Zetterberg denies report of rejecting 10yr, $75 million deal.

[CrabCZ 0]

Sometimes, people should really think about what they are writing, before to write it...

Evidently, no one is taking this thread seriously, why should I?

[Doggy 130]

This is kind of off topic, but I still think they should have some exception in the CBA only a percentage of a player's salary counts against the cap if he was drafted by that team. It'll help franchises retain players, which helps build an identity for the team and is better for the fans.

Can you imagine if Detroit could get a discount on all the talent they've drafted?

In the Australian Football League there is a thing called the veteran's list which is comprised of players that are of 30 years of age or more and have served the current club for a minimum of ten years. Such players have only 50% of their salary counted towards the cap. Something like this sound more feasible with a limitation on the amount of players on the list.

I think it's a great idea because it promotes loyalty, which sadly, is kinda rare in American sports.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Rarely?

I can't tell you the number of times that Hossa has had the puck and either given it away or had someone take it away from him.

Clearly, we have differing opinions on the guy. I'm not saying he's a bad player. I just don't think he's worth as much money at teams are willing to give him.

Do you disagree that Hossa is a fantastic goal scorer?

Do you disagree that he isn't a great point producer?

Do you disagree with the league-wide observation that he is a great two-way player?

For a 210 pound guy who looks stronger than hell to me on the puck, for you to say he "loses" the puck all the time and doesn't hustle is befuddling to say the least. Typically, a player who doesn't hustle doesn't post the following types of numbers and doesn't get league wide recognition as being one of the best two-way forwards in the game.

On pace for his 7th, 30+ goal season (two years he didn't hit 30 he had 29 goals)

2, 80 point seasons, 1-90 point season, 1-100 point season, career +99

Hossa had been earning 6 million a year as far back as 2005 when he signed with Atlanta.

Here's a guy with 320 career goals and 690 points in 745 games that basically all 30 NHL teams would put on their #1 line............

and to you he's an overrated, weak on the puck, lazy SOB who rarely ever hustles?

Here's where I would usually just be a jerk and start ripping you a new one for your apparent craziness but I won't. I'm feeling rather chipper this morning.

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

I've often wondered how Mr & Mrs Ilitch felt about Feds dating/marrying Kornikova (being under 18 if I remember correctly)?

The Ilitch's kinda come across as the old-school family 1st types who may frown on what Feds did...Wonder if they had anything to do with the contract negotiations, or was this all Holland giving Feds the boot

Holland never gave Feds the boot...he gave him a better offer than what Anaheim did. Feds just left for reasons that people speculate.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Fail.

I remember the situation with Feds very well. So I'll quickly enlighten you. Detroit dropped a year off the contract without warning Fedorov or giving him time to think about the situation. He had just fired his agent and was dealing with the contract talks on his own at that point, was tied up in a messy divorce and felt hurt by the contract talks and the bitter feelings that popped up there (emotional baggage is one reason why agents are an important middle man in contract talks).

Anahiem offered him less money per year, but for a longer period of time. Many speculate that Fedorov wanted a chance to be the main man in his hockey market- something he'd never have with Stevie around. He felt slighted and underapprecited by the Wings management as a result of the bitter contract disputes and most of all he wasn't really in the best frame of mind at that point. I honestly feel for him- it was a messed up situation and the Wings did screw him when they dropped a year off the contract and refused to give him time to consider the new development.

The point is that Fedorov ended up being paid less in Anaheim and left a good deal of emotional baggage behind in Detroit.

The bitterness behind most Detroit fans treatment of Feds is because of his contract hold out in the 97-98 season that ended with him signing an offer sheet from Carolina. (you'd understand if you knew just how dominant a player he was at that point in his career and that he hadn't yet had his "payday" to at least make up for the ridiculous dominance he displayed on the ice).

