hckypete96 3 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 homer dats z hossa helm franzen hudler flip cleary sammy drapes maltby kopecky ldo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
clutchngrab 12 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 As far as I am concerned all 3 of Dats, Zets and Hossa need to be our best forwards or Anaheim will win this series. All 3 are underachieving. I don't think the wings have any easy answer for the ducks and if they can't generate goals with their best players then they are in trouble. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nicholonio 9 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 Man, some of you guys crack me up. Comparing Hossa to Sammy? lmfao, be for real. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Drake_Marcus 890 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 There isn't a player out there who knows the system better and has spent as much time on this team as Samuelsson who will also play for a million a season. Abdelkader will be in Grand Rapids next season and Leino will be on this team regardless of Samuelsson. Everytime needs the Sameulsson's, Hudler's and Lilja's. You gain nothing but a roster spot by letting players like that walk. Letting Hossa walk and you can afford to keep Conklin or sign another role player without losing one player from this team except Hossa. Conklin won't be here unless the Wings get an unexpectedly generous offer on Howard. Howard's out of options in the minors, so expect to see him as the backup next season. And the odds of Abdelkader being anywhere but in GR next year are somewhere below 1 in 100. Abdelkader was a pro rookie this season- he's got tons of time left in the minors unless the Red Wings disregard their practice of letting nearly all their prospects slowly mature. They don't have to use him yet so they likely won't. Leino will be in Detroit because they want to keep him and there will be an open spot for an impressive 25 year old rookie with years and years of pro experience. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RockyMountainWingGal 108 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 - Sammy gets puck, he shoots - Hossa gets puck, he shoots Both are decent defensively and obviously Hossa is faster but thats it. They also both throw their weight around. Hossa is MASSIVELY overrated at this point. Maybe that is why Holland got Franzen all locked up before the POs but is waiting to see what Hossa brings post-season. Either way, Hossa certainly is hurting this team, he just could be helping alot more.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 (edited) This thread is mostly crap up until this point. 1. I'm not a huge Hossa fan, but he's better than Sammy. 2. Datsyuk did NOT spend the majority of his season with Hossa 3. Datsyuk played better WITHOUT Hossa than with Hossa. Playing Hossa and Datsyuk together is equivalent to continually using Sammy on the point on the PP. In theory, its a great idea to unit an All-star playmaker with an All-star goal score. In practice, however, it simply isn't. As for the OP's question - its neither. Datsyuk and Hossa look no different together than they did against Columbus, which should be encouraging. Hossa didn't show up until Game 4. Datsyuk was only really noticeable in Game 1. Their line, as whole, has never been particularly noticeable outside of a few shifts here and there. Here's a more intersting question: How many times have Hossa and Datsyuk tallied a goal or an assist on the same play? Once. And it was on the powerplay. In short, Datsyuk and Hossa have yet to combine for an even strength goal through 6 playoff games. For that kind of talent, thats simply not acceptable and needs to be changed. Edited May 4, 2009 by YoungGuns1340 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flip 5 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 2. Datsyuk did NOT spend the majority of his season with Hossa. http://www.dobberhockey.com/frozenpool_linecombo.php It's funny how wrong you are. Keep bloviating, though. It's entertaining. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flip 5 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 58 even strength points for Datsyuk this season. Hossa was on the ice for 28 of them. Exactly half. 36 powerplay points for Datsyuk this season. Hossa was on the ice for 17 of them. 46 even strength points for Hossa this season. Datsyuk as on the ice for 31 of them. 23 powerplay points for Hossa this season. Datsyuk was on the ice for 14 of them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 http://www.dobberhockey.com/frozenpool_linecombo.php It's funny how wrong you are. Keep bloviating, though. It's entertaining. You should probably check your stats a little better. Datsyuk saw 2086 even strength shifts with Hossa. He saw 2526 even strength shifts without Hossa. So yeah, Datsyuk spent more of his regular shifts without Hossa means, a majority without him on his line. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flip 5 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 The Datsyuk/Hossa/Holmstrom line also accounted for the most even strength goals of any line and the most powerplay goals of any line. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 58 even strength points for Datsyuk this season. Hossa was on the ice for 28 of them. Exactly half. 36 powerplay points for Datsyuk this season. Hossa was on the ice for 17 of them. 46 even strength points for Hossa this season. Datsyuk as on the ice for 31 of them. 23 powerplay points for Hossa this season. Datsyuk was on the ice for 14 of them. So what your saying is, when Hossa was on the ice with Datsyuk, he actually contributed to Datsyuk's production less than half of the time? Yeah that makes sense. As being on the ice doesn't mean getting it on the play. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flip 5 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 You should probably check your stats a little better. Datsyuk saw 2086 even strength shifts with Hossa. He saw 2526 even strength shifts without Hossa. So yeah, Datsyuk spent more of his regular shifts without Hossa means, a majority without him on his line. With Hossa versus any other regular line combination. Not the sporadic occasions when Datsyuk was out with Maltby and Helm or whatever it is you think is absolving you. We're discussing regular line combinations. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flip 5 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 So what your saying is, when Hossa was on the ice with Datsyuk, he actually contributed to Datsyuk's production less than half of the time? Yeah that makes sense. As being on the ice doesn't mean getting it on the play. HAHAHA You're so intent on being right from such a precarious position that you'll abandon any semblance of logic when making your argument. I wouldn't even call that sophistic. Of course, seeing as you were whining about the number of goals that Datsyuk and Hossa had combined on in the post-season, hockey obviously isn't your strong suit. A player can do a lot to impact a play without showing up on the score sheet. Show me another player who contributed more to Datsyuk's success this season. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 (edited) With Hossa versus any other regular line combination. Not the sporadic occasions when Datsyuk was out with Maltby and Helm or whatever it is you think is absolving you. We're discussing regular line combinations. No problem. He spent 699 shifts with Hank and Cleary, and he spent 605 shifts with Franzen and Holmstrom. Therefore, since Datsyuk averaged 25 shifts per game in the regular season, that means 28 games with Hank and Cleary, and 24 games with Mule and Holmstrom. In total, thats 52 games, or, 63.4% of the season. So, yeah, in short, in terms of "regular lines", Datsyuk spent only 36.6% of the season on Hossa's line. Last time I checked, 36.6% =/= 50%+. Although, now that I think of it, the stat on NHL.com that says Datsyuk played 25 shifts a game included PK and PP time. And the above numbers are for even strength shifts. So in reality, Datsyuk probably spent MORE than 52 games at even strength WITHOUT Hossa. Edited May 4, 2009 by YoungGuns1340 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 (edited) HAHAHA You're so intent on being right from such a precarious position that you'll abandon any semblance of logic when making your argument. I wouldn't even call that sophistic. Of course, seeing as you were whining about the number of goals that Datsyuk and Hossa had combined on in the post-season, hockey obviously isn't your strong suit. A player can do a lot to impact a play without showing up on the score sheet. Show me another player who contributed more to Datsyuk's success this season. Yes, you're right. But if we're handing out goodies to whoever helps out on the play, then we'd have to account for 3rd, 4th, even 5th assists, wouldn't we? Its not a precarious position at all, unless you think the NHL should create a stat for players who join in on the play, yet don't receive points for it. At any rate, I'm not really intent on doing anything. Anyone who watched the Wings this season knows that Datsyuk relied on no one in particular, and that he didn't see Hossa on his wing for the majority of the season. The stats from the website you offered show that. Edited May 4, 2009 by YoungGuns1340 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mike 0 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 The flu has been going through the locker room and I willing to bet that Datsyuk caught it and it has slowed him down a bit. Although Datsyuk is not producing much offensively, he is playing great defense. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 The flu has been going through the locker room and I willing to bet that Datsyuk caught it and it has slowed him down a bit. Although Datsyuk is not producing much offensively, he is playing great defense. Yeah, I posited that in the GDT. Hank had it just a few days before the series started. There are some sluggish looking guys out there, and the flu in closed quarters can be rampant. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mike 0 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 Yeah, I posited that in the GDT. Hank had it just a few days before the series started. There are some sluggish looking guys out there, and the flu in closed quarters can be rampant. The guys need to drink some orange juice and get some sleep on the plane. Come Game #3 they will have enough vitamin C to score 6 goals. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Broken 16 381 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 http://www.dobberhockey.com/frozenpool_linecombo.php It's funny how wrong you are. Keep bloviating, though. It's entertaining. Great word. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seraph 240 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 If push comes to shove, we should go back to DZH, and put Hossa, Franzen and someone gritty that can dig out pucks... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Phazon 24 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 no need to make excuses for datsyuk Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reds4Life 51 Report post Posted May 4, 2009 Well, something is wrong with Pav, because he has only 3 points in his last 9 games...pretty bad stats for his standards. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
