Red Wings' Osgood out with groin injury

[Outsider 42]

Starting tommorow, Ozzie will be on the LTIR for the Winter Classic, go figure. Conklin will have played all three because of injury, haha.

***unjinx***

He's not on LTIR just yet. Holland stated today the Ozzie felt "better" today after receiving treatment. (Commence with the jokes speculating on approved "treatment" for tight groins in 3...2...1...).

Kenny stated today that:

"It's just a slight groin strain, he played with it against Colorado (Monday)''.

"We're going to see how he feels tomorrow.''

"There's no doubt he can go in and play if he had to."

I, for one, am hoping it's just a little tweak, and he'll be fine.

<smirk>

Judging by the content of lots of Wings message boards, I appear to be in the minority.

Edited December 18, 2008 by Outsider

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

OMG I totally forgot about how this might put him out for the winter classic if it's long term. Nooo I wanted to see him play that game.

[T.Low 1,011]

I think a lot of people, myself included, just want to see somebody different in net for a few games. I am kinda anxious to see how Howard or Larsssssson would perform. Personally, I don't care if the Wings don't win the Presidents Trophy this year. It might do them some good not to. I'd be willing to gamble just to see the youngens play a few. Like last year when they went 1-10 as the Detroit Red Griffs. It was an interesting spell.

[Guest mindfly]

I'm just hyper about Larsson because I know he was a real WALL back in Sweden, and so far played good in GR, but i guess the speed the skill level on NHL could make him look less good but he could become a no.1 goalie no doubt.

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

You're being ignorant.... zero professional experience? Last time I checked AHL is professional hockey.

I'm being ignorant? You know damn well what I meant by "professional" hockey experience. Don't try and split hairs....and BTW, the AHL isn't NHL. If you truly believe its very comparable...watch a game.

He has good stats with Grand Rapids thus far, better than Howard, so LOGIC would dictate that if you need to bring someone up, you bring up who is playing better, it's all temporary anyway.

I think you were too quick to hit the reply button instead of actually understanding what I was saying. The fact of the matter is that while both current Wings goaltenders are struggling, the defense is playing just as porous. Then you suggest bringing a kid up with zero NHL experience to play in front of that? That's a horrible idea for his confidence.

By your method, players would not develop because you wouldn't challenge them and give them opportunity, otherwise what is the point? You would rather leave Larsson down in the minors for several years instead of the possibility that maybe he has something beneficial to his game that goes beyond experience? Ever look around the league and see how many inexperienced goaltenders on weaker teams are having breakout years? Didn't think so. I'm really unbiased about who we bring up, because I think both Howard and Larsson are qualified, but once again, LOGIC dictates you bring up the hotter hand.

By my method? Since when do you know my method based on the single comment I made? Never once have I said a player should rot in the AHL because they don't have adequate experience. What *I* said in my previous post was that sticking a young, unproven goaltender with zero NHL experience into a situation where the defense is playing horrendously is a recipe for disaster.

This has to do with how the team is playing in front of them much more so than which goalie to bring up....but go ahead and keep jumping to conclusions that I didn't make.

[puckloo39 5,686]

I'm just hyper about Larsson because I know he was a real WALL back in Sweden, and so far played good in GR, but i guess the speed the skill level on NHL could make him look less good but he could become a no.1 goalie no doubt.

I hope you're right. Good post!

[Spinner 6]

It will be what Ozzie needs to get his focus back. Conklin will play better and try to steal the #1 spot(which he will come close but not succeed because #30 will return once again as The Great and Powerful Oz) and whomever they bring up from G.R will only be the backup during that time period. Nothing more nothing less.

I have spoken LOL

[Hockeytown0001 7,652]

It will be what Ozzie needs to get his focus back. Conklin will play better and try to steal the #1 spot(which he will come close but not succeed because #30 will return once again as The Great and Powerful Oz) and whomever they bring up from G.R will only be the backup during that time period. Nothing more nothing less.

I have spoken LOL

That's something that contributed to his success last year with Dom, there was the friendly competition for the starting position. If the same happens with Conks, then we can hope that Ozzie will respond the same way as last season.

