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Member Since 13 May 2009
Offline Last Active Yesterday, 09:04 PM

#2183704 10/11 Hockeyfights.com awards voting...

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 08 June 2011 - 01:13 PM

how did Edmonton and NY finish in the standings last year? refresh my memory...

The team currently second in voting for the Best Enforcing Team is the Boston Bruins. They have a good model for enforcing. Thornton is their main enforcer, and he can also play, while Lucic, Horton, McQuaid, etc can hold their own against most MW's. I don't think there is evidence that enforcing well translates into team success or failure. I do believe that having an enforcer would allow players like Abdelkader to play tougher knowing someone has their back.

Can someone here who is against McCormick/Konopka/Prust-type enforcers explain to me how their addition to the team as a replacement for Miller would hurt the Wings in 2011-2012 (holding all other roster changes equal)?

#2183430 10/11 Hockeyfights.com awards voting...

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 07 June 2011 - 06:53 PM

I'll never understand you folk that don't get the idea that the Wings could use a guy who'll drop the gloves with some regularity during the season. One guy taking a penalty here and there while giving the opposing team something to think about when it comes to taking liberties with our players certainly isn't going to cost us in the win column. AND HELL, I'm not even talking about a guy that JUST fights.

Hell, I'll even throw this little nugget out there for you to ponder over.

Seguin is healthy scratched last night in favor of Thorton. Sure, he might not be on the scorers sheet in the way of points... but I tell you what... his presence was felt and it certainly helped spark some team-mates and get some opposing players off their game.

I think a lot of it is because some of the posters on here only watch the Wings. While this is fine, I don't see how someone can make a valid argument for or against an enforcer if they don't watch the other 29 teams in the league outside of their games with the Wings.

#2183422 10/11 Hockeyfights.com awards voting...

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 07 June 2011 - 06:26 PM

How many games did Downey play in the 2008 playoffs? Same answer as yours.

That isn't the discussion. In fact, the award mentioned in the OP is a regular season award.

How many games did DMac play during the playoffs in his cup-winning seasons(outside of 08)? In 08 Drake played, and DMac played during the earlier cups.

No one here is suggesting the Wings carry someone with as much skill as Downey. We want someone better, and there are better players available. Even if the player only played during the regular season, it would still be an upgrade especially if the player can be within 5 points of Miller (which Konopka and McCormick can) and add a dimension the Wings lack.

EDIT- The original point still holds. The Wings haven't won a cup recently without a rostered enforcer.

#2183411 10/11 Hockeyfights.com awards voting...

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 07 June 2011 - 06:03 PM

Worst Enforcing Team, but most Stanley Cups.

How many of the recent cups have come without an enforcer on the team? I'll save you the time- the answer is zero.

#2183393 10/11 Hockeyfights.com awards voting...

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 07 June 2011 - 05:02 PM

Yeah, it is true and it isn't a big deal. I don't really think the Wings need to waste money on an enforcer who will bring nothing to the team other than fighting but that is just me since the Wings aren't the same team as they used to be 10-20 years ago.

What about McCormick or Konopka? They play almost as well as Miller, and can fight.

The Wings didn't waste money in 08 when they have Downey, McCarty, and Drake (to a lesser extent).

#2183372 10/11 Hockeyfights.com awards voting...

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 07 June 2011 - 04:09 PM



Not really a huge issue but its a little slow around here and I figure we could use another enforcer thread as opposed to a line thread.

Anyways, Wings currently have a HUGE lead,almost 85% of the current votes, for the worst enforcing team in the league against Nashville, Phoenix, Tampa Bay and Carolina..

I am gonna say the number is slightly thrown off by the overwhelming Wings hatred that is found on Hockeyfights.com, but is it true? I know the Wings dont have any real "enforcers" but I don't think that they are the worst enforcing team in the league just because they have the least overall fights.. I mean it's not very often you would see this team get pushed around this year..

Anyways.. guess the only real questions are.. do you think it's true? And if it is, is it a huge concern going forward?

It is true.

It's not a huge concern if the players don't mind. With that said, the players would play 'tougher' with an enforcer to have their back, and I think that would increase the Wings' chances of winning (not that they can't without one). That's why I'm all for McCormick or Konopka.

#2183119 SCF: Boston Bruins vs. Vancouver Canucks

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 06 June 2011 - 09:43 PM

Classic Lucic going after Burrows. That guy is the biggest ***** over 6'2 I've ever seen. Spot picking loser. Now we got Kesler and Seidenberg, at least the ugly factor is picking up.

Enforcing isn't about picking on players your own size- it's about seeking retribution. Good on Lucic for doing that.

#2183097 SCF: Boston Bruins vs. Vancouver Canucks

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 06 June 2011 - 09:02 PM

Please let the Bruins increase the lead and Thornton fight someone.

#2178811 Brian Rafalski announces retirement after 11 NHL seasons

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 23 May 2011 - 10:24 PM


But every player wants to play in Detroit and take a hometown discount :ph34r:

#2178652 Brian Rafalski announces retirement after 11 NHL seasons

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 23 May 2011 - 06:21 PM

Sign Peckham and Ehrhoff. This should give the Wings a good core to build on when Lids retires. Peckham is more physical than anyone the Wings need and he is still young. Ehrhoff can make up some of the puck moving that Raffy was responsible for.

