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About Bertmondi

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  1. The idea that the Canucks are divers is anecdotal non-sense perpetuated by eastern media and fans who don't actually follow the Canucks. The reality is no one stays up past 10 or 11 to watch the games. If Holland and Babcock respect Gillis, Vigneault and the Canucks, which they do, that is enough for me to know what real hockey people think about the team. Excellent game last night. Maybe the Wings will get the win next time.
  2. I did not mention opinions, I said unsolicited shots. Much in the same way Steve Yzerman and Joe Sakic did not take unsolicited shot at their foes after victory and after retirement (hello Mark Recchi), I would expect fans of opposing teams to do the same. Opinions, certainly. But unsubstantiated insults and vitriol are oftentimes pointless and simply rude. I see you are speaking using the pronoun "we" as if you represent all Wings fans. I'm sure I've been guilty of the same many times. But this Canuck fan can only speak for himself. And I see the game as a big regular season game. There is nothing wrong with viewing a marquee matchup as important. I'm not sure if you recall but when Karl Malone and Michael Jordan were in the NBA oftentimes NBC would feature those games on the Sunday for a national television audience signifying the relative importance of the game. If you think those games were just the same as Jordan rolling into Vancouver to play the Grizzlies on a Tuesday night then yes, this game on Thursday is just two points. Further, if you look at the objective reality of the tie-breaking system (i.e. ROW and season series) you will know that in addition to "just two points" being on the line there is playoff positions and perhaps home ice advantage at stake on Thursday night. So with respect to your comment about the importance of season series, I just say you are objectively incorrect. I'm not sure why a Red Wings fan would downplay the importance of this game, but make no mistake, from an objective point of view this is a reasonably important game. From a subjective point of view, I see a matchup with Detroit as fun and exciting, because it is a good hockey game. I would rather watch Vancouver vs. Detroit than almost any other matchup because its good skilled hockey. Anyhow, I was at Rogers Arena on December 21st and that was one heck of game. The atmosphere, the intensity and the hockey were just at a higher level than Vancouver vs. Columbus or Minnesota. With respect to the riots, what can I say? They happened. But I mean, you weren't there and you didn't walk the streets during the riot or go to work the next morning at 7AM and see the actual damage. So much in the same way you can say only local media has a handle on the alleged riots in Detroit then I will respond by saying the riots looked at lot worse on TV then they actually were. But a riot by a bunch of drunk teens and 20-something is nothing new in this world. And let's be honest, the riot has nothing to do with the merits of the team, or the vast majority of its fans. Nor did I mention the riot, nor do I care about any riot actual or alleged in Detroit. I mean I won't start talking about the economy of Detroit or the crime rates because well, it is simply not relevant. As for Vancouver not being a flagship franchise? I beg to differ. They are the seventh most valuable team in the league whilst being in medium-sized market. They have the longest sellout streak going in the NHL. They are highly profitable, in the sense that they pay a large chunk of their revenue in to league coffers for redistribution. They are the second biggest market on HNIC, which is the biggest hockey television production in the world. They have won their division six out of the past eight season...etc...etc...etc...etc. Economically speaking Vancouver, is a flagship franchise for the NHL. Pierre McGuire of NBC was on sports radio in Vancouver yesterday and said that same thing. NBC has no problem putting Vancouver on American television because they are "a huge draw." And the SCF was the "most watched since they started taking ratings in 1971." The only teams I would place ahead of Vancouver without qualification are the Detroit Red Wings, New York Rangers, Toronto Maple Leafs and Montreal Canadiens. In recent years I would add Boston and Chicago, however those teams are extremely recently rejuvenated. And in the same way as these sorts of things ebb and flow, Dallas and Colorado are, at this time, not considered flagship franchises. As for your comments with respect to Jesus and success, I'll leave you to your superstitions without comment. The fact of the matter is you are either a Red Wings fans by default (meaning you've been lucky for a long time) or you choose to cheer for the because of their success (meaning you are bandwagon jumper). The success of the team, does of course have nothing to do with luck. But the smugness of the fans directly correlates with luck. The true measure of fan therefore is if you stay with a team when they are terrible. Sounds like you are clearly a hardcore Wings fan, but that does not change the fact that an entire generation of Wings fans have not experienced a losing season. I'm looking forward to a great game. And I know it means a little more to many of you Wings fans than Columbus or Edmonton. Lets be real about it. It is only 2pts, but they are a big 2pts. Viewing SJ or Chi as bigger rivals is natural, but it does not make those games of more importance. OF course, I view Chi and Bos as bigger rivals than Detroit too, but objectively speaking a game against Boston is quite literally just about the 2pts and against the Wings it is not. I'm sure many/all of you will disagree. Which is fine. But it does not change the fact that I've tried to provide objective analysis and facts to support my points. And I continue to enjoy reading (and sometimes posting) at this website.
