Pavel Datsyuk: Professional Playoff Goat

[YoungGuns1340 1]

No, I'm saying it because I think singling out any one payer who isn't named Chris Chelios is ridiculous at this point in time.

I don't care about the regular season, it means nothing. So you can throw out all of your arguments pertaining to it. As for the only season that matters, the postseason, I like what Hossa has brought to the table overall. Is his point production (or lack thereof) unacceptable? Yes. So's Dats'. So's Hanks'. I could find fault with everyone on the roster.

But I'm not so narrow minded that I'm gonna sit here and say, "NO POINTS = NO WORTH." Gimme a break. Hossa's hustle is outstanding. He creates chances. He backchecks like a madman. For being a soft Euro, he's had a pretty strong physical presence.

It's unfortunate that he doesn't quite seem to "click" with Dats in the way that Z does. But I'm not gonna call for him to be burned at the stake for it.

Zetterberg has 7 points in 7 games, while his main assignment is to shut-down the Getzlaf line. Hank's production is beyond acceptable.

[Dabura 12,207]

Yeah, I was just about to scratch that.

He's got a funny nose, though.

[rcTycoon 0]

No, I'm saying it because I think singling out any one payer who isn't named Chris Chelios is ridiculous at this point in time.

I don't care about the regular season, it means nothing. So you can throw out all of your arguments pertaining to it. As for the only season that matters, the postseason, I like what Hossa has brought to the table overall. Is his point production (or lack thereof) unacceptable? Yes. So's Dats'. So's Hanks'. I could find fault with everyone on the roster.

But I'm not so narrow minded that I'm gonna sit here and say, "NO POINTS = NO WORTH." Gimme a break. Hossa's hustle is outstanding. He creates chances. He backchecks like a madman. For being a soft Euro, he's had a pretty strong physical presence.

It's unfortunate that he doesn't quite seem to "click" with Dats in the way that Z does. But I'm not gonna call for him to be burned at the stake for it.

Your logic is flawed, an 82 game sample size is a much better judgment than say... 6 games.

Hossa, thus far, outside of a two goal game in which he was great but benefited from amazing passes, he has looked like a fourth liner. Hustle and backchecking doesn't win hockey games, at the end of the day you need someone to score goals and that guy is Hossa. We have 6 guys to fill the "Hustle, hit, back check" role, we only have a couple who are goal scorers first and everything else is secondary.

So yes, its easy to blame Hossa. Datsyuk has made amazing plays in every game in this post season. Hes set guys up perfectly, hes even set Hossa up on a few occasions that resulted in zilch.

Its safe to blame Hossa at this point, no one is jumping to any drastic conclusions. Blaming Osgood for not standing on his head is reaching. Blaming Zetterberg for not scoring two goals a game is reaching but blaming Hossa for only scoring two goals in 7 games while a guy like Sidney Crosby scored 7 in 7 seems to be logical.

Some players just don't work out. This team is worse with Hossa and its shown all season.

[rcTycoon 0]

Just so were 100% clear.....

Lids is the highest paid player on the Team.

Just so we're 100% clear, Hossa and Lidstrom both make the same amount per season. $7.45 million.

[Dabura 12,207]

1. The regular season means s***.

2.

at the end of the day you need someone to score goals and that guy is Hossa

Wrong. We didn't add him with the expectation that he'd be our go-to guy. He's just another weapon in the top-6 arsenal, and right now that arsenal isn't getting the job done.

I'm sorry that you've got an axe to grind with the guy. I hope it works out for you.

[rcTycoon 0]

1. The regular season means s***.

2.

Wrong. We didn't add him with the expectation that he'd be our go-to guy. He's just another weapon in the top-6 arsenal, and right now that arsenal isn't getting the job done.

I'm sorry that you've got an axe to grind with the guy. I hope it works out for you.

The Wings added one of the premier offensive players in the league and expected him to be a role player making nearly $8 million a year?

Zetterberg is getting it done

Cleary is getting it done

Franzen is getting it done

Datsyuk is getting it done

Homer?

