Guest micah Report post Posted May 13, 2009 I believe it was the Sens Alfredsson; shot the puck at Neidamayer. My bad. Thanks! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
norrisnick 1 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 LOL. Let's go Turtles let's go! (clap clap) Let's go Turtles let's go! (clap clap) I've said it before and I'll say it again. The big shiny silver thing awarded in June isn't won with a dick measuring contest. 90-95% of the league could win fights with the Wings. That's fine. It's completely worthless. I realize some fans need high PIM counts from the Wings to affirm their own manhood, but it really doesn't do anything for me. Some fans may feel shame and embarassment, but that's on them, not the Wings. The game of hockey and subsequently the Stanley Cup is won between the whistles. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mooker 0 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 Isn't an elbow like that even illegal in the UFC? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reds4Life 51 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 (edited) Yeah, because Neil would be there - a minute to go, need a goal to tie the game. Some of you are ridiculous with all the "we need tough guys" "Wings are *******" "not tough enough" "Lidstrom doesn't fight" here's my message: get over you complex and go fight yourself if you need it. You are pathetic losers. Edited May 13, 2009 by Reds4Life Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Broken 16 381 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 (edited) No one else on the ice is more important than Lidstrom. If you think Nick needs to toss himself into the fray to protect guys 10-15+ years younger than him, you really need to kick your meth habit as it's affecting your judgement. And the rest of the team should have done exactly what Nick did. Don't get involved after the whistles. It isn't worth the energy or the risk of injury (or making injury worse). If the opposition wants to jump you, cover up and let them get suspended but don't get suckered into a fight because that's exactly what the Ducks want. I couldn't disagree more. The Wings need to show more toughness, if they have it in em. I've stayed out of the toughness debate ever since I joined, for the most part. The Wings didn't get past Colorado by turning the other cheek. They got past them by creating one of the most legendary bloodbaths in the history of Joe Louis Arena. If the Wings have any balls they need to show them and beat the f*** out of people... then play world class hockey. Edited May 13, 2009 by Broken 16 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
norrisnick 1 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 Any MAN with any self-respect would stand up for himself, and not puss out - especially if you're attacked! See the dick measuring bit above. Getting tooled by a better fighter doesn't make you a man. It makes you stupid. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reds4Life 51 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 If our beloved Red Wings went ahead, and turtled like norrisnick suggests...Well the team would rightfully deserve to be ridiculed by every opposing fan/player/media outlet for officially being the softest team in the history of the NHL Fighting != toughness Go to hell with all your lame lack of toughness s***. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
norrisnick 1 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 I couldn't disagree more. The Wings need to show more toughness, if they have it in em. I've stayed out of the toughness debate ever since I joined, for the most part. The Wings didn't get past Colorado by turning the other cheek. They got past them by creating one of the most legendary bloodbaths in the history of Joe Louis Arena. If the Wings have any balls they need to show them and beat the f*** out of people... then play world class hockey. Do you know how many periods of Red Wing/Avalanche playoff hockey featured fights? 2. That's in 6 full series of bitter rivalry (well 5, as the 6th series was the rout last spring, which if discounted eliminates one of the periods that featured a fight). The Wings need to play world class hockey. Nothing else matters. Toughness isn't dropping the gloves and fighting. Toughness is not allowing the opposition to dictate the way you play the game. Go to the hard areas. Win puck battles. Score. Defend. Win. Fighting in the playoffs is about as important as beard growing ability. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
norrisnick 1 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 If our beloved Red Wings went ahead, and turtled like norrisnick suggests...Well the team would rightfully deserve to be ridiculed by every opposing fan/player/media outlet for officially being the softest team in the history of the NHL So rather than stand around, should Lidstrom have challenged Pronger (who was also just standing around) to prove his worth as a man? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Broken 16 381 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 Do you know how many periods of Red Wing/Avalanche playoff hockey featured fights? 2. That's in 6 full series of bitter rivalry (well 5, as the 6th series was the rout last spring, which if discounted eliminates one of the periods that featured a fight). The Wings need to play world class hockey. Nothing else matters. Toughness isn't dropping the gloves and fighting. Toughness is not allowing the opposition to dictate the way you play the game. Go to the hard areas. Win puck battles. Score. Defend. Win. Fighting in the playoffs is about as important as beard growing ability. Your stats mean nothing. If you are going to tell me that letting them get away with what they've done is a good idea, then you don't know hockey. So what happens if no suspensions are handed out? What's stopping them from pulling that s*** again... and again... and again? You don't know what you're talking about. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