Fedorov would have had his number retired if he stayed here for his entire career- he was that important. His playoff scoring numbers in Detroit were insane. He was third in playoff scoring during the nineties (behind Lemeuix and Jagr). He's one of only 3 players in NHL history to have 4 consecutive 20+ point playoff runs (Bossy and Trottier share the record with him).

Anyone who fails to recognize how much Fedorov meant to Detroit and how critical he was to those three cups is just a moron.

While I agree with everything you say in regards to Fedorov's importance to Detroit and his dominance, there are 2 sides 2 every story.

1. He did hold out on the Wings b/c of money. You can look at it only from Feds point of view that he felt underpaid but that is only looking at it from how he felt and not about what the organization might have felt he was worth. Assuming that because they eventually signed him that Feds was right isn't exact. One could say the Wings overpaid him to keep him. 2 sides to every coin.

2. He did sign the offer sheet with Carolina to leave the Red Wings for more money. Again, to look at it only from Feds perspective is to see a player who feels slighted. Not fair to look at it from only Feds perspective in my opinion. And the bottom line is Detroit is not a sports town where the fans look lightly upon things like that where a player wants more money.

3. The year that was dropped off of the contract by the organization. Perhaps the organization realized the original offer was too rich. They had every right to lower money on the deal, lower the years on the deal, etc....To assume it was only done out of punishment is again only looking at it from a what is best for Feds perspective and does not take into account what the organization, what Holland and co. thought might be best considering the new cap era and other fiscal responsibilities.

4. Fedorov wanting to always "be the man" and thinking he couldn't do it in Detroit shouldn't be a knock on the organization. It is not Detroit's fault that Stevie was there. It was not Detroit's fault that Fedorov couldn't be the top man on the totem in the eyes of the organization or the fans, even if his talent warranted it. And the fact that it became an issue, especially early in his career lead to alot of people questioning his heart. I can think of more than a few articles written at the time that would talk about Fedorov's superhuman ability to dominate the league yet often times he did not. It was perceived sometimes as him being lazy or as him whining in one way or another about not being "the man".

I will never understate Fedorov's importance to this organization nor his sheer dominance for long stretches. But I will also never cry a tear for him. He was paid well for his services, he had tremendous success here and all of it was due to the Wings helping him escape his own country to come here in the first place. The organization always comes first. And there are 2 sides to the Fedorov saga.

In retrospect, not signing Feds to that bloated contract during the latter stages of his career might have been the best thing this organization did. I can't imagine what we might have looked like with Feds cap max salary and Lids cap max salary on the books at the same time. We've since one another cup and continued to dominate because the organization continues to make good, sound decisions. And sometimes they aren't going to be in favor of the player. And that's ok with me. I trust the people who run the Wings.

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

Technically Holland didn't give Feds the boot - however I recall some bitter negotiations between these 2 (going back to the 1997/1998 season), & with Holland taking a year away from a contract offer gave me the impression that Holland was getting tired of Fedorov taking his time in making his final decision.....I dunno - just an ugly seperation I guess.

EDIT - Again I gotta wonder if the Ilitch's had anything to do with any of this?

No doubt there was probably some bitterness or animosity between the two given past negotiations, but while Illitch and Co. (all the way down the Wings brass' ranks) tend to be family oriented, Holland *also* has the burden/responsibility of having to keep his head on his shoulders for what's best for the team.

[11iscoming 1]

maybe they should give hank a short term deal (1 or 2 years) at the same money that pasha makes. and after that when nicks contract has expired and there is maybe some more money left to spend (maybe the cap is going up or nick retires or plays for a little less if he re-sings), then they should try to figure something out to keep him til he retires.

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

maybe they should give hank a short term deal (1 or 2 years) at the same money that pasha makes. and after that when nicks contract has expired and there is maybe some more money left to spend (maybe the cap is going up or nick retires or plays for a little less if he re-sings), then they should try to figure something out to keep him til he retires.

