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Chris Osgood announces retirement


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#261 MulesWillFly93

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 09:57 PM

He's got a portrait of Dorian Gray in his attic.


Right?! My exact thoughts earlier today were 1) I can't believe he's retiring, and 2) I can't believe he's OLD enough TO retire...judging by his looks, surely he's got another 10 years in him!

I will miss that guy immensely. I know I've criticized him in the past, but you know I appreciate every achievement he's helped us reach. Been moody and listening to Skynyrd's Tuesday's Gone and Freebird (my official "now it's time to say goodbye" songs, for some reason) all day yesterday and today. Fly on, Freebird.

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#262 Hockeytown0001

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Posted 21 July 2011 - 05:38 PM


"All done? Five bucks." - Pavel Datsyuk after an interview
"Very few cities in the NHL have the history or the following of the Detroit Red Wings." - Steve Yzerman

 

 


#263 Majsheppard

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 12:03 PM

I love Osgood and recognize what he's done as a goaltender, but I don't know that #30 makes it up there. Not because he isn't deserving, but because the Wings very rarely raise numbers to the rafters.



Everyone seemed to skip over my comment about this.

I think the only way he gets his number retired is if he makes the HoF. Then he gets his number retired for sure.

I doubt anyone will use the number, at least during his tenure on the team office staff.
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Tootoo does NOT belong on this team. He is classless and I would rather see the Wings be bad than classless. I feel the same way about Bertuzzi as well, but he at least CAN make the team better. With Tootoo the team becomes worse and in danger of being classless. Would you have liked Claude on the team? Or Roy? No. So why would you be okay with that POS.

This thread has been closed due to emotions being higher than people's ability to read, interpret, and properly respond to simple posts.

#264 Hockeytown0001

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 12:21 PM

Everyone seemed to skip over my comment about this.

I think the only way he gets his number retired is if he makes the HoF. Then he gets his number retired for sure.

I doubt anyone will use the number, at least during his tenure on the team office staff.


I don't think he needs to make the Hall to qualify for his number being retired. It would be strange seeing someone else in Detroit wear #30, and I think the front office would agree.

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#265 NeverForgetMac25

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 12:47 PM

What Oz has done for this franchise and the others he's played for has been remarkable. His numbers and accolades speak for themselves, but as much as it will piss off some...I don't see him making up in the rafter, HOF'er or not.

You look at how many guys have played for the Winged wheel yet only 6 guys currently have their number retired. Detroit is beyond stingy with the players they decide to have their numbers retired (which I completely agree with) and I truly believe #5 will be the next rather than #30. It's no knock on Ozzie, IMHO guys like Fedorov don't deserve to be up there as well and guys like Z and Dats have a hell of a long way to go to even be in the discussion as well. I'm ultra picky about who gets up there because the more players they retire, the less of an honor it becomes....and in Detroit, that's what it deserves to be.

That being said, I can't imagine he wouldn't make the Hall. He's most certainly worthy of it and deserve to be there.
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#266 Hockeytown0001

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 01:09 PM

What Oz has done for this franchise and the others he's played for has been remarkable. His numbers and accolades speak for themselves, but as much as it will piss off some...I don't see him making up in the rafter, HOF'er or not.

You look at how many guys have played for the Winged wheel yet only 6 guys currently have their number retired. Detroit is beyond stingy with the players they decide to have their numbers retired (which I completely agree with) and I truly believe #5 will be the next rather than #30. It's no knock on Ozzie, IMHO guys like Fedorov don't deserve to be up there as well and guys like Z and Dats have a hell of a long way to go to even be in the discussion as well. I'm ultra picky about who gets up there because the more players they retire, the less of an honor it becomes....and in Detroit, that's what it deserves to be.

That being said, I can't imagine he wouldn't make the Hall. He's most certainly worthy of it and deserve to be there.


What he said.

"All done? Five bucks." - Pavel Datsyuk after an interview
"Very few cities in the NHL have the history or the following of the Detroit Red Wings." - Steve Yzerman

 

 


#267 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 01:23 PM

What he said.

Double what he said.

Maybe it's because I've been a Wings fan since the early 80s and seen a lot of players come and go, but just because a guy is a heart and soul Red Wings doesn't mean he deserves to have his numbers hung from the rafters. As others have mentioned, then dozens of numbers could be retired.