  3. It is clearly a big game. And an indicator of how the two teams stack up. Personally, I don't think Canuck fans overestimate the importance of this game any more so than (smug) Red Wings fans try to downplay the potential impending loss (let's face, it the home streak will end eventually). It is a big game, no two ways about it. By pointing out the obvious, that there are only two points at stake, you are taking away from the fact that the outcome will also impact the season series and potentially the ROW stat. Not to mention it is a clash of two of the NHL's flagship franchises. While it is popular to crap on Vancouver, the team and its fans lately, I'd challenge any Wings fans on hockey knowledge and/or love of the game. There is any entire generation of Wings fans who have never experienced a losing season. Show me a fan who has watched all 82 of a team that finished out of the playoffs and I'll show you a hardcore Wings fan. So that means unless you're over 30 you're pretty much out. It's easy to be a Wings fan because they have an excellent team and organization. But, from an outside fan's perspective that is obviously pure luck. Anyways, I'm a fan of both teams and have always had a great deal of time for current and former Wings, especially Yzerman, Lidstrom and Larionov. Because they were/are great players and great people. You'd never catch them taking unsolicited shots at their competitors, unlike certain current players, media and fans (hello Bollard, Marchand...). Unfortunately, it seems the unreasonable and irrational distain for Vancouver has leaked into the usually civil Wings fanbase.
  4. The title of this thread suggests this is as appropriate a place as any on the ol' interweb to talk Canucks v. Bruins.
  5. Smug are the "fans" of teams that have a relatively successful history telling fans of another team how they should act when their team is being successful. The reality is the fans have little to nothing to do with the outcome of the games, so as self assured and arrogant as many Wings fans can be they really have no reason to be that way. Wings fans merely support a team that had the likes of Yzerman, Lidstrom, Fedorov, Shanahan, Hull, Chelios, Larionov, Robitaille, Rafalski, Zetterburg, Datsyuk, Hasek....etc...etc...etc over the last 15 seasons. Why not let Vancouver fans enjoy their success? It's not as though the Wings were affected by the Canucks at all this season. As for those saying the Canucks aren't even a good SCF team or potential winner. That's ridiculous. No team, not even the Wings has finished first in GF/GA, points and PP% in the same season since the 1970s. Sure the Canucks almost lost to Chicago, but the reality is they did not lose. One could say the Wings almost beat SJ, but that would be a pretty pointless conversation. If I was a Wings fan I'd be happy with my team's success over the last few years but I wouldn't cut down my opponent's success in a fit of bitterness as I wouldn't see the point in being negative long after my team had wrapped up their season and hit the lynx.
  6. I'm not sure what your point is here... if you have ties to Detroit you aren't likely a bandwagon fan. But, if you just pick the Wings to cheer for out of the 30 teams, the evidence suggests you've picked the team that historically succeeds the most. I'm not sure why this offends you people. Your team is the is usually the best, but those who "jump" on the Wings wagon are picking a team that is easy to cheer fair because the weather is always fair in Detroit. This discussion began one someone called Vancouver fans bandwagon fans and I suggested that if either franchise was likely to have any bandwagon fans it was the Wings. The reason being, the Wings have historically been far superior to the Canucks. As for newcomer...looks like my signup dates harkens back nearly as long as yours old timer.