Given the *current* salary cap, offering a 1 or 2 year deal equaling Pavel's contract is an icy kick in the nuts to Zetterberg.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Given the *current* salary cap, offering a 1 or 2 year deal equaling Pavel's contract is an icy kick in the nuts to Zetterberg.

What a disgusting mountain of riches we have as Wings fans 'eh?

You got Lidstrom, Rafalski, Holmstrom and Datsyuk and you have to find a way to keep people named

Zetterberg

Hossa

Franzen

Hudler

It's good to be a Wings fan.

[Opie 308]

What a disgusting mountain of riches we have as Wings fans 'eh?

You got Lidstrom, Rafalski, Holmstrom and Datsyuk and you have to find a way to keep people named

Zetterberg

Hossa

Franzen

Hudler

It's good to be a Wings fan.

BEST POST IN AT LEAST A MONTH!!!!!!!

Edited January 16, 2009 by Opie

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

What a disgusting mountain of riches we have as Wings fans 'eh?

You got Lidstrom, Rafalski, Holmstrom and Datsyuk and you have to find a way to keep people named

Zetterberg

Hossa

Franzen

Hudler

It's good to be a Wings fan.

No doubt. Take a look at some of the lower-tiered teams' rosters and you'll be further in shock at what the Wings are able to fit under the cap.

It's great to be a Wings fan, and I completely understand why fans (including media) of other teams hate us and always look for the slightest losing skid to call for the Wings demise. It doesn't matter how classy the organization is or how well-run the team is, people don't like seeing this calibre of a team last this long (I.E. Think how people felt about the Patriots before this year, and their streak wasn't half of what the Wings current one is).

[finalfilppula 2]

Hudler must be re-signed for a long-term deal. He's a steal, and is producing amazing numbers. No wonder Zetterberg denies rejecting this offer, he would be a complete moron not to take it. I've always been a huge Zetterberg fan, but if he wants more then 6.7 million a season, let him go. Theirs plenty of more players who would gladly take a discount to play with the Wings. Does Zetterberg deserve over 7.5 million? He's not exactly putting up numbers like Datsyuk or Hossa, or any other star player around the league. He's playing good, but not 7.45 million a season good. I think it'll come down to resigning Hudler for 3 million, Sammy for 2 million, Flipulla getting traded, Franzen for around 5, and either Hossa or Zetterberg for 6.7. Sammy and Hudler are really key pieces of the team, and losing Zetterberg or Hossa doesn't mean the team will be worse. It'll just mean more pressure on the other dozen people who can actually score.

Even if Zetterberg and Hossa both leave, the Wings still would be an elite team. They would have cap space to bring in a star goalie, and another second line forward. The other problem is, the Wings got no rookies. Maybe one or two big players leaving would give some Grand Rapids kids to get their start finally. I really don't understand why these players turn down discounts. I mean, is their a huge difference between making 6.7 million and 7.45 million a season? Is that really a huge difference over the course of a 15-20 season career? It's just money.

wrong.

you can contribute to a team in more ways than just points.

[Ms_Hockey 0]

Do you disagree that Hossa is a fantastic goal scorer?

Do you disagree that he isn't a great point producer?

Do you disagree with the league-wide observation that he is a great two-way player?

For a 210 pound guy who looks stronger than hell to me on the puck, for you to say he "loses" the puck all the time and doesn't hustle is befuddling to say the least. Typically, a player who doesn't hustle doesn't post the following types of numbers and doesn't get league wide recognition as being one of the best two-way forwards in the game.

On pace for his 7th, 30+ goal season (two years he didn't hit 30 he had 29 goals)

2, 80 point seasons, 1-90 point season, 1-100 point season, career +99

Hossa had been earning 6 million a year as far back as 2005 when he signed with Atlanta.

Here's a guy with 320 career goals and 690 points in 745 games that basically all 30 NHL teams would put on their #1 line............

and to you he's an overrated, weak on the puck, lazy SOB who rarely ever hustles?

Here's where I would usually just be a jerk and start ripping you a new one for your apparent craziness but I won't. I'm feeling rather chipper this morning.

