What do you do with a struggling goaltender?

[Outsider 42]

All of that from one little statement? Amazing. You really are amazing. I stopped reading about half-way through this latest diatribe.

Wow.

Shame you didn't exercise the same discipline prior to hitting the "Add Reply" button....

[puckloo39 5,686]

Shame you didn't exercise the same discipline prior to hitting the "Add Reply" button....

You just bring out the best in me, what can I say??

[Outsider 42]

I am sure I will be sorry for asking, but who's Ozzie's coach this year?

Last Season Osgood was working under the tutelage of Stan Matwijiw. By all reports, Osgood has been working exclusively with Jim Bedard this Season.

Ozzie doesn't even resemble the same goalie we last saw in June. Can we get that coach back, maybe? The only difference in the team this season vs last season is the absence of Hasek.

Not even YOU, with your fangirlie goggles on, can possibly believe that one.

When even the play of the Great Nicklas Lidstrom has been suspect, the loss of a 43 year old goaltender who was past his prime BEFORE last Season even began can hardly be construed as a loss. I'd say the loss of Chris Chelios has been a greater blow to this Team.

Edited December 17, 2008 by Outsider

[Outsider 42]

You just bring out the best in me, what can I say??

Really? That's your "best"?

Oy....

[puckloo39 5,686]

Last Season Osgood was working under the tutelage of Stan Matwijiw. By all reports, Osgood has been working exclusively with Jim Bedard this Season.

Not even YOU, with your fangirlie goggles on, can possibly believe that one.

When even the play of the Great Nicklas Lidstrom has been suspect, the loss of a 43 year old goaltender who was past his prime BEFORE last Season even began can hardly be construed as a loss. I'd say the loss of Chris Chelios has been a greater blow to this Team.

So, if Bedard is so bad, wonder why the Red Wings have retained his services all these years? I saw clips of Ozzie last season working with Bedard in practices. I am really not sure how Bedard has been instrumental in ruining Oz's game this season.

All I am saying is that nothing of consequence (according to a lot of posters here) has changed in the make up of the team, from last season to this one. If you think Dom contributed nothing to the win last season, I would have to respectfully disagree.

There is clearly something missing from the equation. I am not saying it's Ozzie's fault.

You don't need to launch personal attacks and post page-long rants to make a point, just because I don't agree with you. I'm really not worth it.

edit: You say the 43 year old Hasek was past his prime before last season? The 42 year old Hasek consistently lead the league in sv%age and GAA the previous season, give or take a week or so. He got the Wings to the finals for the first time since 2002, when he left. I guess if a player like Dom can completely lose it over a summer, it's possible anyone could. However, to have a direct comparison, you'd have find another goalie who's still playing in the number 1 spot at 43.

Edited December 17, 2008 by puckloo39

[Hockeytown0001 7,652]

actually in light of the person whom started this thread and what happened to GW this weekend... i would say next game everyone take off their shoes and start throwing them at Ozzie showing their disdain for the the "almost" conference leading record so far this season.

Nah, I say just throw some Ozzie jersies on the ice ala Hasek in 2002; after that his game turned around pretty quickly, why not try it again?

[Outsider 42]

I ain't the only "fangirlie" in this conversation, without a doubt. I understand your over the top Ozzie love, if anyone does, so I don't really blame you.

Fair enough. Me, a "fangirlie".....Now I'm all blushy and aflutter. Shucks.

So, if Bedard is so bad, wonder why the Red Wings have retained his services all these years? I saw clips of Ozzie last season working with Bedard in practices. I am really not sure how Bedard has been instrumental in ruining Oz's game this season.

I wouldn't say that Jim Bedard is a "bad" goaltending coach. He's great for drills, and for working the goalie WITH the Team. One-on-One, specialized, intensive goaltending TRAINING? He's not cut out for it. He's a dinosaur. Hockey in general, and Goaltending in particular, has changed dramatically since the last time Bedard was neck deep in pucks, and he hasn't bothered to bring himself up to speed.

He's like your old high school, (maybe Jr. High School, depending on your age), typing teacher. Wrong equipment for the era. An IBM electric typewriter, with AutoCorrect, was the BOMB back in it's day. And in a pinch, I suppose it could still be still functional. But, really.....

All I am saying is that nothing of consequence (according to a lot of posters here) has changed in the make up of the teeam, from last season to this one.

Much, and much of consequence , has changed since last Season. They can't make an outlet pass to save their lives. They can't clear the zone. They're losing every single puck battle, large and small. They're sloppy in their own zone, indifferent in the neutral zone, and arrogant in the offensive zone. They're not blocking shots. They're not sacrificing the body to make the play. They play as though they honestly believe that they can show up, hit the ice, and win the game in the last 10 minutes, without having to put up an effort for the first 50.

It wasn't their skill, (which is, admittedly, great), which won them games last Season. It was the fact that they WORKED. They were absolute BEASTS last Season.

This Season? Not even in the same vicinity, as far as work ethic goes. They're trying to win on skill alone.

That is a recipe for disaster.

There is clearly something missing from the equation. I am not saying it's Ozzie's fault.