[Spinner 6]

That's something that contributed to his success last year with Dom, there was the friendly competition for the starting position. If the same happens with Conks, then we can hope that Ozzie will respond the same way as last season.

Let's hope so, Ozzie was great in the playoffs

[DYags 0]

I'd be more interested in seeing Larsson called up than Howard. His numbers are better and everything I read about him is positive. Why reward the second best?

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

I'd be more interested in seeing Larsson called up than Howard. His numbers are better and everything I read about him is positive. Why reward the second best?

Because its not as simple as just "rewarding the second best".....its about protecting the goalie that could potentially be your teams' future number 1 from a debilitating mental blow. The Wings' defense is horrid right now and calling up Larsson who has zero NHL playing experience could end up being incredibly damaging to his progress if the Wings continue to leave their goalies out to dry.

[DYags 0]

Because its not as simple as just "rewarding the second best".....its about protecting the goalie that could potentially be your teams' future number 1 from a debilitating mental blow. The Wings' defense is horrid right now and calling up Larsson who has zero NHL playing experience could end up being incredibly damaging to his progress if the Wings continue to leave their goalies out to dry.

Are you claiming that if he was to let in 5 goals on 10 shots and was pulled, his career may never be the same? I don't buy it. Furthermore, he'd play 3 games at most over the 10 game/24 day span and I can gaurantee the team D would be stellar on those occasions to protect him.

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

Are you claiming that if he was to let in 5 goals on 10 shots and was pulled, his career may never be the same? I don't buy it. Furthermore, he'd play 3 games at most over the 10 game/24 day span and I can gaurantee the team D would be stellar on those occasions to protect him.

Never once did I say his career would never be the same, but it could very well slow his progress down. That has happened to many goaltenders that are rushed too quickly onto their respective teams.

Are you claiming that if he was to let in 5 goals on 10 shots and was pulled, his career may never be the same? I don't buy it. Furthermore, he'd play 3 games at most over the 10 game/24 day span and I can gaurantee the team D would be stellar on those occasions to protect him.

You can guarantee it? Based on what? The Wings' team defense has been beyond rough this season so why do you think they'll magically play stellar in front of a young goalie?

Play a little better: sure. Steller: I doubt it. Until this team commits to the forecheck it isn't going to happen.

[DYags 0]

Never once did I say his career would never be the same, but it could very well slow his progress down. That has happened to many goaltenders that are rushed too quickly onto their respective teams.

You can guarantee it? Based on what? The Wings' team defense has been beyond rough this season so why do you think they'll magically play stellar in front of a young goalie?

Play a little better: sure. Steller: I doubt it. Until this team commits to the forecheck it isn't going to happen.

You're right, stellar isn't the right word. But the team would play a defense first game to limit shots and scoring opportunities the way they wouldn't infront of the other two veteran goalies. And playing a couple games while the #1 goalie is out isn't being rushed into the team. If he were to go into the toilet after an unsuccessful stint in the NHL than he probably will never be a dependable NHL netminder anyway.

I understand where you're coming from, but I respectfully disagree.

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

You're right, stellar isn't the right word. But the team would play a defense first game to limit shots and scoring opportunities the way they wouldn't infront of the other two veteran goalies. And playing a couple games while the #1 goalie is out isn't being rushed into the team. If he were to go into the toilet after an unsuccessful stint in the NHL than he probably will never be a dependable NHL netminder anyway.

I understand where you're coming from, but I respectfully disagree.

This may or may not be an accurate question, but do you feel guys like Raycroft or LaBarbera are "dependible" NHL netminders? They both were rushed to play earlier than they should've and neither have shown consistency since. I get what you're saying in regards to it probably won't crush him, but it will set his progress back if he's shallacked in his short playing time, not to mention it would most likely throw his game off playing much less than he does in GR.

That's my point.

[DYags 0]

This may or may not be an accurate question, but do you feel guys like Raycroft or LaBarbera are "dependible" NHL netminders? They both were rushed to play earlier than they should've and neither have shown consistency since. I get what you're saying in regards to it probably won't crush him, but it will set his progress back if he's shallacked in his short playing time, not to mention it would most likely throw his game off playing much less than he does in GR.