norrisnick 1 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 No - not standing up for yourself (or a teammate) makes you a coward. Good think Kopecky isn't a coward, eh? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reds4Life 51 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 (edited) No - not standing up for yourself (or a teammate) makes you a coward. Using this (flawed) logic: Yzerman, Sakic, Gretzky, Kelly etc etc are all giant cowards. Edited May 13, 2009 by Reds4Life Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Broken 16 381 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 (edited) Good think Kopecky isn't a coward, eh? Kopecky is hurt because he was trying to fill a void that even he knew the team had. Kopecky is nothing to close to a coward. Kopecky is a great teammate. It's just too bad he felt he had to take matters into his own hands with no support. It's maybe a good thing that there is no chance of him coming back. According to your logic, It's open season on our injured dudes with no fear of retribution. Edited May 13, 2009 by Broken 16 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bellarina 1 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 Put me in coach! you won't be disappointed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest micah Report post Posted May 13, 2009 So rather than stand around, should Lidstrom have challenged Pronger (who was also just standing around) to prove his worth as a man? Sometimes the right thing to do is the painful thing to do. Good men do not just watch their friends get jumped, thinking "well, maybe the cops will get the bad guys, I'll just stay out of it". Good Captains do not watch their teams' star forwards get beat-up just because they're afraid that the other team has someone who will beat them up. Loyalty has a cost, nobody is denying that. You are making a great argument for a goon though. If I hear you correctly, you're saying that players should not defend themselves or their teamates if there is a bigger badass on the ice than them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
teckaholic 0 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 If Homer wasn't suspended why should Scotty? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
norrisnick 1 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 Your stats mean nothing. If you are going to tell me that letting them get away with what they've done is a good idea, then you don't know hockey. So what happens if no suspensions are handed out? What's stopping them from pulling that s*** again... and again... and again? You don't know what you're talking about. They mean something. A lot of people have this misconception that the Wing/Av rivalry was nonstop linebrawls. It was hard hitting intense hockey by the two most skilled teams in the league. During the '97 WCF a lopsided game had a couple fights in the 3rd period. Beyond that, nothing until Mac and one of the Codys fought last spring. Letting them get away with it? I don't think more Wing players getting beat up is going to do anything to change that. You'd have to fundamentally alter the make up of the Red Wings to ever get to the point where they could man to man take on any team. That's just not going to happen. A fighter on the 4th line isn't going to do anything to change that. Lets magically make Chris Neil a Red Wing for last nights game. What changes? It would still be the exact same people out on the ice at the end. If Neil hops off the bench that's 10 games. You think Getzlaf, Perry, or Niedermayer would fight Neil in game 7 to make up for it? You think that scenario would even cross their minds to make them hesitant to punch up the Wings' skill guys? Absolutely not. Wishing that the skill guys would do more to "stand up for themselves" is just dumb. It's pretty much wishing for injuries. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reds4Life 51 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 (edited) Looks to me he stood his ground - eh? How many times did he do that? Right. Besides, he stood there and did nothing until the other guy pounded him. Yzerman is a very small person, there is no way he would have fight Pronger or some other 6'6" mofo. Same goes for Sakic, Kelly, Gretzky etc etc Fighting is incredibly overrated by some of the NA fans. I think the whole country is kinda weird in this thing..you want fighting, guns and other useless crap and on top of that you consider it tough. God bless America indeed. Edited May 13, 2009 by Reds4Life Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Broken 16 381 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 Using this (flawed) logic: Yzerman, Sakic, Gretzky, Kelly etc etc are all giant cowards. McSorley Probert Kocur Ring any bells? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
norrisnick 1 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 No - you pull off/tie up a guy like Perry/Neidermayer who has your teammate Rafalski/Datsyuk in a bad position, and are overmatched. It's not just Lidstrom; a significant portion of the team just stands around and watches while a smaller teammate gets manhandled. Your idea of letting the Ducks pummel the Wings with the hope of the league taking action thru suspensions is both naive, and gutless. Ah, the tried and true manliness that is the 3rd man in... These guys are professional athletes. They'll survive a bit of a manhandling. You open yourself up for a far worse pummeling if you try and fight back. Which is just mindnumbingly stupid if you aren't a fighter. Tie up the arms and duck your head, but for Gord's sake don't throw punches. That gives the other guy the green light to really go to town on you. Self preservation should trump holding a ruler up to your thingy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest micah Report post Posted May 13, 2009 Using this (flawed) logic: Yzerman, Sakic, Gretzky, Kelly etc etc are all giant cowards. What are you talking about? All those guys except Gretzky have been in playoff fights - and even the great Gretzky has more FMs than Lidstrom. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reds4Life 51 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 McSorley Probert Kocur Ring any bells? NHL post-lockout Ring any bells? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
norrisnick 1 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 Kopecky is hurt because he was trying to fill a void that even he knew the team had. Kopecky is nothing to close to a coward. Kopecky is a great teammate. It's just too bad he felt he had to take matters into his own hands with no support. It's maybe a good thing that there is no chance of him coming back. According to your logic, It's open season on our injured dudes with no fear of retribution. Exactly. And now he won't play until October. At least he's a man tho... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Broken 16 381 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 NHL post-lockout Ring any bells? Ducks just manhandled the Wings last night. Ring any bells? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MidMichSteve 1,115 Report post Posted May 13, 2009 (edited) If our beloved Red Wings went ahead, and turtled like norrisnick suggests...Well the Stanley Cup Champion team would rightfully deserve to be ridiculed by every opposing fan/player/media outlet for officially being the softest team in the history of the NHL We are ridiculed for being "soft euros" already. Oh, I added the bold type for you . ^^ You must have forgotten to add it. /sarcasm Edited May 13, 2009 by MidMichSteve Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