In my original post, I said that Hossa wasn't a bad player at all. In fact, I said I like him because of his scoring ability.

Last night, I saw him hustle a few times. And I give him credit for when I see it. But I don't see it often. If you feel like ripping me for it, be my guest. I never said the guy was a bad player - just said he's not worth the bags of money Pittsburgh was trying to give him to stay. He may just SEEM slower because he's bigger.. but he seems slow to me. Again, he makes it work - but, in my head, I can probably count on my fingers the number of times it seems like Hossa actually hustles to get the puck.

There's nothing wrong with me thinking that other than the fact that many of you disagree. Disagree all you want - but it's my observation anyway.

[Drake_Marcus 890]

I've often wondered how Mr & Mrs Ilitch felt about Feds dating/marrying Kornikova (being under 18 if I remember correctly)?

The Ilitch's kinda come across as the old-school family 1st types who may frown on what Feds did...Wonder if they had anything to do with the contract negotiations, or was this all Holland giving Feds the boot

I'd say that was an element in it... stuff like that just kind of stacks on top of other things and makes a point of contention look bigger.

Holland never gave Feds the boot...he gave him a better offer than what Anaheim did. Feds just left for reasons that people speculate.

Technically Holland didn't give Feds the boot - however I recall some bitter negotiations between these 2 (going back to the 1997/1998 season), & with Holland taking a year away from a contract offer gave me the impression that Holland was getting tired of Fedorov taking his time in making his final decision.....I dunno - just an ugly seperation I guess.

EDIT - Again I gotta wonder if the Ilitch's had anything to do with any of this?

I agree man.

While I agree with everything you say in regards to Fedorov's importance to Detroit and his dominance, there are 2 sides 2 every story.

1. He did hold out on the Wings b/c of money. You can look at it only from Feds point of view that he felt underpaid but that is only looking at it from how he felt and not about what the organization might have felt he was worth. Assuming that because they eventually signed him that Feds was right isn't exact. One could say the Wings overpaid him to keep him. 2 sides to every coin.

2. He did sign the offer sheet with Carolina to leave the Red Wings for more money. Again, to look at it only from Feds perspective is to see a player who feels slighted. Not fair to look at it from only Feds perspective in my opinion. And the bottom line is Detroit is not a sports town where the fans look lightly upon things like that where a player wants more money.

3. The year that was dropped off of the contract by the organization. Perhaps the organization realized the original offer was too rich. They had every right to lower money on the deal, lower the years on the deal, etc....To assume it was only done out of punishment is again only looking at it from a what is best for Feds perspective and does not take into account what the organization, what Holland and co. thought might be best considering the new cap era and other fiscal responsibilities.

4. Fedorov wanting to always "be the man" and thinking he couldn't do it in Detroit shouldn't be a knock on the organization. It is not Detroit's fault that Stevie was there. It was not Detroit's fault that Fedorov couldn't be the top man on the totem in the eyes of the organization or the fans, even if his talent warranted it. And the fact that it became an issue, especially early in his career lead to alot of people questioning his heart. I can think of more than a few articles written at the time that would talk about Fedorov's superhuman ability to dominate the league yet often times he did not. It was perceived sometimes as him being lazy or as him whining in one way or another about not being "the man".

I will never understate Fedorov's importance to this organization nor his sheer dominance for long stretches. But I will also never cry a tear for him. He was paid well for his services, he had tremendous success here and all of it was due to the Wings helping him escape his own country to come here in the first place. The organization always comes first. And there are 2 sides to the Fedorov saga.

In retrospect, not signing Feds to that bloated contract during the latter stages of his career might have been the best thing this organization did. I can't imagine what we might have looked like with Feds cap max salary and Lids cap max salary on the books at the same time. We've since one another cup and continued to dominate because the organization continues to make good, sound decisions. And sometimes they aren't going to be in favor of the player. And that's ok with me. I trust the people who run the Wings.