Hossa?

Not so much..

Its not an ax to grind as much as it is disspelling the love affair with a guy who doesn't fit this team and obviously adversely effects Datsyuk's game.

Datsyuk has proven over his entire career that he doesn't need a premier scoring forward to be a successful player. He could play on a line with Hudler and Flip and still score 97 points.

This isn't NHL 2009, great players don't always mix.

[Dabura 12,207]

Datsyuk is getting it done

Right.

Been nice talking with you.

[rcTycoon 0]

Right.

Been nice talking with you.

Premier playmaker vs Premier goal scorer.

Ive seen Datsyuk set up more than two "sure things" that resulted in nothing because his wingers couldn't finish.

Ive only seen Hossa score two goals in this post season..

Hossa is paid to score and does not. Datsyuk is paid to make plays, play defense and win faceoffs. Hes been doing that the entire time.

[Dabura 12,207]

You've got an axe to grind with Hossa. I realize that. But you should realize that you're making yourself look stupid.

I'm done with you. I promise this time.

[rcTycoon 0]

You've got an axe to grind with Hossa. I realize that. But you should realize that you're making yourself look stupid.

I'm done with you. I promise this time.

Ax to grind = Disappointed that the piss poor play of one player is bringing down the best player on this team, maybe the league? A player, who everyone on this board was riding his balls just two weeks ago?

There is obvious statistical proof to backup the fact that Hossa decreases the production of both of the Euro twins. Doesn't really matter if its the playoffs or not.

[Outsider 42]

Just so we're 100% clear, Hossa and Lidstrom both make the same amount per season. $7.45 million.

You're right....you're right.....

Average Cap Hit is the same.

[webwing91 4]

Look, I'm sure everyone agrees that the team needs to play better as a whole. And I understand that right now Zata, Cleary, and Mule (ZFC) are our best line right now. However, we can do better as a whole. ZDH isn't just a good line like ZFC, it is a dominant line. They are our best offensive and defensive grouping. They can play against Getzlaf and win. I know Babs is smarter than me, but I cannot understand why he won't put them together. Hossa, is just not gelling right now, and we need atleast one in command line. Whatever line Hossa gets moved to, it can't be a worse line then Dats, Hossa, Holmstrom. Datsyuk is all alone out there it seems like, he can't get by all five players himself. He's barely getting any support. If the Ducks try to put four guys on him, they would be leaving Z wide open. Theoretically this should work for Hossa too but it isn't right now. Often it seems like he has to do nearly all of the work to get the puck, move it up, and then try and create something out of it. While he does all this Holmstrom goes to the front of the net, and Hossa is trying to get wide open, well that doesn't work because that leaves Dats to do 90% of the work. With Z both of them can be play makers as well as finishers. They don't always need to do it all them selves. The Ducks would have to worry about two instead of just wrapping up one.

Hossa should be moved down to Fil and Hudler. The two are playmakers and work hard to get the puck, they don't have the finishing touch, so that can be provided by Hossa. Major upgrade to Sammy who just gets the puck and puts a soft floater on net. Either bench Sammy in favor of Leino or Abdelkader, or stick him on the fourth line. Move either Helm or Leino to the second line.

[MudBruneteau 0]

What is certain is this - Hossa's value to this team is dropping dramatically every day. This will be an interesting summer.

Edited May 6, 2009 by MudBruneteau

[puckbags 863]

LOL @ this thread.

Worse thing about Detroit Red Wings team is its fans.

Datsyuk just won a cup, yet he's a "playoff choker"? Interesting! One thing is for sure, ignorance is bliss!

Look who has generated the majority of the 343 topics that have been started tonight...new people, the regular panic mongers, or just plain regular idiots on this site. Things never change around here...people act like spoiled rotten brats when we lose a couple of games but we will come back and win this series and *poof* they will all disappear like usual. Blaming Datsyuk? cmon...I mean what a f***in joke that is. Can he play better..hell yea he can..this whole team can do a little more. This team has been built for 15 years around being calm and keeping a professional attitude so I think its safe to say the only ones pannicking are the idiots on this site. I think a little line tinkering and getting #43 some more ice time could be some little changes that might help us get better.

