kliq

Why do you say this? Every single analyst I have read is calling this one of the deepest draft in years.

I would think anyone who wants to see the young players make strides. If you’re looking at this season in terms of wins and loses, I guess I see your point, but I look at this season as a year where hopefullly our youngsters take their games to the next level. I care more about a player like Svechnikov developing then a player like witkowski fighting.

I read somewhere else the suggestion of signing him for 1 year at 7mil. I kind of like this. (considering we can afford it after signing our RFA's and if don't sign JT). I like it because it means no commitment past upcoming this season, we can trade him at the deadline next year, by committing 7 mil towards him, that money can't be used to sign someone else long term, and for him it is essentially a two year deal for the term of 1 for him. Win-Win.

Why is out the window? If he doesn't have a NTC, why can't we trade him? Or if we sign him to a 2 year deal and trade him in year 2, why does that not count? I never said we needed an immediate return.

Its all luck. Even if you tank and end up being the worst team in the league, you are still banking on luck to win the lottery. It's not the NFL where the worst team gets the first pick. Of course the worse you are the higher the probability of winning the lottery, but lets not fool ourselves, its all luck. I believe its a balancing act. You need to acquire elite talent, and yes that does typically happen at the top of the draft. With that being said, you don't want to dig yourself into a hole so deep, that even with elite talent you cant get out (ie. Edmonton and Buffalo). I am open to trading players to acquire assets (ie. Tatar trade), but I dont want to let a player like Green just walk away for nothing. I would bring Green back, but I wouldn't give him a NTC (or a very limited one) because without that he becomes very valuable to us. 100% agree, I wrote what I wrote before even reading this.

With all due respect, I think you may be taking my comments to literally. I was making the point that throughout this extremely short stint on Philly, the trajectory has been pretty much the same as Detroit. His first few games he looked good, then he nose dived. I'm not looking to pick apart the actual games, that's not my point. I'm not saying he was an all star on Detroit, but right when you thought he was something special, he becomes equally as bad. I was reading the Flyers fan boards, and alot of fans thought that Hextall fleeced Holland and they acquired a star after just a few games. Long story short, that narrative has changed.

Mrazek's performance so far in Philadelphia completely encapsulates his time here in Detroit. He played absolutely awesome for a bit, then he just took a nose dive. This is why this guy is such a lightning rod, he just can't do it consistently. But when he is on, he looks amazing. I highly doubt Philly qualifies him. He likely becomes a UFA and signs as a backup on a team like Edmonton.

Interesting: https://www.tsn.ca/the-players-have-spoken-crosby-mcdavid-headline-nhlpa-poll-1.1020078 The full results of the Player Poll are as follows: Who is the league's fastest skater? Connor McDavid - 81.0% Michael Grabner - 3.6% Nick Leddy - 2.4% Dylan Larkin - 2.2% Chris Kreider - 1.6% (Skaters only): Which goalie is the most difficult to score on? Carey Price - 41.0% Jonathan Quick - 12.1% Pekka Rinne - 9.3% Sergei Bobrovsky - 8.2% Braden Holtby - 5.0% Who is the most difficult player to play against? Sidney Crosby - 29.9% Connor McDavid - 23.7% Patrick Kane - 4.6% Shea Weber - 4.1% Anze Kopitar - 3.2% Who is the toughest player? Ryan Reaves - 44.7% Milan Lucic - 14.8% Zdeno Chara - 4.0% Micheal Haley - 3.2% Matt Martin - 2.7% Who is the most underrated player? Nicklas Backstrom - 8.6% Jaden Schwartz - 6.8% Nikita Kucherov - 6.2% Aleksander Barkov - 6% Which player is the best role model? Sidney Crosby - 33.0% Jonathan Toews - 9.6% Patrice Bergeron - 6.0% Shea Weber - 3.1% Patrick Marleau - 2.6% Which player would you select to start a franchise? Connor McDavid - 48.6% Sidney Crosby - 23.8% Auston Matthews - 5.8% Jonathan Toews - 3.1% Erik Karlsson - 1.9% Which coach would you like to play for? Joel Quenneville - 16.5% Jon Cooper - 14.2% Gerard Gallant - 11.6% Mike Babcock - 7.5% Peter Laviolette - 4.9% Which current assistant coach should be the next head coach? D.J. Smith (Toronto Maple Leafs) - 8.3% Todd Reirden (Washington Capitals) - 7.4% Ulf Samuelsson (Chicago Blackhawks) - 5.1% Steve Ott (St. Louis Blues) - 5.1% Lindy Ruff (New York Rangers) - 4.2% Which player would be a great coach once they retire? Sidney Crosby - 5.7% Derek Stepan - 4.5% Jason Spezza - 4.5% Matt Cullen - 4.5% Jonathan Toews - 3.6% Who is the best referee? Wes McCauley - 47.8% Kelly Sutherland - 17.7% Tim Peel - 4.4% Dan O'Halloran - 2.7% Trevor Hanson - 2.7% Which is your favourite rink to play in? Bell Centre (Montreal) - 24.8% United Center (Chicago) - 21.9% Madison Square Garden (New York) - 14.6% Staples Center (Los Angeles) - 5.4% Bridgestone Arena (Nashville) - 4.9% Which rink has the best ice? Bell Centre (Montreal) - 28.0% Rogers Place (Edmonton) - 21.7% Bell MTS Place (Winnipeg) - 6.6% Xcel Energy Center (Saint Paul) - 6.0% Scotiabank Saddledome (Calgary) - 6.0% Which rink has the worst ice? BB&T Center (Sunrise) - 16.8% Gila River Arena (Glendale) - 10.7% Barclays Center (Brooklyn) - 10.7% Honda Center (Anaheim) - 8.6% PNC Arena (Raleigh) - 5.9% Which team (excluding your own) has the best fans? Chicago Blackhawks - 30.4% Nashville Predators - 19.4% Montreal Canadiens - 18.8% Toronto Maple Leafs - 4.8% Winnipeg Jets - 4.3% Who is the best forward of all time? Wayne Gretzky - 72.7% Mario Lemieux - 11.3% Sidney Crosby - 4.9% Jaromir Jagr - 3.1% Peter Forsberg - 2.3% Who is the best defenceman of all time? Bobby Orr - 61% Nicklas Lidstrom - 29.1% Ray Bourque - 2.6% Paul Coffey - 1.8% Scott Niedermayer - 1.3% Who is the best goalie of all time? Patrick Roy - 39.3% Martin Brodeur - 33.2% Dominik Hasek - 13.6% Carey Price - 3.0% Ken Dryden - 3.0% Who is one player, current of former, you would like to have as a teammate? Wayne Gretzky - 13.4% Sidney Crosby - 8.0% Mario Lemieux - 6.3% Peter Forsberg - 4.6% Nicklas Backstrom - 3.7% Who was your favourite player growing up? Peter Forsberg - 8.4% Steve Yzerman - 8.2% Joe Sakic - 7.4% Nicklas Lidstrom - 5.3% Mats Sundin - 4.2%