  7. First, and to be completely clear, I did not say Vancouver has exclusively die-hard fans. I was responding to a poster who referred to all Vancouver fans as of the bandwagon variety. Second, sellout streaks are one of several indicators of a strong diehard fan base. The Canuck sellout streak stretches back to at least two non-playoff seasons. If I'm not mistaken Minnesota and Colorado all had long sellout streaks break when their teams took downturns. As for the Oilers, I believe their streak was broken at something like 150. Vancouver is approaching 10 consecutive seasons completely sold out. As for the Yankees/Wings comparison...Brett Hull, Luc Robaitaille, Dominik Hasek and Chris Chelios say hi. Listen the Wings are a great organization and I respect a lot of what they have done over the years. But to not draw a comparison with the Yankees is foolish. Unless I'm wrong Jeter, Rivera, Rivera and Posada matchup pretty nicely with Lidstrom, Yzerman, Fedorov and Datsyuk/Zetterberg. The cap may have changed things over the last SIX seasons, but the Wings are still living on a tradition built in the pre-cap era. To be clear, I do not blame the Wings for being a top spender in the pre-cap era rather I respect their management and ownership's commitment to spending and winning. But listen, the Wings-Yankees comparison is more than fair and has been made by many. To be clear, I never said the Wings do not have diehard fans. To be clear, I never said you had to live in Detroit to be a Wings fan--though you imply that's what I said. By calling me ignorant you are showing your ignorance in reading comprehension. No where in my post did I suggest there isn't a single diehard fan of the Red Wings. Clearly there are many diehard Wings fans. What I did say, is that those people who are not from (or have significant ties to) Detroit that are Wings fans are the definition of bandwagon fans. Of course if you are from Detroit, but no longer live there you are free to be a Wings fan. In fact, anyone is free to be a Wings fan. But if you have no ties to Detroit and you choose to cheer for the Wings there is a good chance you are a bandwagon (aka fair weather) fan. It is easy to be a Wings fan, they never miss the playoffs and are never bad. Hence if you choose the Wings out of all the teams you are likely, though not necessarily, a bandwagon fan. The Wings have always been my second favourite team and I don't begrudge their success to their fans. But, I'd put the (long suffering) Vancouver fanbase up against the Wings' any day.
  8. I have no idea where you get the idea that Vancouver has bandwagon fans. Currently Vancouver has the longest sellout streak in the NHL. Given Vancouver's history of playoff failure its a wonder they as man fans as they do. No only that, Vancouver vs. Nashville drew the highest ratings ever for a second round series on CBC. Vancouver has plenty of diehard fans. Its so easy to be a Wings fan. An attitude like yours makes me sick. Cheering for the Wings is like cheering for the Yankees (its fine if you're from Detroit, but if you're not from Detroit you're the definition of a bandwagon fan). 20 years straight in the playoffs and 4 cups during that time. Miss the playoffs 2 out of 3 season and comeback and talk to me about being a diehard. My guess is that Wings haven't missed the playoffs since you were a small boy and most Wings fans cannot remember what it was like to support a struggling franchise.
  9. Without trying offend, you guys simply don't understand. The CBC stands for Canadian Broadcast Corporation. CBC is going to be pro-Canadian. They are not a private corporation, they are actually funded by the Canadian government. So it is substantially different when the CBC broadcasts a game involving a Canadian team than anything that occurs in the United States. NBC has corporate masters and are not funded directly by the American people. Further, while you may not see the bias, it is overtly apparent in any and all American coverage of anything that is American. Americans are not ashamed of it, and nor should they be. But for Americans to call out the CBC for being biased is a little unfair in my view. The CBC's market is Canadians. They don't consider American viewers and frankly, why should they? The CBC has nothing to do with the United States. Just as it is the case that the Canucks have never appeared on Sunday NBC hockey there is no reason for the CBC to cover American teams equally to Canadian (though oftentimes they do). Another thing you all may or may not know is that Jim Hughson is a Vancouverite. He used to cover the Canucks locally as our play-by-play man for the radio station that used to carry Canuck games. He took over in 1995 after the Cup finals. So when Jim is at the mic oftentimes his bias seeps through. Though I think he does a reasonable job of remaning fair and balanced. And further, if you watch a Red Wings game on CBC (which I've watched many) you hear endless praise heaped on the organization, the players (past and present), the culture, the style of play, the tradition...etc. In fact, I think the Wings get the most love out of any non-Canadian franchise on the CBC (and on TSN / Rogers Sportsnet). Further, it has become something of a national crisis in Canada that a Canadian-based team hasn't won the cup since 1993. Whether you guys understand it or not, Canadians view hockey as our game. We take it very seriously and it is seen as a tragedy that markets like Anaheim, Carolina, Tampa Bay and Dallas have won Cups with relatively young NHL franchises and with fan bases that don't really understand what takes to win the cup. Even Colorado could be included in that group. So you all of 4 cups in 13 years (is that right???) should understand that the CBC, like most Canadians just want to see the Cup come home, to where (they/we) feel it belongs. Even if it is just once every 17 years. And truly Wings fans, we're all just jealous of you. I mean that. Wings are a model of consistency and success. No need to sweat the small stuff.
