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dat's sick

2/27 GDT : Red Wings 6 at Senators 1, Franzen w/Hat Trick

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And looked like a bunch of classless losers the whole game. I'm all for sticking up for teammates, but I'd rather watch my team play hockey.

I agree that they looked like a bunch of sore losers and I also would rather watch the boys play, but a freaking line has to be drawn somewhere, right? I mean, am I crazy here? Neil was on Franzen's case most of the game, that's hockey, that's what happens, but when a guy goes up to my teammate, pulls off his helmet and tries to start s*** after the game is already over, I'm stepping in. Call me classless, call me what you will but there has to be some kind of line that cannot be crossed.

Who exactly do you expect to do that? The Wings have nobody on the roster that could "feed him his teeth". They have guys who would fight but nobody in Neils class. It would be a decided win for Neil against anyone so whats gained?

Really? These aren't children we're talking about here, these are grown men, professional athletes. Someone could have stepped in and done something. I mean, does a player have to be a fighter to fight? To stick up for their teammate? Every player has to have a limit, I mean even Yzerman got in a fight, Crosby has participated in and won fights. Would you consider them fighters? I'm not saying that there's not a major difference in size or fighting skill, but they're not kids out there. I may not be a big guy by any means, especially compared to the average professional hockey player, but if it gets to the point were someone from the other team is gooning up one of my guys in the manner that Neil was to Franzen, I'm going to defend my teammate or get my ass kicked trying.

In my opinion there is something to be gained; a message is sent that we're not going to let other teams push us around. I've seen it a million times before, just like this game, where Wings are up and the other team is just taking a run at whoever they can. I'm not saying Wings should take stupid penalties and whatnot, but big hits and the occasional scrum when things get out of hand would help a lot, in my opinion.

I guess I'm just tired of the idea that a player has to be a fighter in order to stick up for himself or his teammate.

And I apologize for using the idiom "feed him his teeth" in place for "fight him". I obviously know we don't have any fighters that are in Neil's class, but I was admittedly pissed at the moment I had written that.

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No way trade franzen for edler!! Who ever is screaming to trade the mule is not a true wings fan(sry)... Someone mentioned he takes plays off and doesn't show up always, I agree, but in the playoffs hes always there, I can't imagine giving him away for edler the nucks would be hellalucky, but he would fit perfect there with the sisters (hard to imagine he wouldn't)

Even if we need help on defense I wouldn't trade our only power forward with a scoring touch for Edler.

EXACTLY!

LOL

Until he goes 10 games without a goal. Then everyone wants to buy him out.

Fickle crew.

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LOL

Until he goes 10 games without a goal. Then everyone wants to buy him out.

Fickle crew.

Sports, and entertainers in general will always have to deal with the "what have you done for me lately" attitude. It's just a nature of the beast. These guys get paid to perform, so when they don't people start to wonder why they get paid.

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Really? These aren't children we're talking about here, these are grown men, professional athletes. Someone could have stepped in and done something. I mean, does a player have to be a fighter to fight? To stick up for their teammate? Every player has to have a limit, I mean even Yzerman got in a fight, Crosby has participated in and won fights. Would you consider them fighters? I'm not saying that there's not a major difference in size or fighting skill, but they're not kids out there. I may not be a big guy by any means, especially compared to the average professional hockey player, but if it gets to the point were someone from the other team is gooning up one of my guys in the manner that Neil was to Franzen, I'm going to defend my teammate or get my ass kicked trying.

In my opinion there is something to be gained; a message is sent that we're not going to let other teams push us around. I've seen it a million times before, just like this game, where Wings are up and the other team is just taking a run at whoever they can. I'm not saying Wings should take stupid penalties and whatnot, but big hits and the occasional scrum when things get out of hand would help a lot, in my opinion.

I guess I'm just tired of the idea that a player has to be a fighter in order to stick up for himself or his teammate.

And I apologize for using the idiom "feed him his teeth" in place for "fight him". I obviously know we don't have any fighters that are in Neil's class, but I was admittedly pissed at the moment I had written that.

If you think someone just stepping up and fighting Neil is going to stop him your delusional. Thats not how the NHL works right now. Sure the Wings could have someone step up and have Neil hand them there teeth. What does Neil beating the crap out of a Wing gain the Wings? Nothing. It will only encourage Neil to do it more as he knows whoever does try and make him answer he will handle easily. Datsyuk fought Perry and held his own. Has that stopped Perry from going after Wings stars? Nope. In your words that would have sent a message and they would have layed off the Wings just because someone fought him. That doesnt happen. Why? Because if that player doesnt take a run at the Wings next game the coach will find someone that will. That player is more in fear of losing his job for not running hard at players than he is about the retaliation he might get in return. The league has handcuffed enforcers so much the last 20 years that they no longer have an effect on the game. Why people seem to think having a tough guy or fighting just to "send a message" will prevent other players from cheapshotting is amazing.

Edited by GoalieManPat

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If you think someone just stepping up and fighting Neil is going to stop him your delusional. Thats not how the NHL works right now. Sure the Wings could have someone step up and have Neil hand them there teeth. What does Neil beating the crap out of a Wing gain the Wings? Nothing. It will only encourage Neil to do it more as he knows whoever does try and make him answer he will handle easily. Datsyuk fought Perry and held his own. Has that stopped Perry from going after Wings stars? Nope. In your words that would have sent a message and they would have layed off the Wings just because someone fought him. That doesnt happen. Why? Because if that player doesnt take a run at the Wings next game the coach will find someone that will. That player is more in fear of losing his job for not running hard at players than he is about the retaliation he might get in return. The league has handcuffed enforcers so much the last 20 years that they no longer have an effect on the game. Why people seem to think having a tough guy will prevent other players from cheapshotting is amazing.

