Raffi back in on Wed...

[Never_Retire_Steve 35]

I echo the sentiments of Ericsson being the odd man out..... yes he probably has been better than Lebda lately but he would be better off in GR with increased playing time.

[Andy Pred 48 337]

Ericsson will be sent back down, but once the Griffs season is over he'll be back up anyway. No point

in risking losing Meech or anyone else via the waivers. I can see Cheli having a good rest, it'll be killing

him not playing thou, and letting Meech have a prolonged run in the team. Babs sure is going to have a

headache when all his D are available, but come the playoffs we'll be having 7 D on the roster anyway.

[Rice 42]

I'm thinking about breaking up Lid - Raf pairing against some big forchecking teams

how bout

Lid - Stu

Kron - Lil (swede line - better communication between them plus I thought the pairing was good before)

Raf - Cheli (american line)

every line having one who can play the board and other one who can direct the play

oh btw Ericsson should go down to minor IMO.

One of the reasons the Wings acquired Stuart was to keep Lilja out of the top four. The defense will most likely look like this when everyone is healthy:

Lidstrom-Rafalski

Kronwall-Stuart

Chelios-Lilja

(Who cares about nationality?)

[wingnut40 176]

I'd take Lilja over Lebda any day of the week.

Lilja is a phenomenal shot blocker on the PK and is defensively responsible. He makes mistakes, but Lebda makes more.

/concur. I think for Wednesday:

Raffy Laffy Taffy- Stuart

Kronwall- Lilja

Ericsson- Meech

Playoffs:

The Nickage- Laffy Taffy

Kronwall- Stuart

Cheli- Andreas

Lebda, Meech, Ericsson.

[06TJSport 0]

lol to all the people that don't about the roster expanding after the trading deadline.

I've seen Lilja make too many game ending mistakes. Most recently, stupid penalty at the end of the EDM game last week, cost the Wings a win, plain and simple. I haven't seen Lebda hand a game to anyone like Lilja does on a regular basis.

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

lol to all the people that don't about the roster expanding after the trading deadline.

I've seen Lilja make too many game ending mistakes. Most recently, stupid penalty at the end of the EDM game last week, cost the Wings a win, plain and simple. I haven't seen Lebda hand a game to anyone like Lilja does on a regular basis.

Did you also happen to catch the game saving block he made last night?

[Opie 308]

Did you also happen to catch the game saving block he made last night?

You are wasting your bandwidth, the people who call him a turnover machine are still focusing on the turnover last post season.

No matter how much some one points out that he plays the PK, is a solid defenseman, blocks shots, posters will always say "Yeah real solid when he spoon fed Teemu!!!"

[RedStormRising 7]

Did you also happen to catch the game saving block he made last night?

Yeah real solid, well why didn't he make that play when he spoon fed Teemu!!!???

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

Yeah real solid, well why didn't he make that play when he spoon fed Teemu!!!???

He spoon fed Selanne? Right. Lilja was being pressured by both Selanne and Andy Mac in that play. Exactly where was Lebda and why wasn't he or anyone else covering their man as the Ducks led into the Wings defensive zone? I hate the fact that Andreas gets blamed constantly. Everyone needs to get over it already especially seeing as how he was the one who scored the Wings only goal to begin with.

[Izzy24 44]

Holy jumpin!!! I can't keep up with the sarcasm!

[Guest CaliWingsNut]

One of the reasons the Wings acquired Stuart was to keep Lilja out of the top four. The defense will most likely look like this when everyone is healthy:

Lidstrom-Rafalski

Kronwall-Stuart

Chelios-Lilja

(Who cares about nationality?)

My guess is that's it's really nice to be able to speak your first language with others on your team. You can say what you want, and the vast majority of other players have no clue what your saying to each other.

Didn't meech and 1-2 of these other guys have 2way contracts? My bet is that anyone w/ a 2way contract will be sent back to GR, and the rest kept until the end of the season to protect from waivers (since team size no longer matters).

[Guest Crymson]

With how Meech and Ericsson have been playing (yes, I have never been happier to have been eating my own foot about Meech) someone has to sit... I know Babcock likes sticking with guys that have been around, but Lebda has been flat out horrendous lately and especially with the lack of size, I'd really like to Ericsson stay in and Lebda be the scratch...

Kronwall-Rafalski

Stuart-Meech

Lilja-Ericsson

When Lebda plays 30 minutes, you see some giveaways and bad plays. When Lebda plays 15 minutes, you do not see this.

When Lilja plays 15 minutes, you see some giveaways and bad plays. When Lilja plays 30 minutes, you see more giveaways and bad plays.

