Shutout x 5...

[Echolalia 2,961]

Since the nhl started looking at pad sizes, I think they're quite small, aside from the chest protector.

Goalies from the 80s/early90s

Ron Hextall

http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/Legend...9/000305246.jpg

Grant Fuhr

http://www.sharkspage.com/jpgs2/Fuhr_Oilers_57.jpg

Mike Vernon

http://cdn.nhl.com/photos/v/vernon1990_flames_tall.jpg

vs

Today

Henrik Lundqvist

http://www.freewebs.com/sahl/05LundqvistHenrik06.jpg

Dominic Hasek

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~swarheit/Dom1.jpg

and worst of all Giguere, who I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on when looking at the chest protector.

http://sharkspage.com/jpgs3/giguere2.jpg

I really think the "low scoring games" is a result of adaptive defense. Teams have learned if you never get scored on, you can't loose, no matter how bad you're offense is.

Edited November 6, 2007 by Echolalia

[Flip-check 6]

Not sure if anyone's interested in this, but I was looking over the goalie stats for the 1987-1988 season.

Grant Fuhr won the Vezina with a 3.43 GAA and .881 Save %.

I guarentee you if the game last night, with all the talent on the ice, was played in the same fashion as in the 87-88 season (complete with NORMAL SIZED GOALIE GEAR) the game would have been 20x as exciting.

I'm not hallucinating to remember 2.90-3.10 being a GOOD GAA in the early '90s then either. Compared to 14 games in, for this season? The top 8 have nothing above a 2.00

This is a very damn important topic that I can't wait starts getting some broader attention. Because I remember odd man rushes in games too... and you get -nothing- in today's game.

The flow and risk is gone.

[vangvace 12]

By increasing the width of the rink you open up more space, which ultimately spreads the defense out more to cover more ground. Shooting lanes will get wider, and it will be easier to skate around defensmen because there will be more open space to move around in.

I see what your getting at, but as long as defensemen can push folks to the outside and keep the game on perimeter then the game defensively won't really change. With that said, I think that it would make the game appear more like a continual powerplay.

Quick edit to add that, according to dropyourgloves.com, NHL GPG average is down so far this year to 5.63. Which is the lowest thus far post lockout and only a net gain of a half goal from the last season before the lockout.

Edited November 6, 2007 by vangvace

[Hank 0]

I really think the "low scoring games" is a result of adaptive defense. Teams have learned if you never get scored on, you can't loose, no matter how bad you're offense is.

Absolutely right.

The only thing the NHL can really do to reverse this, even to a micro degree, is make the goalies upperbody gear a lot smaller.

Playing the butterfly back in the day meant that you had to have a fast blocker and glove because of all the room you give up on the upper half of the net.

But when a goalie like Giggy, who has no quickness or athleticism, can play the butterfly there's something wrong.

You might never be able to get the defensive minded strategies out of the game, but if you give shooters more net to shoot on, teams won't be so willing to give up their blueline to play a trap defense. Not if their net is getting filled every other shot because goalies have to cover more net with actual reflexes instead of padding.

Trust me, nobody will be happier than me when goalies like Giggy are gone. They do nothing but mock and spit on this great game with their inflated, cheating goalie equipment.

My dream is that the NHL would force goalies to use smaller upperbody equipment for one exhibition game just to see how it goes. I would bet my last dollar that if you forced two goalies to use those pads for 1 game tonight, both teams would score over 4 goals.

Edited November 6, 2007 by Hank

[Starstopper31 0]

Any goalie who thinks they are talented and plays with pads like Giguere's is living in denial. There should be a restriction for pads, based on the size of the goalie. A goalie who is 6'4" should have larger equipment than a goalie who is 5'7".

While I do think that there should be rules, how about shooters who have one-piece composite sticks that allow them to shoot harder than they normally could otherwise? If a forward can have equipment that makes him better than he really is, shouldn't a goalie be allowed the same?

All I am saying is that gear constantly evolves to make the players better (on both sides of the ice). Likewise, the techniques have also evolved to make better players. You will never see goalies as terrible as the ones in the 80s because the game has changed too much. Goalies are smarter now, train better, and have learned what is needed to be successful in the modern game. Changing pad size won't really increase the GAA that much, and it definitely won't make the game more interesting.

Edited November 6, 2007 by Starstopper31

[Kutcher 0]

I love all these comparision's to the horrible hockey that was the 80's.

I mean everyone talks about it as if there were more than a handful of talented guys. The only reason guys dominated so much was because most of their opposition was of AHL caliber.

Like imagine every team having defense like McCabe, they would get lit up and guys would score like crazy.

