Balsillie tried to buy Sabres

[Hank 0]

Eva, facts don't matter here. We learned that when the initial Preds sale fell through.

If they proposed a team to either Las Vegas or Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan, everyone would say that Moose Jaw is a better location because they love hockey. Cape Breton, Nova Scotia? 10 x better than Portland, simply because it's in Canada.

Some people will never be satisfied until all 30 teams are in Canada, and the league fades into obscurity.

If you took the 6 Canadian teams out of the NHL, there would be no NHL. 1/3 of the revenue comes from those 6 teams.

Putting teams in Anaheim, Phoenix, Nashville, Atlanta, Florida haven't helped the NHL in it's national exposure in the least.

I have no problems putting teams in cities where fans actually care about the sport. It's why I was glad Montreal lost the Expos and why I'd like to see Hamilton get an NHL team.

P.S. Keeping a team in Green Bay (pop 90,000) sure has hurt the NFL hasn't it?

Edited May 8, 2008 by Hank

[eva unit zero 271]

If you took the 6 Canadian teams out of the NHL, there would be no NHL. 1/3 of the revenue comes from those 6 teams.

Putting teams in Anaheim, Phoenix, Nashville, Atlanta, Florida haven't helped the NHL in it's national exposure in the least.

I have no problems putting teams in cities where fans actually care about the sport. It's why I was glad Montreal lost the Expos and why I'd like to see Hamilton get an NHL team.

P.S. Keeping a team in Green Bay (pop 90,000) sure has hurt the NFL hasn't it?

Green Bay isn't just an NFL team. It's the NFL team with the most championship victories of any of them. I would have to imagine if Atlanta, Florida, or Tampa bay won ten or twelve Stanley Cups, the team would be pretty popular after that as well. Think about the Lakers, Yankees, or Red Wings. The teams with the most championships, respectively, among American teams in their sports. The Packers also fall into that category. What do they have in common? They have NATIONAL fan bases. This is a product of winning consistently for many years. The Maple Leafs, Canadiens, Raiders, 49ers, Bulls, and many other teams have seen this occur. If a team wins consistently, it doesn't matter where it's from. The problem is, it's impossible to have every team win consistently. So you have to put teams where you have the right mix of interest, populace, and money. Natural regional rivalries (Such as potential rivalries in KC vs StL or Houston vs Dallas, or perhaps even Seattle/Portland vs Vancouver) are a big help, as evidenced by Det/Chi, Det/Tor, Cgy/Edm, Mtl/Tor, Mtl/Que, and so on.

But arguing that small markets can succeed and using Green bay as the example is NOT a good argument, because Green Bay's level of success is unusual, and for every Green Bay with a successful pro team in a small market, you have the Hartford, Quebec, Winnipeg, and so on that has lost one due to market size despite being a market that 'loves' their team.

[eva unit zero 271]

Question that now needs to be answered - with an NHL franchise will those folks in Seattle/Portland want to pay out $40 plus for a seat?...Me thinks the folks in Winnipeg would be more than willing.

Same can be said about the luxury suites - will the big businesses in Seattle/Portland pony-up the $$ for multiple season long leases?...Even though it's a rather small arena - the MTS Centre would be sold-out for quite some time.

If Winnipeg managed to beat the Jets' per-game average single season record by 1,000 fans per game, they STILL wouldn't average a sellout of the MTS Centre.

I am not saying Seattle or Portland is definitely a better market, but they are both big markets and markets where hockey at other levels is doing well. So they are definitely worth a good long look. Also, if someone with an expansion bid wants to put a team in Portland, as happened in the last round of expansion, and nobody does from Winnipeg, as also happened, then this discussion is moot as Winnipeg would 100% NOT be getting a team over Portland.

But the argument 'Winnipeg fans would definitely sell out a 15,000 seat arena for an NHL team' has nearly 20 years of history disproving it as Winnipeg never even came close to that kind of attendance figures in the NHL over an entire season, and this was in a 15,500 seat arena.

[Cern 0]

The point is to try to expand the game to new horizons. Taking teams out of the southern markets would hurt the sport way more than help it. Yeah it might get rid of empty arenas. But you will lose any chance of expanding the game if you do that.

I've never supported expansion, at least not in the direction it's being forced into. Why bother with new horizons when you have a largely untapped market of 32 *million* people being completely ignored for markets that flat-out don't give a f*** about hockey? Sure the South has some big cities, but it means jack if you only get half-full attendance for games (and even then only because of a ridiculous number of freebies offered as incentives, which winds up negating whatever meager profits are being made anyway). f***, having a hockey team in Finland or Sweeden would make more sense than Atlanta.

Edited May 11, 2008 by Cern

[Cern 0]

Some people will never be satisfied until all 30 teams are in Canada, and the league fades into obscurity.

When I see how much the NHL's head office furiously masturbates to Sidney Crosby's image being plastered absolutely everywhere possible, sometimes I have to wonder if this is a bad thing.