  10. If I were a Redwings fan I'd have a lot of confidence going up against Vancouver. Wings have the mystique, the experience and proven playoff performers. Sure they have a no-name Goalie, but Luongo has STUNK (believe me I've been watching) since before the Olympics. He's head phucked right now, and if I've learned anything being a Canuck fan for 20 years, if something can go wrong it will. Zetterberg and Datsyuk will own the Canuck defense. It might be a shootout series and the Canucks COULD win it, but if I were betting I'd put my money on Lidstrom any day. Just my opinion, not trying to put down my team. I just have a lot of respect for the Wings (and I think players do to). Warranted (this season) or not, they have a a reputation for getting it done and that can affect anyone's psychological approach to playing them.
  11. Since I'm not a Wings fan... 1. Nicklas Lidstrom 2. Alexander Ovechkin 3. Evegeni Malkin 4. Jerome Iginla 5. Alexander Semin Inactive Players... 1. Pavel Bure 2. Igor Larionov 3. Alex Mogilny 4. Mario Lemieux 5. Steve Yzerman
  12. Dude I personally think Crosby is kind of a *****. I just respect his skill as a hockey player. And I'm sure you'll see what I mean in 2010 when he slices up Sweden and Russia on the way to gold. I don't know if its lost on you or not, but if you're busy in the offensive zone then you don't need a heck of a lot of defensive skills. The other team can't score 200' from the net. Not to mention there are 3rd and 4th line players on most team who all they do is play defensive hockey. Also, not to mention defensive skills can be taught, offensive flair is pretty much something you cannot coach. Also Sid isn't that brutal in his defensive zone. THERE IS NOT DOUBT Z AND D ARE FANTASTIC HOCKEY PLAYERS. They are stars in this league and great ones at that, but Crosby is once or twice in a generation type talent. And if you don't believe me, ask Gretzky. Z and D are good defensively because they are veterans and they know the game of hockey from years of experience. 5 years ago Crosby was in high school. Of course he's still learning the game. But to put up 120+ points before you're 20, just look at all the guys who have done that before him and how they turned out. I'm not crapping on your stars, god knows I'd pay a lot to have either of those guys on my team. I'm just saying 2 for 1 is a discussion worth having and 1 for 1 is a done deal. Think about it this way, if you were GM in Pittsburgh would you flip Crosby for Zetterberg? One thing I will give you dudes credit for (unlike boards elsewhere around the league) is that you've refrained (mostly) from name calling and insulting in order to have a reasonable chat even when you take what I'm saying as offensive. Well done.
  13. I said player, because I meant player. Nick Lidstrom is one of the best, if not the best player EVER. Ok, maybe not ever. But you get my point. Lidstrom is the straw the stirs your drink there in Detroit. Vincent Lecavelier has done what...won a cup with a team not NEARLY as stacked as Detroit was last year. Iginla has carried that Flames franchise for a decade. And Malkin...well just wait on him. What you guys don't understand is that I am looking at this trade from the perspective of the future. Unless you think Datsyuk is like Yzmerman, Sakic and Lemieux he is due to level off sharply in the next couple of seasons. Many players who peak late and perform at a high level from late 20s to early 30s only sustain for a few short years. This is not to say that you would be better off with Crosby than Z and D this season, but 5 years from now and 10 years from now you are certainly better of with Crosby. Don't overall value your stars players because you are comfortable with them. Don't assume Crosby wouldn't buy into the Wings machine because he's Syd the Kid. The reality of the situation is Crosby is a student of the game -- and he respects his elders and goes about his business much like Wayne Gretzky. If you think Yzerman, Howe and Lidstrom aren't enough to mold Crosby into what you want him to be (like Z and D?), you're out to lunch. Just because you might not like Crosby's on ice personality doesn't mean he isn't a fantastic player. Capable of making any team (ANY TEAM) better. Some of you guys are the one's drinking the cool-aid. Haha, just kidding. You don't break up a cup winner.
  14. Fickle Wings Fans. I'd probably trade you're two top...10 (not top 5) forwards for Sid. And I'd certainly trade either one of them in a heartbeat. 1. Sid 2. Alex 3. Iginla 4. Lecavelier 5. Malkin Before last season's cup you were practically running your boys out of town. No doubt Z and D are awesome players but Crosby they are not. They grew up in the Wings culture and they have been mentored and tutored by Yzerman, Shanahan, and Lidstrom in a winning tradtion. They have had a tremendous leg up on Crosby and yet they are still not even the best players on your team. A few more losses to Toronto and Vancouver and most of you would be all over this deal. And for those of you scoffing at the 1 for 1 suggestion you really need to consider what you're claiming.
  15. Chris Osgood will not make the Hall of Fame. Yikes.