hillbillywingsfan 794 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 Show me what worse things Hull has done than this. did you forget about the 98 olympics? did you pass over that little gem? Chelios and Roenick?..hmmmm you memory is spotty Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 Of course there's dissent with it. I don't agree with a good portion of s*** the league does. However, this pertains to the case at hand, not everything else the league does. If a person makes a suggestion that speaking out against Bettman means they get suspended, which is why players didn't come out in Avery's defense, they likely should at least show who's been suspended. Right now the only thing that IS apparent, is players, especially his own teammates, and even opponents, have come out and said how stupid it was, and deserving at that. And your only argument is "just because you can't see it doesn't mean it ain't there"? Why should I give in to a point without any basis or rationality? You haven't an ounce of credibility behind that argument. So based on your response here we can all easily discern that every player and coach is in complete agreement with what has transpired in this latest Avery incident, especially the suspension, right? Because if they weren't in total agreement, we would see players and coaches speaking out in the media, and since there haven't been any, that can ONLY mean they all agree, right? I mean there's absolutely no fear of any kind of reprimand from the league at all so why wouldn't they speak out? There's never been any "proof" of anyone ever being reprimanded for comments against the league or its commisioner so that must mean the fear of reprimand is completely bogus and it's ok to do it, right? I mean the only reason players and coaches haven't spoken out about the league and the commisioner's decisions up to this point is obviously because they have always agreed with everything the league has done and all its decisions. Is that accurate? See how ridiculous that sounds? esteef Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted December 10, 2008 (edited) did you forget about the 98 olympics? did you pass over that little gem? Chelios and Roenick?..hmmmm you memory is spotty You're absolutely right. They probably hurt the hotel room's feelings. They should go apologize to it at once. How would you propose this is actually worse than what Avery did? So based on your response here we can all easily discern that every player and coach is in complete agreement with what has transpired in this latest Avery incident, especially the suspension, right? Because if they weren't in total agreement, we would see players and coaches speaking out in the media, and since there haven't been any, that can ONLY mean they all agree, right? I mean there's absolutely no fear of any kind of reprimand from the league at all so why wouldn't they speak out? There's never been any "proof" of anyone ever being reprimanded for comments against the league or its commisioner so that must mean the fear of reprimand is completely bogus and it's ok to do it, right? I mean the only reason players and coaches haven't spoken out about the league and the commisioner's decisions up to this point is obviously because they have always agreed with everything the league has done and all its decisions. Is that accurate? See how ridiculous that sounds? esteef Ahh, two can play this game.. So based on your response here we can easily discern that no player and coach is in complete agreement with what has transpired, right? Because if they were in total agreement, we'd see all the players and coaches speaking out in agreement, and since there haven't been any, that can ONLY mean they all disagree, right? I mean, there's absolutely a fear of reprimand from the league entirely so why wouldn't they speak out against such a fear? There's never been any "proof" of anyone ever being reprimanded for comments against the league or it's commissioner so that must mean the fear of being reprimanded is completely valid and it's ok to do. I mean, the only reason players and coaches haven't spoken out about the league and the commissioner's decisions up to this point is obviously because they have never agreed with anything the league has done and all of it's decisions. Is that accurate? See how ridiculous that sounds? Edited December 10, 2008 by Shoreline Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 You're absolutely right. They probably hurt the hotel room's feelings. They should go apologize to it at once. How would you propose this is actually worse than what Avery did? Ahh, two can play this game.. So based on your response here we can easily discern that no player and coach is in complete agreement with what has transpired, right? Because if they were in total agreement, we'd see all the players and coaches speaking out in agreement, and since there haven't been any, that can ONLY mean they all disagree, right? I mean, there's absolutely a fear of reprimand from the league entirely so why wouldn't they speak out against such a fear? There's never been any "proof" of anyone ever being reprimanded for comments against the league or it's commissioner so that must mean the fear of being reprimanded is completely valid and it's ok to do. I mean, the only reason players and coaches haven't spoken out about the league and the commissioner's decisions up to this point is obviously because they have never agreed with anything the league has done and all of it's decisions. Is that accurate? See how ridiculous that sounds? So no one in Dallas spoke out in support of the punishment? No One? No players (wishing to remain anonymous?), no coaches, no GM's? Please... you're just flailing to hang on to your point now. esteef Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted December 10, 2008 So no one in Dallas spoke out in support of the punishment? No One? No players (wishing to remain anonymous?), no coaches, no GM's? Please... you're just flailing to hang on to your point now. esteef Flailing? No, I wasn't even arguing a point there, but merely doing what you're doing and taking someone else's point to the extreme to make mine seem all the more logical, when someone making a valid point doesn't have to. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ManLuv4Clears 7 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 I think we need to go back to the basics here. Lot's of good points being made, however he said "Sloppy Seconds!" Big, f'n deal!! In the opinions of myself, most on this board, and pretty much everyone in both the TV and radio sports world. This is getting blown wait out of proportion and being dissected way too much. Shoreline, unless you are indeed Elisha Cuthbert (which I highly doubt because you are much more articulate than she is), in a basic sense I'm trying to determine why you are so offended or up in arms by his actions. In my opinion, the American team trashing a hotel in a different county IS worse because that reflects America as a whole. This is just a guy trying to get a reaction, and he more than accomplished this as you can tell from the 500+ posts in this thread alone. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
drwscc 212 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 Maybe Shoreline is Marty Brodeur, and still holds a grudge against Avery for calling him Fatso. Avery is Avery. I still think this should have been left to the team to handle. There was no need for a 6 game suspension for this. By this logic, Thierren from the Pens will get suspended for the entire playoffs when he whines about the lack of obstruction calls. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OsGOD 3 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 I think we need to go back to the basics here. Lot's of good points being made, however he said "Sloppy Seconds!" Big, f'n deal!! In the opinions of myself, most on this board, and pretty much everyone in both the TV and radio sports world. This is getting blown wait out of proportion and being dissected way too much. Shoreline, unless you are indeed Elisha Cuthbert (which I highly doubt because you are much more articulate than she is), in a basic sense I'm trying to determine why you are so offended or up in arms by his actions. In my opinion, the American team trashing a hotel in a different county IS worse because that reflects America as a whole. This is just a guy trying to get a reaction, and he more than accomplished this as you can tell from the 500+ posts in this thread alone. very nicely pointed. Bettman claims this sheds a dark light on the sport of hockey if left untouched.... yet trashing the room on not just a national but international stage was pretty much left to ... whatev... they were pissed they lost. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Opie 308 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 very nicely pointed. Bettman claims this sheds a dark light on the sport of hockey if left untouched.... yet trashing the room on not just a national but international stage was pretty much left to ... whatev... they were pissed they lost. They weren't there as representatives of the NHL, they were there representing their country. The NHL had no grounds to do a damned thing. Just saying. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OsGOD 3 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 So no one in Dallas spoke out in support of the punishment? No One? No players (wishing to remain anonymous?), no coaches, no GM's? Please... you're just flailing to hang on to your point now. esteef I think Brett Hull summed it up quite nicely when he said, "I like to think I speak for a lot of the players. But a lot of the players don't ever support me, which pisses me off." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted December 10, 2008 I think we need to go back to the basics here. Lot's of good points being made, however he said "Sloppy Seconds!" Big, f'n deal!! In the opinions of myself, most on this board, and pretty much everyone in both the TV and radio sports world. This is getting blown wait out of proportion and being dissected way too much. Shoreline, unless you are indeed Elisha Cuthbert (which I highly doubt because you are much more articulate than she is), in a basic sense I'm trying to determine why you are so offended or up in arms by his actions. In my opinion, the American team trashing a hotel in a different county IS worse because that reflects America as a whole. This is just a guy trying to get a reaction, and he more than accomplished this as you can tell from the 500+ posts in this thread alone. Firstly, I'm not offended by it. I say some of the most vulgar s*** here, albeit rarely to the extent of what my humor extends to as I bet even the moderators will easily have enough of that if I did. Secondly, "sloppy seconds" does not mean having Sloppy Joe's for seconds. I don't care for looking at two words individually (like he has to say f*** and s*** for it to mean anything.. does he actually have to describe blowing a load in Cuthbert for you to get that's what he means?), but what the words mean, and what the intent was behind saying them. He was trying to embarrass both Phaneuf and Cuthbert and using the hockey media as an outlet for it, for something unrelated to hockey at all. Not quite sure what you're complaining about though. Just because you think trashing an NHL room (again, maybe the U.S. guys should apologize to the room and be suspended if it's feelings were hurt) is worse than basically Avery's embarrassing his teammates and the league, doesn't mean others don't find it differently. Beyond that, you have to admit it's kinda fun watching some posters look absolutely silly with their arguments. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hillbillywingsfan 794 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 You're absolutely right. They probably hurt the hotel room's feelings. They should go apologize to it at once. How would you propose this is actually worse than what Avery did? talk about kids table response. how do you not see it isn't worse? sloppy seconds is no where near as bad. lets talk about a whole country feeling that one. if you remember correctly the league wasn't doing good then...it was hard enough to try and get 1000 people to watch a damn game..then that happens. im just glad they didn;t do anything to the capitan of the team. or how would that of looked. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OsGOD 3 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 (edited) They weren't there as representatives of the NHL, they were there representing their country. The NHL had no grounds to do a damned thing. Just saying. o rly NHL May Carry Over Olympic Suspensions Commissioner Gary Bettman said today that players suspended during the nine-day Olympic hockey tournament risk having the bans extended into the NHL season when it resumes Feb. 25. I might be way misundertanding bettmans words but it seems likey they very well could have been repremanded by the NHL afterall... if it was deemed bad enough. Like it or not they were all still representing the NHL as a whole being over there... or else they would have just stuck to the traditional "non-professional" athletes in the olympics Edited December 10, 2008 by OsGOD Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ManLuv4Clears 7 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 Firstly, I'm not offended by it. I say some of the most vulgar s*** here, albeit rarely to the extent of what my humor extends to as I bet even the moderators will easily have enough of that if I did. Secondly, "sloppy seconds" does not mean having Sloppy Joe's for seconds. I don't care for looking at two words individually (like he has to say f*** and s*** for it to mean anything.. does he actually have to describe blowing a load in Cuthbert for you to get that's what he means?), but what the words mean, and what the intent was behind saying them. He was trying to embarrass both Phaneuf and Cuthbert and using the hockey media as an outlet for it, for something unrelated to hockey at all. Not quite sure what you're complaining about though. Just because you think trashing an NHL room (again, maybe the U.S. guys should apologize to the room and be suspended if it's feelings were hurt) is worse than basically Avery's embarrassing his teammates and the league, doesn't mean others don't find it differently. Beyond that, you have to admit it's kinda fun watching some posters look absolutely silly with their arguments. Ok, I understand your position on this. I'm not really complaining, I just have the feeling that the American team acting like jack asses after they lost was a poor reflection on America in general. It's like we need another reason for anyone outside the US to hate on us. At any rate, their actions were looked down upon in the media, but that lasted about a week and then it was done, where this is still going. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 Firstly, I'm not offended by it. I say some of the most vulgar s*** here, albeit rarely to the extent of what my humor extends to as I bet even the moderators will easily have enough of that if I did. Secondly, "sloppy seconds" does not mean having Sloppy Joe's for seconds. I don't care for looking at two words individually (like he has to say f*** and s*** for it to mean anything.. does he actually have to describe blowing a load in Cuthbert for you to get that's what he means?), but what the words mean, and what the intent was behind saying them. He was trying to embarrass both Phaneuf and Cuthbert and using the hockey media as an outlet for it, for something unrelated to hockey at all. Not quite sure what you're complaining about though. Just because you think trashing an NHL room (again, maybe the U.S. guys should apologize to the room and be suspended if it's feelings were hurt) is worse than basically Avery's embarrassing his teammates and the league, doesn't mean others don't find it differently. Beyond that, you have to admit it's kinda fun watching some posters look absolutely silly with their arguments. Silly indeed. esteef Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted December 10, 2008 (edited) talk about kids table response. how do you not see it isn't worse? sloppy seconds is no where near as bad. lets talk about a whole country feeling that one. if you remember correctly the league wasn't doing good then...it was hard enough to try and get 1000 people to watch a damn game..then that happens. im just glad they didn;t do anything to the capitan of the team. or how would that of looked. Are league rules enforced in the Olympics? Last I checked, that's the IOC's realm. Even Goodenow said any outrage over it (which there was few of) was overblown. Selective outrage rears it's ugly head. Silly indeed. esteef f*** Bettman!! (x500) Free