That's my point.

No, I don't think they are. But I also wouldn't attribute that to their early playing careers. Take Howard for example, the kid has been in the Wings system since 2003 and a pro since 2005 and still hasn't shown he can be a dependable goalie. On the other hand you have Corey Price who IMO is a very dependable goalie and he wasn't nurtured for years before he got his shot. Larsson has shown more ability and consistancy throughout his career in Sweden and so far he's had a seemless transition to the smaller rink.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Didn't see this posted in the thread yet:

Red Wings GM Ken Holland sounded extremely concerned about Chris Osgood's injury status as goaltenders and groin injuries mix like water and sodium (explosive), and he revealed a key detail to the Detroit Free Press's Helene St. James:

December 18, Detroit Free Press: The Wings will be using backup goaltender Ty Conklin, as Chris Osgood is nursing a sore groin. General manager Ken Holland said the team would reassess Osgood this morning.

"He's been practicing and playing in the state he's in now for two weeks," Holland said. "He said he felt better today than yesterday. He's had an MRI, which showed just a slight groin strain. But it can linger. So do we shut him down, or can he back up? We'll see."

Maybe that explains his stats of late. Holland did tell the Detroit News's Dave Dye that Osgood has at least shown improvement, but the Red Wings face a big decision today:

December 18, Detroit News: "He felt better (Wednesday)," Holland said.

The Red Wings are right up against the salary cap. In order to bring up someone from the minors, such as Jimmy Howard , even to be the backup for a game, the Wings would have to put Osgood on the long-term injured list, which means he would have to miss at least 10 games, or Holland would need to make a trade to dump a salary.

Any player currently on the Wings' NHL roster would have to clear waivers, which takes 24 hours, before he could be sent to the minors to open up a spot.

To avoid these extreme measures, Holland is hoping Osgood can at least fill the backup role for a while until he's ready to start.

The Wings obviously don't want to provoke another Kyle Quincey situation, especially as Derek Meech has proven himself to be a capable #6 defenceman and a solid fourth-line forward.

If it's really been affecting him for two weeks, my questions is, shouldn't they have done something about it earlier? It's not like he was playing stellar in spite of his injury.

And once again the Wings are up against the cap and will have to make some creative moves with their roster.

EDIT: forgot linky

http://blog.mlive.com/snapshots/2008/12/as...ods_been_p.html

Edited December 18, 2008 by haroldsnepsts

[Opie 308]

Harold,

I think for the same reason he is really not doing anything now.

Their hands are tied, waive Meech and lose him, Ozzie on LTIR means he is gone for 10 games, maybe he only needs to rest for 2, maybe he needs all 10. It is so unknown and with the Cap situation they have no choice really at all. The two stop gaps that where in place to make this a non issue (Downey and Mac) have both already been waived so there is no one to move.

Plus, if you put Ozzie on LTIR and Conk gets injured (knocks on wood) now you are really stuck because if Ozzie is 80 % and could have played, he can't because only 5 games have passed.

It is a very tricky situation that Holland will have to deal with all season due to cap space.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Harold,

I think for the same reason he is really not doing anything now.

Their hands are tied, waive Meech and lose him, Ozzie on LTIR means he is gone for 10 games, maybe he only needs to rest for 2, maybe he needs all 10. It is so unknown and with the Cap situation they have no choice really at all. The two stop gaps that where in place to make this a non issue (Downey and Mac) have both already been waived so there is no one to move.

Plus, if you put Ozzie on LTIR and Conk gets injured (knocks on wood) now you are really stuck because if Ozzie is 80 % and could have played, he can't because only 5 games have passed.

It is a very tricky situation that Holland will have to deal with all season due to cap space.

good point. Yeah, I guess with a groin injury you never really know how long it's going to be, so it's a gamble given the cap situation.

This is off topic (though somewhat related in my bitter opinion) but why has Chelios been scratched the last two games? He's off LTIR, but is he still injured? or a healthy scratch?

EDIT: Just saw in the GDT that Cheli is a healthy scratch. Gee, it's sure good to have him back and taking up a roster spot.