Maybe thats what the NHL should do , make it a rule that a team has to employ half their roster with AHL or ECHL caliber guys ? Scoring would go up wouldn't it.

[interminded 1]

and worst of all Giguere, who I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on when looking at the chest protector.

http://sharkspage.com/jpgs3/giguere2.jpg

" and worst of all Giguere, " ???

Do you really think he some kind of a special arrangement with the NHL to have bigger pads and a bigger chest protector ?

[auxlepli 17]

" and worst of all Giguere, " ???

Do you really think he some kind of a special arrangement with the NHL to have bigger pads and a bigger chest protector ?

Common sense sure would say no, but then again, when has the NHL acted like it has common sense?

[BeeRYCE 2]

All his equipment is border line legal, but don't you all remember in the playoffs last year, commentators saying that his chest protecter kind of expands when he goes down because it pushes up off his pants. So his equipment is basically only legal when standing up.

[Hank 0]

All his equipment is border line legal, but don't you all remember in the playoffs last year, commentators saying that his chest protecter kind of expands when he goes down because it pushes up off his pants. So his equipment is basically only legal when standing up.

Well said. And I believe he still ties down his equipment in a way that when he hunches over, the equipment on the back flaps up covering even more room.

And look at the size of his trapper! That's rediculous.

Last night on XM204 Phil Esposito talked about this and he said the league really, really needs to do something about the size of the goalie gear or bigger nets will be a reality. He said the size of the goalies gloves today are enormous compared to when he played.

Starstopper31, I agree with your assessment about the skaters gear getting better too. I would have NO problems with the league outlawing composite sticks. MLB doesn't allow aluminum bats so why would this be any different.

However, I would argue that these new sticks are making for better shooters. Sure, some guys can shoot a little harder but it's not making them more accurate. And some players are now complaining how they can't 'feel' the puck when they receive passes as well. Going to wooden sticks might actually help some of these guys.

[auxlepli 17]

Wow, Phil Esposito agrees with me.

[Hank 0]

Wow, Phil Esposito agrees with me.

LOL! Yeah, he made sure to point out that the goalies today are far superior, physically, to the goalies 15+ years ago. But even with that, he said they enjoy a big advantage with the equipment they're allowed to wear. From the big trappers to giant upperbody gear, shooters don't have much room to score out there.

[eva unit zero 271]

A goalie who hasn't changed his equipment size in 15 years:

[BeeRYCE 2]

[Hank 0]

Roy stops Lemieux in junior game.

Edited November 7, 2007 by Hank

[BeeRYCE 2]

Roy stops Lemieux in junior game.

Is this to say Pat Roy has never changed his equipment? Because it's pretty clear that he has.

[Hank 0]

Is this to say Pat Roy has never changed his equipment? Because it's pretty clear that he has.

LOL. Nope. I did it to show how some goalies gear has gotten rediculous.

It's also funny that Roy said, almost immediately after retiring, that the goalie gear should and can be shrunk down.

Ryan Millers gear is also ridiculous. The guy has calves and wrists the size of my 4-year olds and yet he looks like a damn sasquatch out there.

[Hank 0]

On the heels of this discussion:

http://www.metronews.ca/column.aspx?id=88386

“A problem,†an NHL executive mentioned. “North American fans generally want offence. They don’t want soccer scores in the NHL. Something has to be done.â€Â

The exec attributes the scoring dearth primarily to what has become a familiar complaint  the size of the goalies’ equipment.

“It’s just way too big,†he said. “The nets must become larger.â€Â

“Expect the nets to be bigger next season,†the aforementioned exec said. “It’s the only solution  and it’s inevitable."

Edited November 7, 2007 by Hank

[auxlepli 17]

I can appreciate a low-scoring game as long at it's played well. Still goalie gear needs to shrink. I'd rather see that than bigger nets. Also Martin Biron looks huge compared to his size. He's 6'3" and 163. I'm shorter than him, have three pounds on him, and I'm skinny.

[vangvace 12]

Something else interesting... with the most recent equipment shrink goals per game went up a full goal and that's without shrinking the pads back down to 10" like they were in the 80s.

[Hank 0]

I can appreciate a low-scoring game as long at it's played well. Still goalie gear needs to shrink. I'd rather see that than bigger nets. Also Martin Biron looks huge compared to his size. He's 6'3" and 163. I'm shorter than him, have three pounds on him, and I'm skinny.

That's like Ryan Miller. He's 6'2" and 170. That's exactly my size when I was 19 - and I was Erkel material. No way he should take up as much netting as he does being that thin. Ridiculous.

Edited November 7, 2007 by Hank

[Opie 308]

In that picture Miller's mid section looks like it is the size of his two leg pads side by side if not bigger!!!