Lebda is not a bad defenseman. He is not ready to play 30 minutes per night, but at lower amounts of time he really does very well. Lilja brings some shot-blocking to the table, yes---but half the time, the shots need blocking because he has failed to clear the zone. This assumes that he isn't already in the penalty box for committing some inane, careless penalty. Further, while he does indeed have size, it's useless in the regard in which you've described it; he doesn't use it for anything but shot-blocking.

Also, removing Lebda would leave us with only two puck-moving defensemen (Rafalski and Kronwall). In terms of movement with the puck itself, Lebda is the best we have; his speed is unbeatable. When paired with Chelios, Lebda does very well. When paired with anyone, Lilja makes mistakes.

Further, you should all note that this discussion is likely moot anyway, because, when Markov was signed, he bumped Lilja--not Lebda--from the lineup. Given that Lilja hasn't improved at all since last season, and given that Babcock rarely changes strategy, I'd say it's an extreme likelihood that Stuart will bump Lilja--not Lebda--in this situation as well.

You are correct.This will be the pairings in the playoffs.

Apparently Mr. Babcock posts on these forums.

Jokes aside, I'm curious as to why you're so confident in this despite all of Babcock's personnel choices in the past. You all know what he's likely to do in this situation, and that's to remove Lilja from the lineup. We didn't go and get a physical player in order to replace a puck-mover with him.

Edited March 3, 2008 by Crymson

[Chase 0]

Wow, I cant believe people here are choosing Lilja>Lebda!! Never thought Id see the day!!

Lids-Ralfi

Kronner-Stuart

Lilja-Lebda

Meech

Babs may switch Lebs and Meech in and out, but overall I think thats what the pairings will be.

[Superman54 91]

Ericsson will be on the move

Lilja will join Rafs

Stuart and Kronwall are playing amazing together so we won't see them getting split

[Superman54 91]

When Lebda plays 30 minutes, you see some giveaways and bad plays. When Lebda plays 15 minutes, you do not see this.

When Lilja plays 15 minutes, you see some giveaways and bad plays. When Lilja plays 30 minutes, you see more giveaways and bad plays.

Lebda is not a bad defenseman. He is not ready to play 30 minutes per night, but at lower amounts of time he really does very well. Lilja brings some shot-blocking to the table, yes---but half the time, the shots need blocking because he has failed to clear the zone. This assumes that he isn't already in the penalty box for committing some inane, careless penalty. Further, while he does indeed have size, it's useless in the regard in which you've described it; he doesn't use it for anything but shot-blocking.

Also, removing Lebda would leave us with only two puck-moving defensemen (Rafalski and Kronwall). In terms of movement with the puck itself, Lebda is the best we have; his speed is unbeatable. When paired with Chelios, Lebda does very well. When paired with anyone, Lilja makes mistakes.

Further, you should all note that this discussion is likely moot anyway, because, when Markov was signed, he bumped Lilja--not Lebda--from the lineup. Given that Lilja hasn't improved at all since last season, and given that Babcock rarely changes strategy, I'd say it's an extreme likelihood that Stuart will bump Lilja--not Lebda--in this situation as well.

Apparently Mr. Babcock posts on these forums.

Jokes aside, I'm curious as to why you're so confident in this despite all of Babcock's personnel choices in the past. You all know what he's likely to do in this situation, and that's to remove Lilja from the lineup. We didn't go and get a physical player in order to replace a puck-mover with him.

Im almost positive Lilja will get the nod before Lebda

Lilja has the most hits and blocked shots on the team, something wings need

Edit: Spelling

Edited March 4, 2008 by Superman54

[Yemack 1]

One of the reasons the Wings acquired Stuart was to keep Lilja out of the top four. The defense will most likely look like this when everyone is healthy:

Lidstrom-Rafalski

Kronwall-Stuart

Chelios-Lilja

(Who cares about nationality?)

I agree that Lilja is somewhat of liability of those starting 6 but if you actually read what I wrote you might have some idea about why some people might come up with idea like putting 5 russian players on a same line.

[RockyMountainWingGal 108]

He spoon fed Selanne? Right. Lilja was being pressured by both Selanne and Andy Mac in that play. Exactly where was Lebda and why wasn't he or anyone else covering their man as the Ducks led into the Wings defensive zone? I hate the fact that Andreas gets blamed constantly. Everyone needs to get over it already especially seeing as how he was the one who scored the Wings only goal to begin with.

Yes that is true. Noone else bothered to help with the offense - yet all that gets remembered is Lilja letting in the goal. I guess if I had to pick between the 2 of them - I'd go with Lilja from what I've seen.....

[stevkrause 1,247]

lol to all the people that don't about the roster expanding after the trading deadline.

I've seen Lilja make too many game ending mistakes. Most recently, stupid penalty at the end of the EDM game last week, cost the Wings a win, plain and simple. I haven't seen Lebda hand a game to anyone like Lilja does on a regular basis.