To be honest, I see the argument for Crosby. Now to be clear lol, I'm not saying Crosby IS better then Howe, I'm just saying I see the argument. If I were on a debate team, and my job was to debate why Crosby was better, here is what I would say. 1) They played in similar era's when it came to Goals Per Game. During Crosby's career the NHL has averaged between 2.71 - 3.08 GPG, and while Howe played it was between 2.40 - 3.51 GPG. With that being said, Crosby ranks 6th all time in points per game (1.292 PPG), Howe ranks 37th (1.047 PPG). Granted the 3.51 for Howe is a bit skewed because he was a lot older when goals were getting easier and easier. http://www.quanthockey.com/nhl/records/nhl-players-all-time-points-per-game-leaders.html https://www.hockey-reference.com/leagues/stats.html 2) Crosby is playing against the best players in the world, and has dominated for over a decade. Howe only played against North Americans. Obviously Howe has more Harts then Crosby (6-2) but if you removed Ovechkin, Malkin, Sedin, he would have 2 more as in 2010 and 2013 he was the top NA player. Not to mention the 2 years he essentially missed due to concussion issues. 3) I think it's fair to say that Wings fans have a bias. What Howe's accomplishments are almost similar to folklore. Yes there is proof, I'm not debating that, but none of us likely saw him play many if any games, what we know of him is based on what our fathers/mothers, grandfathers/grandmothers, great grandfathers/grandmothers etc. told us. He's looked at as such a legend, as a Wings fan its hard to imagine Crosby (who most think is a whiny baby) could be better. Just a few counterpoints. If you are asking me, I wouldn't compare them. I dont think its fair to compare players from the O6 era to players of the modern era. Too many things that are different. If I voted in that poll though, I pick Gretzky.

Finn?

I made a thread about it back in the summer. Below is what I posted:

I was a Wings season ticket holder for the last 4 or 5 years (I quit this year because of their new BS rules). They had 41 games packages, 20 game packages, and 10 game packages.

You do only work 3 days a year, that's a lot of time for posting!

No, what would be funny is if this went the route of fight club, and YOU were Ken Holland. Maybe you are, but you don’t know it yet!

The other issue is the lottery system. I was at the Nashville/Detroit game 2 weeks ago, and its a really weird feeling to know that if your team wins, its going to hurt them. Its one things at the beginning of the season as anything is possible even if its unlikely, but at this point we are not making the playoffs and the best thing for us is to lose. That's not something that I want to watch 3-4 times a week.

Wouldn't you prefer to get more assets at the trade deadline? Over the summer I cant see the return being anything special. Also, the cap is going up. Around 3-7mil.

We lack an elite core, its as simple as that. Give us elite players and there is no reason why things won't turn around.

Where are people taking his good play to extreme's? I've noticed some praise go his way, but I havent read anything that out there. Lefty's post above was tongue in cheek, so I wouldn't count that.

This is just not true. EVERY analyst that I read had him as a first round pick, and most had him as a top 10 pick. My personal go to is Bob McKenzie, I trust him more then anyone else and he had him at #9 . Where did we draft again? https://www.tsn.ca/kchow-template-100-1.778987 Like most, I wish we drafted Vilardi, but to call Ras a 2nd round pick is BS.

I highly doubt they go with Alex Lyon as their starter unless Mrazek has a few bad games.

Not often, but it does happen. The Leafs did it with Daniel Winnik, but thats all I can think about off the top of my head.

Agreed. I will say though, if we could sign Raanta for cheap (say 2-3 mil) I would do it and then trade Howard at the deadline. Then the following year bring Howard back as the backup (1-2 mil) and we would be set. Raanta/Howard at 5mil total would be nice. Wont happen, I know that lol. I'm sure some team will overpay for Raanta.

If the Wings were to dump Howard and acquire one of the above, the best choice may be Antti Raanta. No injury concerns that I know of, he's 28, and considering where he plays, he has pretty good stats. Did great as a backup in NY and Chicago. He's actually a UFA this summer.

I don't know, I dont think Holland has been shy of making moves that piss people off lol.