Chris Osgood must bear at least some of the brunt for it. And he is. Just look around. He's being shredded, from Coast to Coast, in two Nations, for his play this Season. And NO ONE is being more vicious than fans in his own town, supposedly fans of "his" Team, when the truth of the matter is, while he IS partially to blame, he's not alone. Not even close to it. Everyone shares a hand in this.

You don't need to launch personal attacks and post page-long rants, just because I don't agree with you. I'm really not worth it.

Well then....

Finally, something we can agree on.

<smirk>

But seriously....

We all, as fans, (regardless of which number adorns the Winged Wheel in our hearts), need to vent occasionally. It's cathartic. And if we all had the same opinions....

What a boring, sterile world we would inhabit.

Right?

[Outsider 42]

edit: You say the 43 year old Hasek was past his prime before last season? The 42 year old Hasek consistently lead the league in sv%age and GAA the previous season, give or take a week or so. He got the Wings to the finals for the first time since 2002, when he left. I guess if a player like Dom can completely lose it over a summer, it's possible anyone could. However, to have a direct comparison, you'd have find another goalie who's still playing in the number 1 spot at 43.

Ooooohhhhh....

See...and I've just made an effort to make "nice" in closing my last post.

If I respond to this with how I truly feel....things are gonna get uuuuuugly.

But I will say this....

He didn't get them to the Finals the previous year. The Wings made it to the Conference Finals. And that's all I'm going to say about that.....

Edited December 17, 2008 by Outsider

[RockyMountainWingGal 108]

With all due respect, to both yourself, and to Mr. Bedard....

Jim Bedard, in his twelve year tenure as goaltending coach for the Detroit Red Wings, has produced precisely how many NHL goaltenders, out of a stable of how many good goaltending prospects?

I'm not even talkin' about Top Notch, elite goaltenders. I'm talking about guys who've made it to the NHL in any capacity, at all.

You make an excellent point about our GT development in your post (full version omitted).

I suppose before the lockout the Wings could always rely on an expensive trade (Hasek) or expensive free agent (Cujo) to fill the starting goalie needs.

In the cap era, developing your own goalies will be more important. Not saying they should fire Bedard, but the Wings should at least look at the situation. Maybe things will change with McCollum - guess we'll have to wait and see - like we've been doing with most of the guys you listed for years.....

[Outsider 42]

You make an excellent point about our GT development in your post (full version omitted).

I suppose before the lockout the Wings could always rely on an expensive trade (Hasek) or expensive free agent (Cujo) to fill the starting goalie needs.

In the cap era, developing your own goalies will be more important. Not saying they should fire Bedard, but the Wings should at least look at the situation. Maybe things will change with McCollum - guess we'll have to wait and see - like we've been doing with most of the guys you listed for years.....

If McCollum shows as much promise as reports indicate, one would hope they'd get the matter looked after PRIOR to watching the slow, steady decline of yet another top goaltending prospect.

I'm not stating that I think the Wings should fire Bedard. He's a quality person, and he's an asset to the coaching staff. That said....

Perhaps they need to start "phasing in" a new Goaltending Coach. Jimmy Bedard is what, 51? 52? Maybe keep Bedard on to work the goalies in drills, and with the Team, but bring in a younger guy for more focused, intense goaltender training.

[gcom007 1,465]

Relax, wait it out, see how things go. Do little things here and there to try and trigger motivation and competition but show confidence and encourage at times as well. That seems best to me. And conveniently, that's about what Babcock's doing. When you've got a lot of little problems that are team-wide and there's not one guy clearly standing on his head, you can't do anything to drastic. You just have to weather the storm a bit and trust in the professionalism of these guys to come through in the end and it likely will. I don't think Osgood will be anything less than 100% ready for the playoffs and I don't think age has or will hurt his game much due to the style of game he plays. He's much more of a mental goaltender than an athletic goaltender and always has been. He'll sort that out and be fine. I'm a bit more worried about the D personally, but that too, I think will work itself out by February/March. And to be frank, I'm totally game going into the Playoffs like this. Adversity suits this team better than over-confidence.

[ben_usmc 253]

he has been horrible, why does everyone have to put the blame all on the D. The D actually has improved through out the season, not much but it has. Ozzy on the other hand has declined even more, maybe he needs better warm ups or what, because the 1st shot is going on him. After about 2 goals he then starts to show some flashes of the past, but still give up rebounds. On top of that our 4th line can't clear the zone because they are either dinosaurs or sever underachievers.

[Outsider 42]

Relax, wait it out, see how things go. Do little things here and there to try and trigger motivation and competition but show confidence and encourage at times as well. That seems best to me. And conveniently, that's about what Babcock's doing. When you've got a lot of little problems that are team-wide and there's not one guy clearly standing on his head, you can't do anything to drastic. You just have to weather the storm a bit and trust in the professionalism of these guys to come through in the end and it likely will. I don't think Osgood will be anything less than 100% ready for the playoffs and I don't think age has or will hurt his game much due to the style of game he plays. He's much more of a mental goaltender than an athletic goaltender and always has been. He'll sort that out and be fine. I'm a bit more worried about the D personally, but that too, I think will work itself out by February/March. And to be frank, I'm totally game going into the Playoffs like this. Adversity suits this team better than over-confidence.

GAAAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!

Damn you and your logic, gcom....

We're Wings fans, not Vulcans!