3/28 GDT: Blues 4, Red Wings 3 (OT)

[Tane 17]

I went to the game too, and I thought Hudler's looked better than he has in the past 2 months.

The first 2 goals, I said ozzie didn't have a chance on.

The third, Osgood coulda have saved, but he got beat. That happens in sports. you get beat sometimes.

OT Goal, I left right away, I dind't stick around to see it anymore on the replay

Didn't think McCarty looked like he belonged on the ice tonight. He was skating hard, and giving everything he had, but just looked out of place so many times. Has a lot to do with not playing for so long, but at this point in the season, I have no problem giving him a "5 game tryout", but come playoff time, We need players that can help us win hockey games.

[J-Swift 0]

Rough game for Ozzie tonight. I'll agree with those stating that he definitely should've had #'s 3 and 4. Doesn't matter how much of a chance he had on the first and second goals. The third goal was ugly. The game winner in OT was brutal.

An NHL goalie has got to stop that shot, period. Especially after his teammates double up in shots on the opponent, and battle back to tie it after being down 3-1.

As for the Wings mailing it in for the first half of the game? That doesn't absolve Chris in the least. Bottom line is, once the guys got it going, it was HIS job to close the door.

He didn't. Period.

On to the next game.

I'd never expect you to be so tough on Ozzie. Only the over-time goal looked a little soft to me. Initially I thought the third Blues goal was weak, but the replay shows it deflecting off Lidstrom's leg.

As for Hudler, he made some horrible plays in his own end last night, but I thought he actually looked really good in the offensive zone. And Flip was great in his first game back.

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

I'd never expect you to be so tough on Ozzie. Only the over-time goal looked a little soft to me. Initially I thought the third Blues goal was weak, but the replay shows it deflecting off Lidstrom's leg.

As for Hudler, he made some horrible plays in his own end last night, but I thought he actually looked really good in the offensive zone. And Flip was great in his first game back.

Hudler was directly responsible for 2 of the goals, yet some of you are congratulating him for his offensive play. He's not only doing nothing on the scoresheet, but now he's imroving the other team's scoresheet.

He has to be a health scratch throughout the playoffs, because he's become a liability out there on the ice. Yeah, he can make some fancy plays with the puck here and there, but that doesn't make up for glaring defensive mistakes.

[chrisdetroit 189]

I whole-heartily agree that Hudler has no place on this team. He is our weakest link.

Mac played his first NHL game in like a year and it showed... yet he was responsible in the zone. Good thing, Mac will rapidly improve. It will take more than 5 games to be 100%. But he'll definelty be an asset when it truly matters (unless he is injured).

I might be the only fan here that doesn't care that we lost last night. I could give a rat's ass bout the presidents trophy. The only thing that matters is keeping our guys healthy first and sharp second.

I don't want them to play one ounce of physical play and I do NOT want anyone fighting. I don't want to see Frazen or any other player taking hits with pucks to the jaw or adomen.

Clearly, Huds should be benched for the playoffs- And hopefully Holland can move him before next season.

How can you say both these things in one post. Huds may improve and Mac maybe a failed experiment. You are not being logical. Mac has shown nothing to warrant your blind faith and Huds has had runs where he played great.

Both deserve a chance to earn ice time and with Homer and Sammy out, they will both get their chances. It's too early to reach a conclusion on either.

[gcom007 1,465]

Finally getting around to watching the game now as I was performing in a concert last night and missed it. Definitely not happy with the Wings general play in this game at all. I'm not going to freak out because you can't expect them to go all out at this point with the playoffs so close and the luxury we have being at the top of the standings. But they sure as hell better play a lot better starting in Game 1 if they want to have a prayer.

Johan Franzen is the man though. I love beyond measure how a hard worker like him is getting the goals and recognition he deserves. Here's hoping this isn't a fluke, but with hard workers like him, it rarely is. He's like Draper with more talent crossed with Holmstrom. If he keeps his confidence, he's going to have a great career most likely in this city.

I said earlier as a matter of principle that if a goalie gives up 3-4 goals in a game and the team in general played sloppy, he's as big of a part of the loss as anyone. Earlier in the season the team played sloppy and Osgood stood on his head and won games the team didn't deserve to win. He didn't do that last night. Can you really say he played bad? No. First goal was just a great play. Second goal was a weird deflection. Third goal looked like a deflection but I think no matter the fact on that one he should've had it. He wasn't as prepared just like everyone else in red at the quick turnaround there and it backfired on us. The overtime goal again was just a team playing sloppy including Osgood. You can't say Osgood played terrible because people saying he got little help are right, but he didn't play great and he didn't win. Goaltending like that won't work down the stretch.