Avery!! (x501) Edited December 10, 2008 by Shoreline Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 (edited) f*** Bettman!! (x500) Free Avery!! (x501) Now you're gettin' it! Although I'm not a Bettman hater, I'm more of a Bettman Hater Sympathizer. esteef Edited December 10, 2008 by esteef Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Opie 308 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 o rly NHL May Carry Over Olympic Suspensions I might be way misundertanding bettmans words but it seems likey they very well could have been repremanded by the NHL afterall... if it was deemed bad enough. Like it or not they were all still representing the NHL as a whole being over there... or else they would have just stuck to the traditional "non-professional" athletes in the olympics Not arguing with you just making points. Having said that to the last part of your post, simply put to get the best athletes to represent their countries, it had less to due with representing the NHL as compared to the Countries (US specifically) being down in the medal count and viewing that as some marker of who you are as a country so the US and other countries started using pro athletes. IF you ask me I liked it better when a bunch of no name college kids beat the Russians, but that is just me and now with pro athletes I can never really root for the US as the true underdog anymore or I will never see any event like the Miracle ever again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hillbillywingsfan 794 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 Are league rules enforced in the Olympics? Last I checked, that's the IOC's realm. Even Goodenow said any outrage over it (which there was few of) was overblown. Selective outrage rears it's ugly head. f*** Bettman!! (x500) Free Avery!! (x501) here let me post this one again for you. damn you miss a lot. blindness rears its ugly head. NHL May Carry Over Olympic Suspensions Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted December 10, 2008 (edited) here let me post this one again for you. damn you miss a lot. blindness rears its ugly head. NHL May Carry Over Olympic Suspensions Damn, I sure do miss a lot. How many people were suspended? I missed that part too. I also missed the part where your link was broken. Edited December 10, 2008 by Shoreline Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Opie 308 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 Damn, I sure do miss a lot. How many people were suspended? I missed that part too. I also missed the part where your link was broken. His link maybe hosed but Osgod's works! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted December 10, 2008 (edited) His link maybe hosed but Osgod's works! I found this part about the article here interesting, since no one is telling me who was actually suspended (you know, that pesky "proof" thing.. the thorn in hillbilly's side in his world-of-wild-tangent-assertions ). Hockey's governing bodies usually do not honor each other's suspensions. Anaheim's Ruslan Salei, the first NHL player to score a goal in the Olympics, had been assessed a two-game suspension for a head-butt in that Feb. 1 Chicago-Anaheim game. The suspension allowed him to arrive early in Nagano. Sounds like Gary was also downplaying it: Bettman said that each case would have to be decided on its own merits. If the International Ice Hockey Federation takes disciplinary action, "it's something we'll have to look at coming back," he said. "We might decide to make the same determination." Bettman said the disciplinary action against Suter might have been more severe had the NHL not received a positive medical report on Kariya at the time. Now, some on the Canadian team are speculating Kariya might not play for some time. If there was any proof of s*** here there'd be no speculation. Edited December 10, 2008 by Shoreline Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hillbillywingsfan 794 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 I found this part about the article here interesting, since no one is telling me who was actually suspended (you know, that pesky "proof" thing.. the thorn in hillbilly's side in his world-of-wild-tangent-assertions ). Sounds like Gary was also downplaying it: If there was any proof of s*** here there'd be no speculation. thats the whole point..no one was...you are missing the whole point that everyone is trying to say....avreys comments were not as bad as what happened in the 98 olypics where no one got suspended..but avrey gets it for saying sloppy seconds...6 damn games!?!?!?! come on. flopping. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OsGOD 3 Report post Posted December 10, 2008 All that was pointing out was that if deemed terrible the acts could be pushishable in the NHL level for action on the international level (as per what Opie was talking about) Obviously what this means is that Destroying a Hotel room is a lot less detrimental than calling some chick sloppy seconds. Which i find pretty silly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted December 10, 2008 (edited) thats the whole point..no one was...you are missing the whole point that everyone is trying to say....avreys comments were not as bad as what happened in the 98 olypics where no one got suspended..but avrey gets it for saying sloppy seconds...6 damn games!?!?!?! come on. flopping. Yeah, Avery was probably talking about food. It's just sloppy seconds. Why would the NHL care? It's not like sloppy seconds is obscene or anything. Edited December 10, 2008 by Shoreline Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