I said this on the first page, then agreed with someone else on the 2nd and now again with you on this page...

NO ONE IS GETTING SENT DOWN PEOPLE - ROSTERS ARE EXPANDED, QUIT USING THIS ARGUMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :

sorry... I feel better now...

[Jamaica Jon 1]

I said this on the first page, then agreed with someone else on the 2nd and now again with you on this page...

NO ONE IS GETTING SENT DOWN PEOPLE - ROSTERS ARE EXPANDED, QUIT USING THIS ARGUMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :

sorry... I feel better now...

Still, only 6 defenseman will be dressed next game (most likely)... I think that's what people are trying to debate: Who will be dressed for Wednesday's game. Whether they will or won't be sent down is irrelevant.

[Rice 42]

I agree that Lilja is somewhat of liability of those starting 6 but if you actually read what I wrote you might have some idea about why some people might come up with idea like putting 5 russian players on a same line.

I did read what you wrote. How do you justify pairing Rafalski and Chelios aside from the fact that they're both American? I'm sure Babcock wants to limit Chelios' and Lilja's ice time during the playoffs. Rafalski plays upwards of twenty-five minutes a game, so that pairing isn't going to work. Similar deal with Kronwall and Lilja.

[DyingAlive 27]

I'm going to be blunt with you guys.

With a healthy roster, on paper:

Lidstrom-Rafalski

Kronwall-Stuart

Chelios-Liljia (Ledba)

Looks GREAT. Does anyone else feel this way about our defensemen, assuming we have them all back in one piece.

[CapnSmitty 39]

I'm going to be blunt with you guys.

With a healthy roster, on paper:

Lidstrom-Rafalski

Kronwall-Stuart

Chelios-Liljia (Ledba)

Looks GREAT. Does anyone else feel this way about our defensemen, assuming we have them all back in one piece.

I agree that I really do like that setup, the only thing i have worries about is the speed of the chelli-lil pairing.

Dont get me wrong, Chelli is a beast, and damn near immortal, but pairing him with the pain train seems to me that could be our one weakness seeing as how both of those guys arent exactly blessed with speed, but believe me, having to make that choice seems to be such a small one in comparison to some other teams who are not as blessed as us with our Depth.

And also, some one stated that Big Rig (Ericsson) wasnt put on the Griffins Clear day roster, which he indeed was. If/When he gets sent back down expect him to pick up his play, since he is loving his chance with the big club, unlike some other guys who have been sent down, and took it as a kick to the nuts and played with out any kind of gumption down in GR

Edited March 4, 2008 by CapnSmitty

[Guest Crymson]

Im almost positive Lilja will get the nod before Lebda

Lilja has the most hits and blocked shots on the team, something wings need

Edit: Spelling

Lilja led the team in blocked shots and hits last season in the playoffs as well, yet he would not have been in the lineup were Schneider and Kronwall healthy.

Lilja has always been an excellent shot-blocker, and he always racks up numbers in hits---though his hits are, by and large, very weak given his size. I am quite sure that he led the team in blocked shots and in hits in '06 as well, yet Markov was brought in to replace him.

I feel the arguments I raised earlier are compelling, yet they have not yet been addressed in the least. Instead, people continue to say "this is how it'll be."

Edited March 4, 2008 by Crymson

[Yemack 1]

I did read what you wrote. How do you justify pairing Rafalski and Chelios aside from the fact that they're both American? I'm sure Babcock wants to limit Chelios' and Lilja's ice time during the playoffs. Rafalski plays upwards of twenty-five minutes a game, so that pairing isn't going to work. Similar deal with Kronwall and Lilja.

Of course we want to utilize Rafi as much as we can but the idea behind splitting Rafi and Lid is to be more effective against big fast guys battling along the board.

It is no secret Ducks and to some extend Sharks are gonna Crash the net, they will have 3 or as many as 4 guys around the net making crease cross pass or waiting for a rebound. Can Lid and Raf able to contain Bertuzzi and co around the net for half a game? Sure why not? But personally I like the sound of Lid + Stuy more.

I'm not saying we should go split Rafi and Lid RIGHT NOW because we gonna get swept in first round, it's just that If we have an ability to stretch other teams' defense with outlet pass coming from every defesive pairing, it might change the makeup of the series and give more operating room for our players, while we have decent chance to go toe to toe physically against any opposition line.

ps actually come to think about it, I don't know anything about Stuart.. so forget what I said lol

Edited March 4, 2008 by Yemack

[Guest Crymson]

When has Babcock, in the last 2.5 seasons, ever given ANY indication that he's going to bench Lebda?

Conversely, has Babcock during this period benched Lilja? Yes. Last year, a defenseman was signed specifically to bump him from the lineup.