You are right to some extent -the league has handcuffed enforcers but saying there is no stopping a guy like Neil is incorrect. Neil cannot rough up someone from the penalty box after fighting our heavyweight. There is also the notion that anything he tries to do to us can be done to them. I do think Neil's team mates would be slightly less enthusiastic about his work if they realize that it will put a target on their backs. Heavyweights are still part of this league and for a reason. Holland is about the only GM that refuses to admit this and his team is paying for it. The fans too, if it means the coach is afraid to put Datsyuk out on the ice at times.

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I actually met Neil and skated with him in Peterborough Ontario then again this was like 7 years ago he didn't have the same grit (not to say he wasn't gritty then) surely he was cool on the ice... One of those you rather have him on your team than against your team players....

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I actually met Neil and skated with him in Peterborough Ontario then again this was like 7 years ago he didn't have the same grit (not to say he wasn't gritty then) surely he was cool on the ice... One of those you rather have him on your team than against your team players....

Looks like your recovery is going ok. ;-)

He's one of those guys who's face is intimidating to punch.

Edited by T.Low

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You are right to some extent -the league has handcuffed enforcers but saying there is no stopping a guy like Neil is incorrect. Neil cannot rough up someone from the penalty box after fighting our heavyweight. There is also the notion that anything he tries to do to us can be done to them. I do think Neil's team mates would be slightly less enthusiastic about his work if they realize that it will put a target on their backs. Heavyweights are still part of this league and for a reason. Holland is about the only GM that refuses to admit this and his team is paying for it. The fans too, if it means the coach is afraid to put Datsyuk out on the ice at times.

When is the coach afraid to put Datsyuk on the ice? He plays all the time...when he's not nursing an injury. Also, how is the team "paying for" not having an enforcer?

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No for sure trust me, what Neil did was some ***** s*** away from the play and knowing franzen won't fight back.... And I would understand and agree if shanny was too give him a game or at the very least fine

Yea at 6-1 I wouldnt put Pavel on the ice

Edited by brooklynsour

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If you think someone just stepping up and fighting Neil is going to stop him your delusional. Thats not how the NHL works right now. Sure the Wings could have someone step up and have Neil hand them there teeth. What does Neil beating the crap out of a Wing gain the Wings? Nothing. It will only encourage Neil to do it more as he knows whoever does try and make him answer he will handle easily. Datsyuk fought Perry and held his own. Has that stopped Perry from going after Wings stars? Nope. In your words that would have sent a message and they would have layed off the Wings just because someone fought him. That doesnt happen. Why? Because if that player doesnt take a run at the Wings next game the coach will find someone that will. That player is more in fear of losing his job for not running hard at players than he is about the retaliation he might get in return. The league has handcuffed enforcers so much the last 20 years that they no longer have an effect on the game. Why people seem to think having a tough guy or fighting just to "send a message" will prevent other players from cheapshotting is amazing.

Right, Corey Perry's antics are comparable to the s*** Chris Neil was pulling. How many times has he ripped a (very recently concused) player's helmet off and punched them in the face?

At no point did I say this team, or any teams for that matter, need a player who's sole purpose is fighting. I just believe that there should be a point where a guy should stand up for himself or his teammate. I don't understand how that is such a bad thing. I don't really care for staged fighting, nor do I think a guy should get his ass kicked every time he makes a dirty hit or runs mouth or what have you. But in cases like last night and, for example, when Weber slammed Z's head into the glass, there should have been some kind of retaliation from the Wings.

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You know what, let him chirp. He barely touched Franzen, got tossed (can't take runs at guys when you're in the locker room), and the Sens lost 6-1. Why in the world would anybody want a different outcome than what we got?

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Attempt to injure YOhjan to valuable right niw

He didn't attempt to injure him. He chirped him a bit and they got into a relatively light scuffle. Attempt to injure is a slewfoot, or knee on knee, or hit to the head, or boarding. Not a scuffle. If that's an attempt to injure then a plain old legal body check is now an "attempt to incapacitate...forever".

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He dropped his gloves and gave him a few shorts shots and tried to ram his face in the boards after tearing his helmet off? If that's chirping and lil scuffle for you, you must of been around watching hockey from the 70-80s lol

And f.Michael mention he just had a concussion a few weeks ago... Playing in a back to back and taking a few punches to the head.... Can easily be re-concussed

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He dropped his gloves and gave him a few shorts shots and tried to ram his face in the boards after tearing his helmet off? If that's chirping and lil scuffle for you, you must of been around watching hockey from the 70-80s lol

I think you just made the exact opposite point you intended to. Compared to the way the game was played in the 70s and 80s last night's altercation was indeed a relatively light scuffle. I'll accept your use of that example as your way of agreeing with me.

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When is the coach afraid to put Datsyuk on the ice? He plays all the time...when he's not nursing an injury. Also, how is the team "paying for" not having an enforcer?

Games against Ottawa is a pretty clear example to me, people complaining about Neil's unclassiness or how the Sens constantly goon it up. But I think Detroit looks intimidated quite often not just against the Sens. It is clear that there is not much respect out there for the Red Wings, and the players take unneccassary punishment. Now if you dont want to believe I guess it is not there.

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