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I find it hilarious when people say that Babcock is going to leave Detroit due to being frustrated with the team Holland is putting together to go to Toronto. If I were Babcock, I would be excited with all the young guys up/about to come up. I know people get frustrated with Quincey and Cleary, but those guys will not be here in 2 years, the kids are taking over. Holland just wants to slowly integrate them into the lineup opposed to just shoving them all in at ala Edmonton. A guy like Quincey is just a holdover until a guy like Sproul is ready. Having too many kids at once can be a bad thing, you need vets, its getting that balance.

Which is why I want don't want to touch Widemans 3 more years at 5.25 million cap hit. If they guy is healthy and cant make the Flames, what does that say about his currently skill level. Completely agree. He had a few good plays last night, I remember a couple times thinking "Good job Quincey". I think people that hate him, just wait for one small thing so they can say "There he goes again, pure garbage" The guy is definitely not Kronwall, but he was solid last night.

I went last night and had an awesome time! It was a bit annoying having a Bruins fan right behind me that thought the people around him wanted to hear his colour commentary "come on Tuk", "lets go Lucic!", "Force them", "Get it out" "Good job boys" but after Goose scored he stopped . Regardless how you feel about the direction of the team, any true Wings fan should have a good time at the game. I loved it, and cant wait for my next one on Halloween where we hopefully take out the champs!

I don't disagree with you that a lot of concussions are also caused by full-geared checks, and I think there will change to the rules regarding those as well as time goes on. I don't think I ever used the word "talentless" but never the less. Alot of fighters in the NHL do not have the skill set required to play in the NHL, however due to their ability to drop the gloves they are in the NHL. Sure, they are not Brock Lesnar on skates, they obviously came up through junior and know how to play, but they shouldn't be in the NHL, and if they wanted to ever quit fighting they would lose their job. My argument, is that if you are going to have a guy who can fight, why not have a guy who is not one dimensional? (ie. Probert, Hartnell etc.) One of my favourite fighters back in the early 2000's was Georges Laraque, he definitely wasn't Pavol Datsyuk, but I would take his 53 career goals (13 one season) at times clutch play over McGratton's 10 goals any day. Guys like Georges you can argue have a place, guys like McGratton and Orr do not and GM' not named Brian Burke are seeing this as well.

I was looking through a scrapbook I had from when I was in grade school, and I came across this newspaper article. My apologies if its hard to read. To read that the logical person to trade is Yzerman in 2014 seems crazy. I wonder what the late 90's/early 2000's would have been had we traded him.

Ya no worries lol. Sorry, I was thinking this was an official poster put out by the team, and I couldn't see them putting Alfie on a poster.

This is interesting. Having him involved definitely could provide a unique perspective. If it helps in the safety of the players, I'm all for it.

My My guess is just rust. He has missed pretty much 2 years, you can practice all you want, but until you play in a game it can be tough to get into "hockey shape".

Are those lines real? I find it hard to believe Smith is being double shifted, and why is Alfie listed as injured when he is not even a member of the team?

One thing I find positive in regards to finding a trading partner, the articles keep saying "Red Wings are "very active" in taking calls to try......" This implies teams are interested, if nobody had any interest the articles would read "making calls". Or maybe I am looking way to deep into that lol.

It just seems so hard to believe that there was a time that Yzerman was considered a guy who was a good player, but couldn't lead his team through the playoffs. I was only 14 at the time so I really didnt look at things with the perspective I do now, I can only imagine the frustration in '96 amongst management losing in the playoffs after the record setting season they had. Luckily they stuck with him and were rewarded with 3 cups in the next 6 seasons.

Clinical depression caused by concussions has nothing to do with one's perception. Its not as if someone with clinical depression can simply say "I'm not going to be depressed anymore, I'm going to change my outlook." I wish it were that simple. Its an extremely tough battle for the individual and unfortunately can end extremely bad. I cant speak for others, but again, my opinions about guys that just fight day in and day out has nothing to do with a lack of respect, or trying to put them down, its not wanting to see guys suffer the rest of their lives for no reason. I'm not anti fighting, I'm against constant senseless fighting.

I've gone to the season opener for years now and usually there is a pretty good vibe in the air, definitely different the just a regular game I remember a few years ago against Anaheim when Datsyuk fought Perry, the place went nuts! I would say go.

If memory serves me right, we ended up trading Primeau/Coffey for Shanny. Good trade!

Daily Faceoff is listing the lines as follows: Franzen-Z-Abby Tatar-Sheahan-Jurco Nest-Helm-Gus Anderson-Glen-Miller Kron-Eric Smith-DD Quin-Kindl http://www2.dailyfaceoff.com/teams/lines/23/detroit-red-wings

I would be absolutely shocked if fighting is even still in the game in 10 years. With everything we are learning about concussions (long term effects) and all the player lawsuits around, I think its only a matter of time before fighting isn't just a penalty, but something that leads to a major suspension like in most sports. I also think that head shots/cheap shots are going to have harsher consequences, as this would be my biggest worry if they abolished fighting. I just cant see the NHL not going down this road. This has nothing to do with personal opinion of fighting, just the way I see things going.

When I hear someone say that its easier to play against Miller then a guy like Orr, my interpretation of that is purely on a physical level. If I had to take a check into the boards from Miller or Orr, I would pick Miller. But that doesn't mean the guy who is bigger and/or hits harder makes his team better. Of course Krys Barch is going to try to sell the value of guys like him. His is a 34 year old fighter who doesn't have a job right now who is watching guys like him get cut. Its in his own best interest for people to think the player he is a an asset in the NHL. Also, is it really any surprise that a person who made his living as a fighter is going to think that fighters are important?

Its not like Kindl is in his mid thirties,, he is 27, and he had a good season just 2 years ago. I'm sure there is a GM out there out of the 29 other teams that see's some potential in him and thinks that he could succeed in their system. It just takes 1 GM, hopefully for us we find him. I dont blame Holland for keeping Kindl on the roster. His stock wont drop an lower in a few games, but if he plays well, it could rise. Its like the stock market, you want to sell high, and buy low.

Go nuts Frank lol "Leafs join Bruins as teams ditching enforcers for 'team toughness'"http://www.tsn.ca/leafs-join-bruins-as-teams-ditching-enforcers-for-team-toughness-1.101133

When it comes to Jurco, not playing him in the NHL this year could be a strategy so when his RFA status comes up he gets paid Nyquist money (950,000) opposed to Tatar money (2,750,000). I hope not, but its not impossible. Next year Cleary and Gustavsson come off the books and they can easily dump off Anderson or Lashoff, or trade Kindl which I think they will do at some point. Then when you take into consideration the cap going up, they should be okay. Though I credit your line of thinking, this is exactly why I am happy Holland didnt sign any mediocre free agents to big money. Too many people fail to look forward at the big picture, and rather look at the here and now. Secondly, to those saying Holland has a bad track record when it comes to trades, here is a link to every trade he has ever made. I don't see a single BAD trade in the last 10 years. Pretty much every pick/prospect he has traded away in the last 10 years has done nothing. http://www.nhltradetracker.com/user/trade_list_by_team/Detroit_Red_Wings/1

I wouldn't consider a guy who scores 10 goals in 309 games a guy who scores goals here and there. He provides nothing offensively, even in the assist column he has 17 in his career. I have never read anything about him being considered a locker room leader. I've said this before, putting a guy like McGratton on your team does nothing. He may have gone after Scuderi,but Scuderi wouldn't have fought him, the Penguins goon would fight him, nothing changes except you get a fight between two goons. I would take a guy like Scott Hartnell any day, but I have no desire for McGratton, Orr etc.

I asked you this question in another thread, but I'm guessing you never saw it as you never answered. There was more, but the rest would be irrelevant to this thread. Scratch out McGratton, insert Orr.

They got 2 second round picks and a maybe a third (I think if they resign him). I'm guessing a player couldn't go back the other way due to cap reasons.

No, if Jarnkrok ends up being a below average player, Wings win. I would get rid of a mediocre player any day for a chance to get into the playoffs. For the record, im not saying thats what Jarnkrok is, I'm saying IF he turns into that, Holland wins. If he becomes a star, Poile wins. If he's just average, they both win (which is what a trade is supposed to be....win-win)

No, the trade was about sacrificing a potential future NHLer for a much higher chance of getting into the playoffs, and it worked. At the time we were missing Z, D, Helm, and Weiss and we needed someone to come in and play first line center. If he he turns out to be a superstar, one can argue we lost the trade. If he ends up being a fringe NHL player, then we win the trade. Only time will tell, right now its way to early.