But if the standard is Yzerman and soon to be Lidstrom, Ozzy just isn't in that elite class.

#268 Rivalred

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 01:44 PM

Lid's number is next to be retired, that is a given... I do feel the Wings should retire #30 as he has been a crucial part of their success for 3 Stanley Cups, and main reason for winning 2 of them.
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#269 eva unit zero

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 04:37 PM

Double what he said.

Maybe it's because I've been a Wings fan since the early 80s and seen a lot of players come and go, but just because a guy is a heart and soul Red Wings doesn't mean he deserves to have his numbers hung from the rafters. As others have mentioned, then dozens of numbers could be retired.

But if the standard is Yzerman and soon to be Lidstrom, Ozzy just isn't in that elite class.


If you put the standard as Yzerman and Lidstrom and applied it to other teams, you'd have to tear down a lot of numbers. If you put the standard as Osgood for goalies, you'd have to tear down some numbers.

What is significant?

You have to go back to 1973-74 season to find a player other than Yzerman, Lidstrom, or Sergei Fedorov who has played more than a decade in Detroit, started his career in Detroit, and was a key player and top player for as long as Osgood was. The player in 1973-74? Alex Delvecchio. Before that, it's 1971 and Gordie Howe.

Norm Ullman in 1968 is deserving, and should have a banner - especially since his number is already retired anyway. But that probably won't happen.

Osgood is definitely a Hall of Fame goalie. A 400-game winner with six 30-win seasons, two Cups, three finals appearances, one of the best winning percentages of all-time, and his only losing season was his second-to-last year, when he was fighting injuries the whole season on a team with the second-most man-games lost to injury that season.

There is a major difference between the unofficial retirements of Fischer, Aurie, and Konstantinov's numbers. Fischer and Konstantinov only played here a few years. Konstantinov may have deserved retirement had he not had his accident. Fischer likely not, although he was very good and on the verge of becoming an elite defenseman. Aurie's number was retired by the club, but no banner was ever hung and it now is not considered retired; it is simply not available for use. Osgood's contributions to the team were greater than any of those three.

At which point, naturally, comes the Shanahan argument. Why shouldn't Shanahan's number be retired? Shanahan wasn't as important as Yzerman or Fedorov, for one. He also didn't begin his career as a Red Wing, which does seem to have an effect on consideration. Finally, would you consider the third-best forward or the starting goaltender more important to a team, whether that team be good or bad? I vote goalie. Very few dominant teams in history, if any, have been so with a bunch of star forwards, one or two good defensemen, and a mediocre goalie. Edmonton is the closest example I can think of, and both Fuhr and Moog were among the better goalies in the league. The team was so stacked they could have kept Gretzky, and started trading some of the less important assets around him for cash, picks, and inferior players. Why not trade Messier and Fuhr instead of Gretzky?

Retire #30.

Edited by eva unit zero, 22 July 2011 - 04:38 PM.

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#270 eva unit zero

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 04:47 PM

What Oz has done for this franchise and the others he's played for has been remarkable. His numbers and accolades speak for themselves, but as much as it will piss off some...I don't see him making up in the rafter, HOF'er or not.

You look at how many guys have played for the Winged wheel yet only 6 guys currently have their number retired. Detroit is beyond stingy with the players they decide to have their numbers retired (which I completely agree with) and I truly believe #5 will be the next rather than #30. It's no knock on Ozzie, IMHO guys like Fedorov don't deserve to be up there as well and guys like Z and Dats have a hell of a long way to go to even be in the discussion as well. I'm ultra picky about who gets up there because the more players they retire, the less of an honor it becomes....and in Detroit, that's what it deserves to be.

That being said, I can't imagine he wouldn't make the Hall. He's most certainly worthy of it and deserve to be there.



Very few players have played as long for the Wings as Osgood has. Even fewer have been top players for the Wings as many years as Osgood was. So the "so many guys, so few numbers" argument is invalid. With that argument, you could have two teams that are both twenty years old, both have won two Cups in that time and have had similar success. One has constantly changed its roster, six or seven new guys per year, while the other typically sticks to the sme roster, maybe one or two tweaks at most. Which team is more likely to retire a player's number?

