[thedisappearer 291]

Enough with the non-calls stuff. The league has declined so rapidly since all of these Mickey Mouse rinky dink calls. These barely touching guys hands with a stick calls are ruining hockey. That's why hockey has lower TV Ratings than poker.

Or maybe it's because hockey is on some Mickey Mouse rinky dink cable channel, and poker is on, like, 20 channels. If you think hockey is ruined, go watch Arena Football. Next season should be very viewer friendly.

Edited December 16, 2008 by thedisappearer

[pjgj13 30]

Or maybe it's because hockey is on some Mickey Mouse rinky dink cable channel, and poker is on, like, 20 channels. If you think hockey is ruined, go watch Arena Football. Next season should be very viewer friendly.

I don't know if you are being sarcastic but the AFL cancelled the 2009 season.

I actually liked the AFL, fast and fan friendly. I used to go to Drive games several times a year.

[Holmstrom96 347]

I agree about like the fast play of Arena Football. That's why I love hockey, basically non-stop action. Football has too much stop and go, but I do like that scoring is special (only a few TD's a game). They play for 10 seconds, then you sit back while they spend 30 seconds regrouping and lining back up. Basketball is boring because all they do is score. There is nothing special about making a basket in basketball. Hockey is just the right blend of constant action and low scoring.

In Football the officiating is MUCH MORE CONSISTENT. They don't always get thet calls right, but 90% of the time they do. In hockey it's starting to get WAY TOO INCONSISTENT. From game to game the officiating changes drastically and they seem to favor the losing team and seem to ignore infraction against players like Holmstrom and Cleary and ignore constant hooks on Hossa, Datsyuk and Zetterberg.

[Doc Holiday 0]

No he didn't. That puck would of went right in if Lebda didn't put his glove on it leading to that penalty shot. It's the Avalanche. No Svatos, no Sakic, look at their roster. A team of nobodies. And right off the bat, 2-0.

Hey who was that nobody who scored their second goal? And I guess our defense is so good it can never make mistakes. It's all Osgood.

And how about that one guy who used to play for the Oilers who basically knocked every single Wing off the puck last night? Smyth I think?

Yeah.

[Guest Shoreline]

When the Wings lose, people ***** about the refs. When the Wings win, people ***** about the refs.

It's not that the refs aren't making s***ty calls. It's just that people have been complaining about refs for ages. Somehow, they want perfection. It happens in other leagues too. If you watch the games, the refs aren't the reason the Wings are losing, so makes no sense to me to use them as a scapegoat or whine about them when it's the same way for every team, and it won't change.

[Frozen-Man 144]

When the Wings lose, people ***** about the refs. When the Wings win, people ***** about the refs.

It's not that the refs aren't making s***ty calls. It's just that people have been complaining about refs for ages. Somehow, they want perfection. It happens in other leagues too. If you watch the games, the refs aren't the reason the Wings are losing, so makes no sense to me to use them as a scapegoat or whine about them when it's the same way for every team, and it won't change.

The Wings deserved to lose the game but there were stupid phantom calls in the first 2 periods and then blatently obvious calls that were missed in the 3rd. I don't really care as much about the ones that were missed in the third because I agree it just happens but I get really peeved about the stupid nothings that got called early on.

[DyingAlive 27]

Hey who was that nobody who scored their second goal? And I guess our defense is so good it can never make mistakes. It's all Osgood.

Stan something, right?

Last time I checked the names on the back of the jerseys don't win hockey games.

[Guest Shoreline]

The Wings deserved to lose the game but there were stupid phantom calls in the first 2 periods and then blatently obvious calls that were missed in the 3rd. I don't really care as much about the ones that were missed in the third because I agree it just happens but I get really peeved about the stupid nothings that got called early on.

Wings also were the beneficiaries of non-calls for high sticks, trips, holding, hooking, and got away with a few too many men penalties that could have easily been called. The pendulum swings both ways here.

[Frozen-Man 144]

Wings also were the beneficiaries of non-calls for high sticks, trips, holding, hooking, and got away with a few too many men penalties that could have easily been called. The pendulum swings both ways here.

I agree. Like I said the Wings deserved to lose the game, but I hate the phantom calls because then players start being afraid to even bump into each other and don't know if the slightest contact will get them called. If the ref can tell if it is a penalty for sure I'm in favor of him putting the whistle down instead of calling it. If you noticed there were 10 penalties in the first two periods - 50% of the first 40 minutes had penalties, then in the third 1 penalty - 10% of the final 20 minutes. But if you watched the game there was a lot more clutch and grab, interference, roughing, and hooking (according the the "New NHL" interpretation). That is just stupid - no matter who wins the game and it is not fair to players of either team to not know how to play the game. Some symbolism of consistency is all I'm asking for.

[Doc Holiday 0]

Stan something, right?

Last time I checked the names on the back of the jerseys don't win hockey games.

You are right. Playing like the better team wins hockey games. I didn't see that last night which is why I don't understand the "OMG OSGOOD SUCKS GRAW GRAW PEW PEW" or whatever.

The TEAM played bad, Osgood included.

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

When the Wings lose, people ***** about the refs. When the Wings win, people ***** about the refs.