Yeah, there are definitely two sides to the Feds story, and I actually agree with your point of view as well because the issues really aren't black and white.

For me there's bitterness with Fedorov. I loved watching him. He drew me into really watching hockey. I wasn't a true fan until I saw him play and had my jaw hit the floor. He was so amazingly talented. He never had the heart that Stevie had. If Fedorov had a heart like Stevie he'd be remembered as one of the greatest players ever... he was certainly one of the most rawly talented players ever. I always found it infuriating that he had motivation issues during the regular season. He was always dynamite in the playoffs, but in the regular season he was far to prone to being an on/off player.

I can sympathize there. When you're born with natural gifts and you're used to not only resting on your laurels but excelling based purely on your laurels it's really hard to stay motivated to working your butt off and pushing yourself every day. That's a common problem for athletes. The saddest part was Fedorov showed everyone that he was capable of winning a Pearson and a Selke at the same time, of scoring 5 goals in a game, of playing flawless defense on a whim. He just couldn't play with the passion and sacrifice every game, every season. It kills me that his legacy is hurt by that.

If you asked anyone in 1998 they'd have guessed that Fedorov would retire a Wing and have his number in the rafters.

*sigh* I wish Feds could have the legacy Stevie has... he certainly started out like he would.

[Drake_Marcus 890]

I fondly remember the early 90's when this Russian kid Fedorov was flying up/down the ice with effortless strides. Too bad things ended the way they did, & I recall Holland making a comment last spring that he had no interest in Feds @ the trade deadline; almost sounded as though he was taking 1 last shot @ Feds

Too bad things couldn't have been worked out between these 2, but then again I really have no idea what really took place - just speculation, & snippets from the newspapers/internet.

I do, however enjoy seeing that Feds is able to contribute significantly to the Caps both in the playoffs last season and in the portions of this season where he's been healthy. I honestly hope he'll stick around with them and rack up more points to add to his legacy while he helps steer Ovi along and guide his development (one Russian superstar to another).

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

There's nothing wrong with me thinking that other than the fact that many of you disagree. Disagree all you want - but it's my observation anyway.

Of course there's nothing wrong with it. You can think whatever you like, as cockamamie as it sounds to the rest of us.

Have you found anybody that concurs with your analysis that he doesn't hustle? Can you find even 1 board member who sees what you're seeing.

Seeing as how I doubt you could find a single fan that would agree that Hossa doesn't hustle out there, let alone a coach or anybody in the world of hockey that would agree with your observation, maybe you could take another look to make sure you wanna go with your position.

[SweWings 45]

The amount seems fair. Contract length is... worrying. I would prefer a few years less. I'm not saying I don't want Z to stay in Detroit forever but let it happen a few years at a time.

[Ms_Hockey 0]

Of course there's nothing wrong with it. You can think whatever you like, as cockamamie as it sounds to the rest of us.

Have you found anybody that concurs with your analysis that he doesn't hustle? Can you find even 1 board member who sees what you're seeing.

Seeing as how I doubt you could find a single fan that would agree that Hossa doesn't hustle out there, let alone a coach or anybody in the world of hockey that would agree with your observation, maybe you could take another look to make sure you wanna go with your position.

I haven't spoken about it much on the boards - other than in this thread. The only people who responded to my original post were the ones who disagree with me.

But in real life, when I go out for the games and begin pointing things out to people.. they won't necessarily agree with me.. but they'll tell me that I'm not as crazy as they originally thought I was.

I don't bring it up for a friendly chat to the diehard Wings fan sitting next to me or anything. But sometimes, my comments slip out (you know how we are. We just can't stop ourselves), and they'll start asking me questions.