But here's the bottom line I keep screaming from the heavens: if a team wants to go far in the playoffs, they need their goalies to come up with huge games. These excuses suggesting "you can't fault the goalie" are for the birds if you expect to go far. I mean, sure, in a lot of ways it's true, you can't fault the goalie on a lot of goals scored on us, but that's not enough. We need to be able to say "the goalie saved our ass." That's the difference down the stretch.

Have either of our goalies done that consistently in the second half?

No. Osgood had it in the first half but has been more average in the second half. Hasek went from terrible to an average similar to Osgood's second half. I'm sorry, but you can't expect that to be enough in the playoffs. I really think people are living in a pipe dream if they think Hasek's going to magically turn it on again because realistically he suffered from the same problems last year in the playoffs and if he wasn't, we wouldn't have lost Game 6 against Anaheim. He played as lousy as the rest of the team the whole game including the 3rd when the team finally showed up. You can say it's nitpicking to focus on one game, but it wasn't one game and when you're dealing with 7 game series and elimination games in the playoffs, you have to be picky and the whole point of having him here is because he's supposed to be the guy to come out huge in those games and he flat out didn't. He's not the goalie he was 10 years ago and this year has been rough on him. I mean no disrespect, but I don't see us going any further than last year with him starting.

That said, I feel the same way about Osgood unless he can find a way to play like he did in the first half. I think he's certainly capable and his body is more up for it than Hasek's at this point, but I don't know what it's going to take and I think it's unlikely to happen at this point. He hasn't done it consistently in 2008. Both goalies have played pretty well and at times excellent, but they've also fallen pretty flat at times too. Last night, you can point to Franzen and say he did his part to keep us in and give us a chance. He rose above. You can't say that about Osgood.

We need to be able to say that about our goaltending to win.

I'm not trying to be pessimistic or even say it's a bad thing because the reality is, not every team can win every year and not every team can have amazing goaltending every year. Goalies heat up for one year of playoffs and then their careers tank after that. The game is strange like that. Barring a miracle, I'd say with certainty that it's not going to happen with Hasek at this stage in his career and this year and I think it's unlikely to happen with Osgood at this point.

So unlike many, unless our team really shows up and plays great hockey all the way through and totally avoids injury, I see us going down in the Western Conference Finals. It'll be disappointing, but goaltending is a big piece of the puzzle and I don't think we've had the ability to put a clear #1 guy forward. Hasek's supposed to be the guy but he's been plagued by injuries when he should be doing final preparations and Osgood's supposed to be the backup and that is going to inhibit things for him no matter what anyone would like to think in "la la land."

One last thing to be clear. This isn't me saying we suck or we're horrible. This is me trying to be realistic about the fact that one team wins and while we're great and we certainly have a chance, everything is going to have to go our way for that to happen. We don't have near the margin of error that it seems some believe we have.

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

I went to the game too, and I thought Hudler's looked better than he has in the past 2 months.

As for Hudler, he made some horrible plays in his own end last night, but I thought he actually looked really good in the offensive zone.

I guess the three of us are a bunch of 'idiots.'

[seeinred 1,488]

Unless, of course, the score-sheet and video replays are fabricated and lying. I for one, want players on the team that will help us win games, not loose them.

3 D ANDREAS LILJA

5 D NICKLAS LIDSTROM ©

11 R DANIEL CLEARY

17 R DALLAS DRAKE

18 L KIRK MALTBY

22 D BRETT LEBDA

24 D CHRIS CHELIOS

25 R DARREN MCCARTY

26 C JIRI HUDLER

33 C KRIS DRAPER

44 C MARK HARTIGAN

51 C VALTTERI FILPPULA

55 D NIKLAS KRONVALL

82 R TOMAS KOPECKY

30 G CHRIS OSGOOD

35 G JAMES HOWARD

So since none of these guys were on the scoresheet last night, they all sucked? Are you saying a player needs a point to play well?

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

Unless, of course, the score-sheet and video replays are fabricated and lying. I for one, want players on the team that will help us win games, not loose them.

Flip was a -4 and played great. What the hell is your point? Not being on the scoresheet doesn't mean you weren't effective.

[J-Swift 0]

Hudler was directly responsible for 2 of the goals, yet some of you are congratulating him for his offensive play. He's not only doing nothing on the scoresheet, but now he's imroving the other team's scoresheet.

He has to be a health scratch throughout the playoffs, because he's become a liability out there on the ice. Yeah, he can make some fancy plays with the puck here and there, but that doesn't make up for glaring defensive mistakes.

Oh please. Don't categorize me as some Hudler fan boy. I've never been sold on him, and I'm not even saying he should be in the lineup in the post-season. But he looked very good in the offensive zone last night, in spite of some questionable plays in his own end.

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

So your point is that all these listed players are soley responsible to our loss 4-1 loss? I think hudler was responsible for 2 of those goals against through intolerable mistakes that he was responsible for. Take back ozzie's one or two bad goals and Hudlers dumb-ass mistakes, then damn near earned ourselves a shutout.

P.S. I noticed that you didn't touch on the video replay argument. So you agree Hudler is worthless on this team?

Hudler needs two guys with the sole purpose to cover him whenever he touches the puck because he is so irresponsible.

Maybe if we didn't have Hudler out there playing so irresponsible, we could actually get some work done and won the game. Come playoff time, the opposition team will feed off Hudlers mistakes, giving them energy to beat us.

Right now players' errors are going to be looked at very carefully. We're heading into the time of year that it truly matters.

Flips first game back and now you're comparing him to a healthy and in-shape Hudler? Why hudler really does suck, doesn't he? We have to compare him to a rusty, recently injured, rookie to make a point?? LMFAO!!11!!1

I stand behind my stance and will argue til hudler proves me wrong (which will never happen).... He will never amount to anything 'stable' in the NHL level. He needs to be cut off the team.

UMM I was not comparing the two. I was stating that just because you aren't on the scoresheet doesn't mean you weren't effective and I used Val as an example of that.

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

Oh please. Don't categorize me as some Hudler fan boy. I've never been sold on him, and I'm not even saying he should be in the lineup in the post-season. But he looked very good in the offensive zone last night, in spite of some questionable plays in his own end.

His offensive play led to nothing, while his defensive play led to 2 goals. That doesn't seem like a fair balance to me.

[seeinred 1,488]

So your point is that all these listed players are soley responsible to our loss 4-1 loss? I think hudler was responsible for 2 of those goals against through intolerable mistakes that he was responsible for. Take back ozzie's one or two bad goals and Hudlers dumb-ass mistakes, then damn near earned ourselves a shutout.

P.S. I noticed that you didn't touch on the video replay argument. So you agree Hudler is worthless on this team?

Hudler needs two guys with the sole purpose to cover him whenever he touches the puck because he is so irresponsible.

Maybe if we didn't have Hudler out there playing so irresponsible, we could actually get some work done and won the game. Come playoff time, the opposition team will feed off Hudlers mistakes, giving them energy to beat us.

Right now players' errors are going to be looked at very carefully. We're heading into the time of year that it truly matters.

Flips first game back and now you're comparing him to a healthy and in-shape Hudler? Why hudler really does suck, doesn't he? We have to compare him to a rusty, recently injured, rookie to make a point?? LMFAO!!11!!1

I stand behind my stance and will argue til hudler proves me wrong (which will never happen).... He will never amount to anything 'stable' in the NHL level. He needs to be cut off the team.

No, no. I was just saying that your stat sheet argument isn't terribly relevant. I told you before that I agree with a lot of what you've been saying, and one of those is that Hudler did not play very well at all last night. I don't know about cutting him, but he definitely needs to step up big time.

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

Agreed!

I don't think some people "get it"

SeeinRed, I don't think Hudler is capable of ever "stepping up". His shoot-out goals won't amount to anything in the post-season.

My hope Holland is can find a way to pull a rabbit out of the hat and find a way to trade Hudler to a clueless GM who thinks Hudler "will" amount to something.

Why because we don't agree with you? You need to realize that people DO have a difference of opinion and just because it isn't the same as yours doesn't mean it makes it any more wrong or right. Obviously you don't understand this by now and instead resort to throwing insults at those that differ from you. Grow the hell up already.

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

Why because we don't agree with you? You need to realize that people DO have a difference of opinion and just because it isn't the same as yours doesn't mean it makes it any more wrong or right. Obviously you don't understand this by now and instead resort to throwing insults at those that differ from you. Grow the hell up already.

I'm not trying to insult anyone, but what is the fascination with Hudler? If it's his scoring, he hasn't done that in months.

If it's anything else, then I can't possibly imagine what it could be, thus fill me in.

[Guest Hank=FutureCaptain]

3 D ANDREAS LILJA

5 D NICKLAS LIDSTROM ©

11 R DANIEL CLEARY

17 R DALLAS DRAKE

18 L KIRK MALTBY

22 D BRETT LEBDA

24 D CHRIS CHELIOS

25 R DARREN MCCARTY

26 C JIRI HUDLER

33 C KRIS DRAPER

44 C MARK HARTIGAN

51 C VALTTERI FILPPULA

55 D NIKLAS KRONVALL

82 R TOMAS KOPECKY

30 G CHRIS OSGOOD

35 G JAMES HOWARD

So since none of these guys were on the scoresheet last night, they all sucked? Are you saying a player needs a point to play well?

I don't think thats what he's saying.

First off, your argument is WEAK. Very weak.

He's saying that the ONLY thing that might have saved Huds night was if he showed up on the scoresheet. Well, he didn't. And as you just showed, many other Red Wings didnt either. But they sure the hell didn't play HORRIBLE on the other end either. But Hudler sure did. I don't care how decent you are in the offensive zone. If you're turning the puck over, making bad decisions and helping the other team score, you did NOT have a successful night. It's not rocket science here. And it has nothing to do with people's personal perspectives. It's pretty cut and dry IMO. And I fully agree with mrsanman here. If you thought Hudler played real well last night. Either you are blind, you missed the game, or you're an idiot. Bottom line.

[EuroTwinLove40 0]

I can't believe how harshly some of you people judge these players. I understand analyzing them and everything, but pure hatred for a player just seems utterly ridiculous. They are HUMAN. Therefore, they are going to make mistakes, they are going to have bad games and even bad streaks. Hate to tell you, but Hank, Pav, and even Nick make mistakes too. It happens. Actually, that's what makes the games fun to watch. If they were all perfect all the time it wouldn't be very much fun to watch. No matter what mistakes a certain player makes, a win or loss can't be blamed on an individual. Hockey is a TEAM sport.

The team played decent yesterday, but let's just hope they can step it wayyyy up tomorrow and slaughter the Preds!

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

I'm not trying to insult anyone, but what is the fascination with Hudler? If it's his scoring, he hasn't done that in months.

If it's anything else, then I can't possibly imagine what it could be, thus fill me in.

So now I have a fascination with Huds because I thought he played well last night?

Regardless of last nights game, I am a fan of Jiri's and have been for years. I think he's got great hands, can pass, make great plays, and has a really good shot. Yes, he does need to work on not giving up the puck, and start playing much better in the defensive zone, but overall I think he can be a dominant player.

BTW, he was responsible for only one goal. The first goal was on Lebda for not being able to cover the guy.

Edited March 29, 2008 by HockeyCrazy3033

[Guest Hank=FutureCaptain]

So now I have a fascination with Huds because I thought he played well last night and you guys disagree?

This isn't even a matter of opinion here. It is a FACT that Hudler played horrible in his own end. It is on VIDEO TAPE. You can't argue with video. Either you neglected to acknowledge his HORRIBLE decisions and just kept thinking about him looking decent offensively, or you are being a blind homer. Either way, you CAN NOT say a particular player had a good night when he was a huge reason for the other team scoring goals. The only possible way you could say Hudler made up for his horrible decisions is if he showed up on the scoresheet...which he did not. So really, there is no my opinion or your opinion. It is FACT and it's on video. That's like you saying, "my opinion is the winged wheel is blue." When anyone can cleary watch the video and see the winged wheel is white. It is what it is. And no way in hell anyone could look at what Hudler did overall last night and say he had a successful night. If you do, you're kidding yourself. And you're denying reality.

[Guest Jeremy88]

Come on guys...it isn't Hudler's fault, it isn't Ozzie's fault. The reason we lost was because we didn't have Sammy's Ultra great shot from the blue line on the 2nd pp.

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

This isn't even a matter of opinion here. It is a FACT that Hudler played horrible in his own end. It is on VIDEO TAPE. You can't argue with video. Either you neglected to acknowledge his HORRIBLE decisions and just kept thinking about him looking decent offensively, or you are being a blind homer. Either way, you CAN NOT say a particular player had a good night when he was a huge reason for the other team scoring goals. The only possible way you could say Hudler made up for his horrible decisions is if he showed up on the scoresheet...which he did not. So really, there is no my opinion or your opinion. It is FACT and it's on video. That's like you saying, "my opinion is the winged wheel is blue." When anyone can cleary watch the video and see the winged wheel is white. It is what it is. And no way in hell anyone could look at what Hudler did overall last night and say he had a successful night. If you do, you're kidding yourself. And you're denying reality.

Okay so first it's a fascination and now it's being a blind homer because I believe that Huds played well last night DESPITE the ONE yes..ONE goal he was responsible for. You guys make it seem like he was the sole reason the Wings lost. If you would of watched the 'video tape' you'd realize the team as a group played awful and that there were other factors as to why the Wings lost aside from Huds ONE giveaway that led to the 3rd goal.

[Outsider 42]

I'd never expect you to be so tough on Ozzie. Only the over-time goal looked a little soft to me. Initially I thought the third Blues goal was weak, but the replay shows it deflecting off Lidstrom's leg.

As for Hudler, he made some horrible plays in his own end last night, but I thought he actually looked really good in the offensive zone. And Flip was great in his first game back.

Ozzie's a big boy, he's been around awhile. He had a rough game. It happens. I wouldn't say he had a "bad" game last night, (God knows I've seen him have plenty of "bad" games.....this wasn't even close). He wasn't exactly a brick wall though, either.

And yes, I realize that the third goal was gift wrapped at at the blue line, and that it was also deflected. I still maintain that he could've, (even should've), stopped it. He got caught flat-footed. He relaxed. They scored. Again, it happens.

Unlike many Wings fans, I have high expectation for Chris. I know how good he can be when he's focused and on top of his game. He was neither last night.

We know it, HE knows it. Like I said, he's a big boy. He certainly doesn't need me to coddle him when he has a rough day at the rink.

[Guest Hank=FutureCaptain]

Okay so first it's a fascination and now it's being a blind homer because I believe that Huds played well last night DESPITE the ONE yes..ONE goal he was responsible for. You guys make it seem like he was the sole reason the Wings lost. If you would of watched the 'video tape' you'd realize the team as a group played awful and that there were other factors as to why the Wings lost aside from Huds ONE giveaway that led to the 3rd goal.

First off, let me make this clear that I don't think Hudler was the only reason we lost. Of course there are many factors. I'm just saying that to say Hudler had a good night is laughable. And yes, that is absolutely being a blind homer. Any player that is SOLEY RESPONSIBLE for another team's goal, and yet never shows up on the scoresheet to make up for it in any way, did NOT have a successful night. Unless you're being a blind homer and neglected the bad things he did, and focused on the "decent" things he did. Not taking his overall play into account while assessing his performance is the DEFINITION of being a blind homer. So yes, that is exactly what you are(on this subject that is).

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

I can't believe how harshly some of you people judge these players. I understand analyzing them and everything, but pure hatred for a player just seems utterly ridiculous. They are HUMAN. Therefore, they are going to make mistakes, they are going to have bad games and even bad streaks. Hate to tell you, but Hank, Pav, and even Nick make mistakes too. It happens. Actually, that's what makes the games fun to watch. If they were all perfect all the time it wouldn't be very much fun to watch. No matter what mistakes a certain player makes, a win or loss can't be blamed on an individual. Hockey is a TEAM sport.

The team played decent yesterday, but let's just hope they can step it wayyyy up tomorrow and slaughter the Preds!

So now I have a fascination with Huds because I thought he played well last night?

Regardless of last nights game, I am a fan of Jiri's and have been for years. I think he's got great hands, can pass, make great plays, and has a really good shot. Yes, he does need to work on not giving up the puck, and start playing much better in the defensive zone, but overall I think he can be a dominant player.

Hudler didn't just have one bad game, this has been going now for some time now. As I posted earlier, it's one thing not to do anything offensively, but now he's also making defensive mistakes leading to goals. All the attributes he has offensively, have been for nothing the last 2 months. When Homer comes back, Hudler should become a permanent, healthy scratch.

Also, you could say that he hasn't gotten enough minutes to score points, but as we saw last night, more minutes also means more chances for him to screw things up defensively. If he's going to play on the top 2 lines, he has to be more responsible than that, and he's just not ready.

BTW, he was responsible for only one goal. The first goal was on Lebda for not being able to cover the guy.

He's been horrible for more than just last night. With more minutes, comes more defensive responsibility, which he isn't handling ver well.

Edited March 29, 2008 by GMRwings1983

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

First off, let me make this clear that I don't think Hudler was the only reason we lost. Of course there are many factors. I'm just saying that to say Hudler had a good night is laughable. And yes, that is absolutely being a blind homer. Any player that is SOLEY RESPONSIBLE for another team's goal, and yet never shows up on the scoresheet to make up for it in any way, did NOT have a successful night. Unless you're being a blind homer and neglected the bad things he did, and focused on the "decent" things he did. Not taking his overall play into account while assessing his performance is the DEFINITION of being a blind homer. So yes, that is exactly what you are(on this subject that is).

You can assume whatever the hell you want about me. I'm done with this thread.

[StayStevieStay 0]

Hudler was responsible for that one goal because he got scared and lost the puck. Everyone is saying he played well and that's because of his first few shifts. It's tru - I watched the same thing, go back and watch the start of the game, Hudler was playing well - takeaways and all !