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#271 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 06:18 PM



Very few players have played as long for the Wings as Osgood has. Even fewer have been top players for the Wings as many years as Osgood was. So the "so many guys, so few numbers" argument is invalid. With that argument, you could have two teams that are both twenty years old, both have won two Cups in that time and have had similar success. One has constantly changed its roster, six or seven new guys per year, while the other typically sticks to the sme roster, maybe one or two tweaks at most. Which team is more likely to retire a player's number?

Actually that doesn't invalidate that argument, you just disagree with it.

Because Ozzy played for the Wings for a long time and racked up an impressive resume does not some how erase the significance that in their entire history, the Wings have officially retired six numbers. The point still holds that the Wings use an extremely high standard for retiring numbers.

Edited by haroldsnepsts, 22 July 2011 - 06:29 PM.


#272 Detroit # 1 Fan

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 06:23 PM

If we had won in 09, and Ozzie had won the Conn Smythe I have no doubts he'd be a first ballot HOFer and have his number retired. But because of that cocksucker Max Talbot now I doubt his number is retired, and it'll be interesting to see if he gets into the HOF. 401 wins and 3 cups should speak for itself, we'll see.

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#273 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 06:28 PM

If you put the standard as Yzerman and Lidstrom and applied it to other teams, you'd have to tear down a lot of numbers. If you put the standard as Osgood for goalies, you'd have to tear down some numbers.

What is significant?

You have to go back to 1973-74 season to find a player other than Yzerman, Lidstrom, or Sergei Fedorov who has played more than a decade in Detroit, started his career in Detroit, and was a key player and top player for as long as Osgood was. The player in 1973-74? Alex Delvecchio. Before that, it's 1971 and Gordie Howe.

Norm Ullman in 1968 is deserving, and should have a banner - especially since his number is already retired anyway. But that probably won't happen.

Osgood is definitely a Hall of Fame goalie. A 400-game winner with six 30-win seasons, two Cups, three finals appearances, one of the best winning percentages of all-time, and his only losing season was his second-to-last year, when he was fighting injuries the whole season on a team with the second-most man-games lost to injury that season.

There is a major difference between the unofficial retirements of Fischer, Aurie, and Konstantinov's numbers. Fischer and Konstantinov only played here a few years. Konstantinov may have deserved retirement had he not had his accident. Fischer likely not, although he was very good and on the verge of becoming an elite defenseman. Aurie's number was retired by the club, but no banner was ever hung and it now is not considered retired; it is simply not available for use. Osgood's contributions to the team were greater than any of those three.

At which point, naturally, comes the Shanahan argument. Why shouldn't Shanahan's number be retired? Shanahan wasn't as important as Yzerman or Fedorov, for one. He also didn't begin his career as a Red Wing, which does seem to have an effect on consideration. Finally, would you consider the third-best forward or the starting goaltender more important to a team, whether that team be good or bad? I vote goalie. Very few dominant teams in history, if any, have been so with a bunch of star forwards, one or two good defensemen, and a mediocre goalie. Edmonton is the closest example I can think of, and both Fuhr and Moog were among the better goalies in the league. The team was so stacked they could have kept Gretzky, and started trading some of the less important assets around him for cash, picks, and inferior players. Why not trade Messier and Fuhr instead of Gretzky?

Retire #30.

Osgood's personal achievements are light. That's the knock against him in the HHOF and retiring his number. He has an impressive resume, but he was never really a star in this league. He was never really considered among the top of his position.

I really don't get your line of reasoning. It's as if you're trying to prove Ozzy's number should be retired by naming people who shouldn't have theirs retired. And what does trading Messier or Fuhr have to do with anything??

You're also putting way too much weight on being a Wing for a long time. Yes that's a factor, because you want to retire a number of a player who is associated first and foremost with that team and considered synonymous with the organization (unlike the Avs retiring Bourque's number), but it requires a lot more than that.

And to be clear, I like Ozzy. I've been a fan over the years and defended him here countless times. But I still don't think he warrants having his number retired.

#274 SiLkK19

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Posted 25 July 2011 - 03:53 AM

One of my all time favorite red wings. Thank you Chris for all you did for this team and its fans! You will be missed between those pipes you protected for so long.

#275 Majsheppard

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Posted 25 July 2011 - 03:55 AM

If we had won in 09, and Ozzie had won the Conn Smythe I have no doubts he'd be a first ballot HOFer and have his number retired. But because of that cocksucker Max Talbot now I doubt his number is retired, and it'll be interesting to see if he gets into the HOF. 401 wins and 3 cups should speak for itself, we'll see.


Then a single goal keeps him out of the HoF?

That is weak, especially considering all the bogus calls that lead to goals in the series...
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Tootoo does NOT belong on this team. He is classless and I would rather see the Wings be bad than classless. I feel the same way about Bertuzzi as well, but he at least CAN make the team better. With Tootoo the team becomes worse and in danger of being classless. Would you have liked Claude on the team? Or Roy? No. So why would you be okay with that POS.

This thread has been closed due to emotions being higher than people's ability to read, interpret, and properly respond to simple posts.

#276 Red Wings Addict

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Posted 25 July 2011 - 04:48 AM

I really don't get your line of reasoning.


Without a doubt the biggest understatement in the history of LGW. How nice of you to refer to it as reasoning.

#277 eva unit zero

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 12:25 AM

Osgood's personal achievements are light. That's the knock against him in the HHOF and retiring his number. He has an impressive resume, but he was never really a star in this league. He was never really considered among the top of his position.


Osgood was one of the top five goalies for the 90s as a whole. As for personal achievements, a large number of HHOFers are in despite never winning a trophy. Osgood is well more than worthy based on established standards. You can have the standards you believe the Hall should go by, but ultimately Ozzie belongs there because he's well above many players already in.

I really don't get your line of reasoning. It's as if you're trying to prove Ozzy's number should be retired by naming people who shouldn't have theirs retired. And what does trading Messier or Fuhr have to do with anything??


My point with Messier and Fuhr was that the Oilers traded Gretzky and still won the Cup. That's how stacked the team in front of Fuhr's 4 Cup wins as starter were. Remove WAYNE GRETZKY, and still have a Cup winner. A further point regarding Fuhr; Osgood and Fuhr were each the best goalie in the playoffs three years during their careers. But Osgood only played eight playoff seasons.

You're also putting way too much weight on being a Wing for a long time. Yes that's a factor, because you want to retire a number of a player who is associated first and foremost with that team and considered synonymous with the organization (unlike the Avs retiring Bourque's number), but it requires a lot more than that.

And to be clear, I like Ozzy. I've been a fan over the years and defended him here countless times. But I still don't think he warrants having his number retired.



No currently retired Wing began his career with another team, or spent time outside of Detroit for any significant amount of time. So that classification in Detroit is not MY criterion. And using it disqualifies Shanahan, Draper, and Chelios. But Osgood has a Hall of Fame resume on his Wings career alone, and he spent a long time with the club in a key role. Norm Ullman is the next most recent player I can think of who matches that who is retired but does not have a banner. So disqualifying Osgood because you have to look back to Sawchuk for a retirement-worthy goaltender is a questionable practice. Jersey retirement should be based on the merit of the player, not the depth of the organization's history. Osgood's 317 wins as a Red Wing rank 4th among all single-team totals for goaltenders. Only nine goaltenders have won 300 games with one team. Only 19 have won 250, and only 35 have even won 200. most of those 35 are either active, ineligible, or in the Hall.

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#278 eva unit zero

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 12:36 AM

Actually that doesn't invalidate that argument, you just disagree with it.

Because Ozzy played for the Wings for a long time and racked up an impressive resume does not some how erase the significance that in their entire history, the Wings have officially retired six numbers. The point still holds that the Wings use an extremely high standard for retiring numbers.


My point was that you can't look at the age of a team and state that they should or should not retire his number; the Wings had a ridiculous amount of roster turnover for a period of about 40 years from 1955 to 1995. Other original six teams went through periods with far less turnover, and therefore longer terms for the key players.
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#279 Hockeytown0001

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 11:22 AM

Ozzie's finest moments -

-Fighting Patrick Roy
-1998 Playoffs
-Leading the Isles to the playoffs
-2008 Playoffs
-400th win

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#280 WizardOfOz30

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 12:14 PM

Ozzie's finest moments -

-Fighting Patrick Roy
-1998 Playoffs
-Leading the Isles to the playoffs
-2008 Playoffs
-400th win

Yes to all of those but you forgot the goal he scored against Hartford, that always makes one of my top Ozzie moments.

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"If I could sum up my career in Detroit, I was a perfect goalie for the team at the perfect time. I just wanted to be a Red Wing, that's it." Chris Osgood, July 19, 2011





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