[puckbags 863]

I favor bringing back the D-Z-H line or moving Helm up with Datsyuk and Hossa down with Flip and Hudler.

Will any of this happen? Yes, with five minutes remaining in game six when we're down 4-0 facing elimination. The ol' Mike Babcock special.

I agree with your first point..it would be fun to watch Helm race around all over the place making space for Dats and Hossa. Your second point is ridiculous...questioning Babcocks coaching is just silly...this guys has done more than enough to prove he is one of the best coaches in this league...he has won everywhere he has gone whether he's been given good players or not.

[Johnny Law 15]

I posted this in another thread but it applies here perfectly also:

Homer has more respondsibility than just standing in front of the goalie, you need to possess the puck before you just stand infront of the net aimlessly. The main problem with the Hossa line is Hossa. Im a guy who is obsessed with Datsyuk, ive watched every single one of his games in the NHL, sometimes I think I only watch Wings games to watch him and not the team, regardless, I know how he plays and his tendencies.

For anyone doubting Datsyuk, watch our PP during the next game. Watch Lidstrom lead the puck up the ice and pass it to Datsyuk to enter the zone. Do you understand how valuable it is to enter the zone unmolested and pass it off to a teammate as oppossed to dumping the puck up the boards to a Norris caliber defenseman waiting to blast it back up the same boards?

Watch highlights of Datsyuk play, he thrives on gaining the zone as fast as possible, getting to the goal line and stopping on a dime and either looking for the cross crease pass or passing it back to an open defenseman. That is Datsyuk's game in a nutshell.

Datsyuk, defensively persues the puck in the neutral zone and his own zone. He doesn't stand around waiting for a loose puck(Hossa) or a pass from his teammate. You'll find him most of the time behind Osgood playing the role of a third defenseman, either stripping the puck and getting it out of the zone or passing it to an open and flat footed Hossa. Hossa, after receiving the pass skates up the boards through the neutral zone and than dumps the puck in, expecting Homer to be the second coming of Pavel Bure and retrieve the puck from two Anahiem defenseman.

Of course, the 5% of the time Hossa doesn't chip the puck in, he does attempt to carry it into the zone like Datsyuk but he generally loses the puck. The entire act of Hossa playing "Dump and chase" hockey is what kills the line, whether its Datsyuk or Zetterberg.

Hossa doesn't fit this team and even if they cleared enough space for him to stay it would have to be on the third line because he clearly doesn't fit with either Zetterberg or Datsyuk. Cup or not, say goodbye to Hossa.

Start watching the games and stop paying attention to stats. Datsyuk has no choice but to try and beat four guys, he can't rely on his linemates and he has a true shutdown line on his ass.

Perfect post and maybe the only person who gets why this line isn't working. The only exception to this was in the 3rd when the defense was really getting involved in the zone play.

What pisses me off more than the line not working is Babcock's unwillingness to change up the lines. ZDH and put Hossa with Franzen and Flip or lets get crazy and put him with Helm and Sammy (who scary enough have been pretty good). Regardless something has to change as it isn't working for Datsyuk or Hossa.

[T.Low 1,011]

hey Dat's Sick... jinx.

actually, you beat me to it. I'll concede... however, I'm pretty sure the referee blew the whistle before you hit "Add Reply" and therefore, I win and you lose even though you really should have won.

Haha, you mean the ref "intended" to blow the whistle because he lost sight of the post, but couldn't get it out in time until after the post was already posted.

[gowingsgo 3]

They gotta pull Homer from the line. Babcock can't keep rolling out the same lines. We need to freshen things up out there

[datsyukismyfriend 4]

we still blaming hossa for datsyuk's lack of production? looks like it was dats dragging down hossa, not the other way around.

[Electrophile 3,554]

This thread is fun-nay.