It's not that the refs aren't making s***ty calls. It's just that people have been complaining about refs for ages. Somehow, they want perfection. It happens in other leagues too. If you watch the games, the refs aren't the reason the Wings are losing, so makes no sense to me to use them as a scapegoat or whine about them when it's the same way for every team, and it won't change.

Simple as that. This is why I rarely ever get into discussions like "If referee A called this and missed this call, the Wings probably would've won 5-3 instead of losing 4-2!" Sure, referees are going to dictate the outcome of a game to a degree, but there are plenty of other things that determine a game outcome as well far out of the refs control. I laugh and get so annoyed when I've read soapbox posts on here saying the refs intentionally screwed the Wings or there is a conspiracy against the Wings because they are always good and junk like that. Both teams, regardless of the sport, will eventually get their share of good calls and/or crappy calls.

The only two calls/no-calls that I can recall in recent memory that I have beef with is one of the regular season games against San Jose where the puck just barely went out of play off the netting above the boards, and the Sharks scored from that. Also, the Holmstrom "interference" call in the playoffs game 4 against Dallas which resulted in a no-goal for Datsyuk.

I'm not so much upset that the refs made/missed those calls after the smoke has cleared and we're not in the heat of the moment watching the game, again it is a matter of judgment and human decision, it is never going to be perfect. Lord knows when I reffed college intramural games at a much slower pace I still made my share of horrible calls in different sports. I'm more upset that there are no rules in place to have an official review for such things.

That is why I like what they do in college football and the NFL now. Sure, the coaches have their challenges and yes it is annoying sometimes from a fan standpoint that the game flow is interupted, but more often than not if there is any doubt whatsoever with a play (other than a penalty flag thrown I think), football refs will review it and get it 100% accurate or close to 100% accurate as possible.

Now I'm not suggesting doing that every single time for the NHL as games would take forever to end but I don't think you see that kind of detail put in as much for in reviewing iffy calls/situations in the NHL, only on questionable goals every now and then.

[Hockeytown0001 7,652]

Simple as that. This is why I rarely ever get into discussions like "If referee A called this and missed this call, the Wings probably would've won 5-3 instead of losing 4-2!" Sure, referees are going to dictate the outcome of a game to a degree, but there are plenty of other things that determine a game outcome as well far out of the refs control. I laugh and get so annoyed when I've read soapbox posts on here saying the refs intentionally screwed the Wings or there is a conspiracy against the Wings because they are always good and junk like that. Both teams, regardless of the sport, will eventually get their share of good calls and/or crappy calls.

The only two calls/no-calls that I can recall in recent memory that I have beef with is one of the regular season games against San Jose where the puck just barely went out of play off the netting above the boards, and the Sharks scored from that. Also, the Holmstrom "interference" call in the playoffs game 4 against Dallas which resulted in a no-goal for Datsyuk.

I'm not so much upset that the refs made/missed those calls after the smoke has cleared and we're not in the heat of the moment watching the game, again it is a matter of judgment and human decision, it is never going to be perfect. Lord knows when I reffed college intramural games at a much slower pace I still made my share of horrible calls in different sports. I'm more upset that there are no rules in place to have an official review for such things.

That is why I like what they do in college football and the NFL now. Sure, the coaches have their challenges and yes it is annoying sometimes from a fan standpoint that the game flow is interupted, but more often than not if there is any doubt whatsoever with a play (other than a penalty flag thrown I think), football refs will review it and get it 100% accurate or close to 100% accurate as possible.

Now I'm not suggesting doing that every single time for the NHL as games would take forever to end but I don't think you see that kind of detail put in as much for in reviewing iffy calls/situations in the NHL, only on questionable goals every now and then.

That

[SDavis35 140]

Simple as that. This is why I rarely ever get into discussions like "If referee A called this and missed this call, the Wings probably would've won 5-3 instead of losing 4-2!" Sure, referees are going to dictate the outcome of a game to a degree, but there are plenty of other things that determine a game outcome as well far out of the refs control. I laugh and get so annoyed when I've read soapbox posts on here saying the refs intentionally screwed the Wings or there is a conspiracy against the Wings because they are always good and junk like that. Both teams, regardless of the sport, will eventually get their share of good calls and/or crappy calls.

The only two calls/no-calls that I can recall in recent memory that I have beef with is one of the regular season games against San Jose where the puck just barely went out of play off the netting above the boards, and the Sharks scored from that. Also, the Holmstrom "interference" call in the playoffs game 4 against Dallas which resulted in a no-goal for Datsyuk.

I'm not so much upset that the refs made/missed those calls after the smoke has cleared and we're not in the heat of the moment watching the game, again it is a matter of judgment and human decision, it is never going to be perfect. Lord knows when I reffed college intramural games at a much slower pace I still made my share of horrible calls in different sports. I'm more upset that there are no rules in place to have an official review for such things.

That is why I like what they do in college football and the NFL now. Sure, the coaches have their challenges and yes it is annoying sometimes from a fan standpoint that the game flow is interupted, but more often than not if there is any doubt whatsoever with a play (other than a penalty flag thrown I think), football refs will review it and get it 100% accurate or close to 100% accurate as possible.

Now I'm not suggesting doing that every single time for the NHL as games would take forever to end but I don't think you see that kind of detail put in as much for in reviewing iffy calls/situations in the NHL, only on questionable goals every now and then.

Makes sense.

My idea for a "challenge" would give consequence of a delay of game penalty.