Edited December 18, 2008 by haroldsnepsts

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

No, I don't think they are. But I also wouldn't attribute that to their early playing careers. Take Howard for example, the kid has been in the Wings system since 2003 and a pro since 2005 and still hasn't shown he can be a dependable goalie. On the other hand you have Corey Price who IMO is a very dependable goalie and he wasn't nurtured for years before he got his shot. Larsson has shown more ability and consistancy throughout his career in Sweden and so far he's had a seemless transition to the smaller rink.

But that absolutely doesn't mean it'll carry over to the NHL level, and with the defense playing as porous as they are the Wings aren't going to put Larsson's progress in jeopardy simply because he's playing better than Howard. It's just not worth the risk for a team as talented as the Wings.

There's so much more to consider than just bringing up Goalie B instead of Goalie A due to his better numbers.

[Opie 308]

But that absolutely doesn't mean it'll carry over to the NHL level, and with the defense playing as porous as they are the Wings aren't going to put Larsson's progress in jeopardy simply because he's playing better than Howard.

Actually if he is really outplaying J-ho (Can't watch GR games) then that is even more reason NOT to bring him up, let that confidence build. Let him be the uncontested starter for 3 weeks while J-ho is in Det on the pine. Let Larsson continue to play, continue to develop skill and confidence.

Bringing him up now to sit on the bench or lose on a Penalty shot like Ozzie did (no dig on Ozzie keep reading) could have detrimental effects on him. Ozzie is vet and understands that even though that PS was the winning goal, it is not the end of the world. If Larsson does that, odds are he puts the pressure on himself thinking he cost the team the game. May not happen but if we are playing with the psyche of the teams future goalie, better to be safe than sorry.

And why all the complaints from people about J-ho last time he was up? He played at a time when Lilja and Lebda where the top pairing, you expected something better than a 1-0/2-1 lose to the Stars (at the time 2nd or 3rd best team in the west) whatever the score was in that game? He played 4 games with the Wings, 197 minutes and had a GAA of 2.13. Tell me honestly right now, how many of you would take a sub 2.3 GAA on this team? Not saying he would have that now, just saying for someone who played in 4 games in a stretch where Lilja and Lebda are the top pairing he played pretty well.

J-ho has been being groomed for this, he may never be the starter in Det, but if he doesn't see ice time you never know, and in the Wings system (who keep guys in the A longer than most teams due to contract and money reasons, unless it is a Z or D.) a first year goalie is highly unlikely to be seen starting for the Wings, like having Ericsson in the AHL, it is more of an organizational move than a skill based move.

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

Actually if he is really outplaying J-ho (Can't watch GR games) then that is even more reason NOT to bring him up, let that confidence build. Let him be the uncontested starter for 3 weeks while J-ho is in Det on the pine. Let Larsson continue to play, continue to develop skill and confidence.

Bringing him up now to sit on the bench or lose on a Penalty shot like Ozzie did (no dig on Ozzie keep reading) could have detrimental effects on him. Ozzie is vet and understands that even though that PS was the winning goal, it is not the end of the world. If Larsson does that, odds are he puts the pressure on himself thinking he cost the team the game. May not happen but if we are playing with the psyche of the teams future goalie, better to be safe than sorry.

And why all the complaints from people about J-ho last time he was up? He played at a time when Lilja and Lebda where the top pairing, you expected something better than a 1-0/2-1 lose to the Stars (at the time 2nd or 3rd best team in the west) whatever the score was in that game? He played 4 games with the Wings, 197 minutes and had a GAA of 2.13. Tell me honestly right now, how many of you would take a sub 2.3 GAA on this team? Not saying he would have that now, just saying for someone who played in 4 games in a stretch where Lilja and Lebda are the top pairing he played pretty well.

J-ho has been being groomed for this, he may never be the starter in Det, but if he doesn't see ice time you never know, and in the Wings system (who keep guys in the A longer than most teams due to contract and money reasons, unless it is a Z or D.) a first year goalie is highly unlikely to be seen starting for the Wings, like having Ericsson in the AHL, it is more of an organizational move than a skill based move.

This is everything I've been saying, especially the bolded points.