#2177466 gritty players I would like the wings to sign

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 19 May 2011 - 10:20 PM

Again we see why you want him on the team, you wouldn't care if he put up 5 points so long as he would drop the gloves, and in the process you would drop a player who is a very good PKer and a guy who has shown he can play at a 20 point pace (Miller had he played 82 games would have had 23 points both of the last two seasons)and is 3 years younger. I take track record over forum member's projections.

If I (or Newfy) wanted a player like that on the Wings, we would be posting about MacIntyre and McGrattan instead of McCormick and Konopka.

Our argument is that Konopka can do at least 90% of what Miller can do offensively and on the PK at the same price while also being the Wings' enforcer. If you don't believe teams should carry enforcers, any argument you make in this thread is irrelevant because you have an underlying bias against these players (which it seems like you do). However, there are many posters here (inside and outside of this thread) who believe that a player like Konopka can do things other than score that can help the Wings win.

#2176809 gritty players I would like the wings to sign

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 18 May 2011 - 01:21 PM

20+ GMs have different team philosophies compared to Detroit which values skill and speed in all four lines, it seems Holland agrees with my view because he doesn't seem to be going out of his way to pick up an enforcer. Now again if its a guy who is willing to defend himself and fight thats fine by me, but a goon on skates more and more are going the way of the Dodo, and I for one am happy about that. Grit doesn't win playoff games, look at the stats in the San Jose series, the wings out hit them every game I believe but because of them not scoring they lost. So if you want to see a fighter on skates beat the hell out of other people thats great, but if you expect the wings to carry one of them, I wouldn't hold my breath.

You seem to be dodging your original argument that Konopka doesn't have the skill necessary to play on the Wings. My point is that Konopka is a good enough player to be on the Wings' fourth line and that he can also fight. Therefore, his isn't just a fighter on skates as you paint him to be.

Holland signed Downey and May. These players weren't better than the Wings' other choices and they surely aren't better than Konopka. For one they didn't have the offensive potential of Konopka (May did, but not while on the Wings), and Konopka is a great PK'r and faceoff man.

#2176709 gritty players I would like the wings to sign

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 18 May 2011 - 07:33 AM

Well Drew Miller put up almost as many points in 66 as Konopka has in 195, so I would say that right there would put him as more valuable, he kills PKs, he goes to the dirty areas, and best yet, he doesn't average over 3.5 (per ten mins of ice time) minutes in the penalty box per game. Konopka isn't particularly defensively sound (not compared to your average Detroit center), at least not from what I have seen from his stats and the games Ive seen him in.

If you think a guy who spends over 1/3 of his ice time per game in the box is a good addition to a team thats your right, I personally think its a poor idea. As I keep saying if we can get a player that can add grit and actual scoring talent to our team I would be in favor, but no warm bodies who are only on a team because they can fight.

The best option for any grit would come on the blue line as a 6th/7th defenseman, with the high number of offensively sound D men Detroit has adding some girt on the back end wouldn't hurt.

Why is arguing Konopka's PIMs a relevant point? Konopka spent 3.5 (per ten mins of ice time) defending his teammates, something Miller did not do this season. Since most of his PIMs are from fighting (or 10 min misconducts from the refs 'settling the game down'), I can't agree with your negative spin on the stat.

The player you want won't exist on the Wings. There are only a few scorers who will fight (Lucic, Clowe, Stewart), and they come at a price premium. Also, these players would be encouraged by the Wings not to fight since they would be key offensive figures. If you think Konopka is bad in the box, try having one of your second liner's in the box that much. The argument for a skilled fighter contradicts your first point of too many PIMS because of the necessity of PIMs to fighting.

Konopka got 9 points this year playing with Trevor Gillies and Michael Haley (or Matt Martin). Think for a minute about those players and compare them to Helm and Eaves. Then think more about the significant amount of offense Miller adds above Konopka- it's not nearly as much as you think.

#2176148 Notable Restricted/Unrestricted Free Agents in 2011

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 16 May 2011 - 07:40 AM

Yes, because Konner knows everything :rolleyes:

The offer-sheet needed to sign Weber would cost the Wings four first round picks (two first round, a second, and a third if you believe Nashville won't match 6.5 million). Not only is this not a deal Holland would likely make because of how draft picks are valued, but Nashville would be crazy not to match any offer under 7 million. If anyone seriously believes Weber will be a Wing next year, I'll start taking that bet.

The only UFA/RFA's I'd like to see the Wings go after are gritty forwards/d. The talented players are going to be looking to get as much of that cap raise as possible, and there won't be many deals. Konopka and Peckham are two players I would like. As far as forward talent is concerned, Franzen would need to be traded.

#2169801 Game 6 Line-Up

Posted by WorkingOvertime on 08 May 2011 - 09:50 PM

Good leave abby in but tie his ass to the bench and let him get that stupid look on his face wondering what the f*** is going on!

How is he supposed to chip away at Niemi and Murray from the bench? :hehe: