kliq

What about Abby?

The thread yes, the post was Posted 17 October 2014 - 09:26 PM

You very well could be right, but if I am Babcock, at this point I am thinking about my legacy. Going to a team like lets say Pittsburgh and winning a cup I believe does nothing for him. Staying with a team like Detroit and essentially winning a cup with a completely different generation of players, I believe does much more. Even Toronto I believe would do more then going to a contender. Taking a team that hasn't won since '67 and winning them a cup would turn him into a hockey god in TO. If the day did come where Holland stepped down, I would rather see Detroit bring back Stevie Y to fill his shoes, not Babcock.

I read an article the other day saying Buffalo wanted Mantha or Nyquist last year but Detroit wouldnt do it (Which I am glad about). Now I am hearing the name Dylan Larkin floating around.

I find it funny that Robidas is a health scratch. This is a player that some people wanted the Wings to sign in the off-season. Further proof that just signing any UFA doesn't necessarily = good move.

I dont know why people think Babcock would make a great GM, a coach and a GM are two completely different jobs. Being a good coach would not increase the likelihood of him being a good GM, other then maybe his ability to evaluate players. I could easily be wrong, but I see Babcock as more of a guy who wants to be in the trenches with his players, worrying about how they are going to beat their next opponent, and working hard at getting the most out of all the players he has, not someone I see sitting in a board room talking about profit margins, salary cap projections, handling negotiations etc.

I 100% agree that the Seguin trade was a bad trade on Boston's end, but it wasn't just a "hockey" trade. I remember at the time Seguin's character was being questioned regarding his supposed late night partying. http://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey/2013/07/05/tyler_seguins_mom_lashes_out_at_boston_media_over_partying_reports.html I think Boston's issues this year are a combination of losing Iginla, Boychuck, Krejci's injury, possibly a regression due to age, facing good competition, but most likely just a slump. If they are playing this way in a month, Bruins fans should maybe be concerned. Its just a few games into an 82 game season. I think losing Thornton has absolutely nothing to do with it.

If Cleary is put in over Weiss, that tells me something else is going on.

Were there any changes in the lines tonight? Daily Face-off reported a change in the Defensive pairings.

When did Babcock say he was not happy with the Weiss signing?

Getting rid of all of our top players for a kid who will "likely" be good is a horrible move. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure both will become stars, but plenty of sure things have been busts (Rick Dipietro, Pat Faloon Alexandre Daigle etc.). To get rid of Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Kronwall, E, Howard etc just for a chance to get one of those two is going into panic mode. Even if we did, I still think our kids are too good to finish as low as they would have two to get the 1st or second overall pick......that basically happened last year lol. As bad as you think this team is, we are not getting McEichel, we are not getting McDavid. One player doesn't equal a cup either. Look at Edmonton with Hall, NYI with Tavares, Wsh with Ovi. Edmonton hasnt even made the playoffs, NYI did once, Washington hasnt gone past round 2. Not every "stud" turns into a Crosby/Pittsburgh situation. I also want to add, I know you didn't specifically say you wanted to get rid on Datsyuk, Z, Kronwall, Howard, etc. but that's what "tanking" would mean.

I agree there are no obstructed views, but their are definitely bad seats. Game 5 of the Stanley Cup Final in 2008 (the game that went 3OT) I sat in the very back (section 226B) its the section with the ceiling. Everytime a got up to cheer I almost hit my head (I am 6'2) and a few times I put my hands in the air to cheer and I accidentally smacked the ceiling. Other then those seats....I agree.

If you are going to have Cleary on that list, why not have Datsyuk? He was also resigned last year? For whatever reason Babcock does not want to dress him. I think Babcock has done more then enough to justify coaching a hockey team in the NHL and i'm sure their are reasons behind his decisions that we are not aware of. Every decision a GM or a coach makes is based on a number of variables and the public are only privy to a small amount of those. If Weiss deserves to play, i'm sure he will play. I agree I hope its soon, but im sure there is something we are not aware of.

100% agree. I've said it a million times, its all about making the right move, not just simply making a move.

Howard isn't horrible in shootouts, but he isn't great either. Last year he ranked 12th in league in shootout % (if you count starting goalies only). 12/30 is slightly above average.

The problem with putting a lot of stock into free agency, is the type of player that was available years ago is just simply not there anymore. Last year is a perfect example, as it was headlined by Paul Stasny and Matt Niskanen. What is happening, is you are getting middle of the road players being paid like they are superstars, in a pre-cap era I would say who cares, but in the cap era, a stupid signing can result in a guy like Jurco, Smith, Gus, Tatar, Sproul, Mantha etc. having to be traded away years from now to stay under the cap (see Boston/Boychuck). In a few years from now watch how many of these signings end up hurting their teams. Holland is making offers, but he seems to know when its too much. Like anyone, I don't like the Quincey signing, but at least in that case it was only 2 years and Holland has a pretty good idea of what he needs to do for next year. These 4-7 years deals are the ones that scare me as there are too many variables to predict. Who was saying they were worried about Weiss's injury history? The guy practically had none other then the broken wrist?

I wish this was the case, but media outlets were reporting that Buffalo was starting the conversation with one of Gus, Tatar, Jurco or Mantha.

Saying "Because Weiss has done so much for us" shows me you completely missed my point. From my understanding, Alfie walked away from Ottawa. Sure maybe they wouldn't give him a certain amount of money, but he could have stayed (ala Lidstrom) for less then his market value. Point is, other teams targeted him, we got him. The last UFA that has done something for us....Alfie. The guy had 49 points and led our team in scoring last year. But let me guess, that doesn't count because he is old, again, my entire point.

I think the "ineffectiveness" of Holland signing free agents is greatly exaggerated. People have very short memories, its as if Weiss and Alfie never came here. Weiss being injured last year some how dismisses the he came here in the eyes of some. In the case of Alfie, he left a team he played on for almost 2 decades and turned down a reported offer from the Bruins to come here. But since he is older, again, people dismiss it, regardless of the outcomes, they were top UFA's 15months ago, and we got them. Losing out on Boyle (wanted to play with St. Louis), Erhoff (lost out on to an elite team), Nitkansen (Wsh offered more $$/stupid contract and he had ties), and Suter (wanted to be closer to his family) does not mean we are horrible at signing free agents. Its a different NHL in 2014, and when a top UFA becomes available, its not simply a handful of teams that are trying to sign him, you are competing against potentially 29 other teams. Once you take into consideration that the free agent pools now a days are generally weak and that lately where a player signs seems to be coming down the city that the player has personal ties in its extremely hard to sign big time free agents. I'm not saying the Wings couldn't do better, but to imply that Holland is weak in this area I believe is an overreaction. Criticizing the Weiss signing is very unfair, Holland had no way of predicting the groin injury as he had no major prior history. His only major injury was a broken wrist which should not follow someone once its fully healed. . Also, one point people have a tendency of overlooking when it comes to Holland/Free agents, is the amount of free agents he retains. The guys rarely loses superstars not named Hossa. Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Kronwall, Lidstrom etc. all had a chance to walk, but instead resigned. You have to remember, every time a team gains in free agency, another team loses, and while Detroit has not necessarily been gaining a ton lately, they have not been losing either. I am also glad Holland is not making crippling moves in free agency like a lot of teams out there. Some of the contracts being given out are absolutely terrible. Other then the Quincey signing, and Cleary promise last year (which isn't that bad given his 2012 playoffs), I think Holland has done a fine job overall in the past few years in regards to free agents.

Between 2006-2012 Weiss never played less then 74 games in a year. In 2013 he did miss half the season, but with a broken wrist which is not an injury you need to worry about following you moving forward. When Holland signed him he was not injury prone, sure he missed a couple games here and there, but other then the wrist thing he didnt miss significant time for years. Nobody could have predicted he would have the groin issue he has last year.

The Oilers look great on paper. They are just a team IMO that have too many kids in the lineup, and unfortunately have a losing culture at this point.

You are completely right. People love to praise the Kings, and I will be the first to admit they have done one hell of a job with that franchise. But, what people forget is that to get there and get those picks you listed, they didn't make the playoffs from 2002-2010. If I told you the Wings would be elite, but to do so we would be out of the playoff picture until 2022, I think most people would pass.

Agreed, but if we did that would be awesome!

After reading through the different posts in this thread, I was literately going to post something pretty much identical to this as I couldn't agree more. Rookies make mistakes, and its okay as its a part of the maturation of being a professional hockey player. But, if you have too may rookies in the lineup at once, it can be bad. Bringing along these kids slowly IMO will be better for the long term development of the individuals, and the long term development of this team. Will there be instances where there may be a guy who is in juniors too long......probably. But its about the big picture, and bringing this team back to the top of this league sooner then later opposed to being the next Edmonton.

To be fair, the teams Lewis lost to in the playoffs (Anaheim & Calgary) both were playing great hockey and each ended up coming up 1 game shy of winning the Stanley Cup. In both instances the goalies (Giguere & Kiprusoff) were playing absolutely amazing hockey. Wasn't it game 1 vs Anaheim that we lost in OT, and Giguere has 60+ saves. I don't know if Lewis is necessarily to blame for that. Ironically in Babcock's first year with the Wings, he to lost to a low seed team with a hot goalie, that lost in game 7 of the finals as well. Crazy that happened 3 seasons in a row. Don't get me wrong, I think Babs is a much better coach then Lewis, but Lewis does get a raw deal around here. People love to pick a scapegoat. The funny thing is people think Babs will leave here because he is not happy with his roster, to go to a team that over the last 10 years have made the playoffs one time, and the knock on them is that they don't put forward a good roster. I think Babs will stay. If he can take this completely different generation of stars and mold them into a cup win, that would cement his legacy as one of the greatest of all time.