[YoungGuns1340 1]

Hudler must be re-signed for a long-term deal. He's a steal, and is producing amazing numbers. No wonder Zetterberg denies rejecting this offer, he would be a complete moron not to take it. I've always been a huge Zetterberg fan, but if he wants more then 6.7 million a season, let him go. Theirs plenty of more players who would gladly take a discount to play with the Wings. Does Zetterberg deserve over 7.5 million? He's not exactly putting up numbers like Datsyuk or Hossa, or any other star player around the league. He's playing good, but not 7.45 million a season good. I think it'll come down to resigning Hudler for 3 million, Sammy for 2 million, Flipulla getting traded, Franzen for around 5, and either Hossa or Zetterberg for 6.7. Sammy and Hudler are really key pieces of the team, and losing Zetterberg or Hossa doesn't mean the team will be worse. It'll just mean more pressure on the other dozen people who can actually score.

Even if Zetterberg and Hossa both leave, the Wings still would be an elite team. They would have cap space to bring in a star goalie, and another second line forward. The other problem is, the Wings got no rookies. Maybe one or two big players leaving would give some Grand Rapids kids to get their start finally. I really don't understand why these players turn down discounts. I mean, is their a huge difference between making 6.7 million and 7.45 million a season? Is that really a huge difference over the course of a 15-20 season career? It's just money.

You tend to be a bit of an extremist in a lot of your posts, Owl. Just an observation.

At any rate, Hossa has 42 points in 44 games. Hank has 40 points in 42 games. Not exactly a big difference. 2 games fewer, 2 points fewer.

[YoungGuns1340 1]

Do you disagree that Hossa is a fantastic goal scorer?

Do you disagree that he isn't a great point producer?

Do you disagree with the league-wide observation that he is a great two-way player?

For a 210 pound guy who looks stronger than hell to me on the puck, for you to say he "loses" the puck all the time and doesn't hustle is befuddling to say the least. Typically, a player who doesn't hustle doesn't post the following types of numbers and doesn't get league wide recognition as being one of the best two-way forwards in the game.

On pace for his 7th, 30+ goal season (two years he didn't hit 30 he had 29 goals)

2, 80 point seasons, 1-90 point season, 1-100 point season, career +99

Hossa had been earning 6 million a year as far back as 2005 when he signed with Atlanta.

Here's a guy with 320 career goals and 690 points in 745 games that basically all 30 NHL teams would put on their #1 line............

and to you he's an overrated, weak on the puck, lazy SOB who rarely ever hustles?

Here's where I would usually just be a jerk and start ripping you a new one for your apparent craziness but I won't. I'm feeling rather chipper this morning.

To be honest, GST, shes not the only one who feels that way. Hossa has yet to play a single game this season WITHOUT Zetterberg or Datsyuk, yet hes not even up to a point per game pace? And hes getting 7.4M to do so? Naturally, its a great contract regardless because the Wings don't have any holes and its only the length of one year. But I agree with Ms. Hockey, the offers that he was getting in the neighborhood of $8-9M aren't what Hossa is worth to this team.

Is he a good skater? Is he a good two-way forward? Is he a creative, skilled offensive player with a great shot? Is he strong on the puck? Yes, hes all those things. But is he the be all and end all? Is he near Datsyuk's level? Is he prone to inconsistencies in his game that make him look like Robert Lang on some nights and Alex Ovechkin on others? Does he sometimes take shots that make him look like Brett Hull and others that make him look like Mikael Samuelsson? Yes, all those things too.

I am grateful to have Hossa. It makes our depth unreal, and I really think Hossa will turn it up a notch in the playoffs like he did between the regular and post-season last year, but he isn't a guy that I think the Wings should even think about re-signing, because he hasn't looked nor produced like the top 10 forward he was billed to be on this team. Thats not to say Hossa can't produce or look like a top 10 forward. I just don't think he can on this team.

And again, before we launch into the hyperbole and false accusations, I know Hossa is a great, high-end, elite player. I just don't think hes reached that level with this team.

Edited January 17, 2009 by YoungGuns1340

[datsyuk rocks 0]

zetterberg said he didn't denie it ok