Radulov wants to come back lMAO

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Doc

Sorry for this epic rant. If we had a "i'm sorry for ranting emoticon I would use it hear.

Hey, i'm no expert on Russia or its workings. I've heard lots of different stories about how their athletes were treated. But I've heard things like they have mandatory military service for their athletes? Although they don't really serve in a military sense. I don't know if that's true or not and I don't care. It's not my place to tell the Russians how they were supposed to run their country. Frankly, I don't even know what obligations Fedorov had to his club or country. I'm just guessing that there was something there seeing as he had to sneak out in the middle of the night and be whisked out of the country with the aid of the Red Wings.

But i've also heard that the Russians pump/ed alot of dough into training their top athletes. Imagine seeing countless players like Fedorov leave the country and you get next to nothing in compensation for them. Of course the Wings did pay up for Feds. But how much? How much would you have paid to have a decade + worth of Sergei's services?

Should Radulov have bad mouthed the NHL. Probably not. If he wanted to play in Russia he just do so and leave his former employer out of it. But he didn't. Frankly, IMO its not something to get our collective panties in a bunch over. So what if he bad mouthed the NHL. Who really cares. That's not the crux of the issue.

We're talking about the fact that we as NHL fans love to see European's come over here no matter what the circumstances are. I have never once seen an NHL fan poo poo a foreign player who decides to defect, breach his contract, etc... with his club to come to the NHL. We love when they come to the NHL. But Radulov leaves and Wings fans are in an uproar b/c of the poor Predators situation. Our *******, hated rivals! What is that s***? Well that my friend is hypocrisy at its finest. And its people taking themselves way too seriously, like its a slight against the NHL or even moreso, a slight against AMERICA! Whatever.

From my seat, you dont' get to pick where you were born, what country you are raised in, what, if any military or other obligations you may have. And deciding you just don't like it and sneaking out of it to go somewhere else is actually of no concern to me. I could really care less if every Russian player defected or left their clubs tomorrow.

We as fans would love it and wouldn't shed a tear for poor old Russia. So when a player leaves here, breaches contract with an NHL club. I feel no sympathy for that club and I feel no ill will towards the player. A player leaving the NHL, even under contract, is something they've been doing for years. Just b/c the NHL has always been the beneficiary of these defections doesn't make it ok. And not ok when the NHL loses a player.

IMO, the Preds are due something from the club that signed Radulov. And if I were the Russians, Swedes, whomever. I'd be spitting on the transfer agreement the NHL proffered up b/c its a joke. We give them pennies and we get players like Ovechkin and Zetterberg.

The Boston Red Sox paid 51 freaking MILLION dollars to a Japanese baseball team just for the right to negotiate with Daisuke Matsuzaka. Imagine Dice-K defecting, breaching his contract with his team and just joining the Sox. Every baseball fan in the US that isn't a yankee fan would be loving it. But if A-rod bailed on the Yanks tomorrow, breached his contract and went to the Japanese league, MLB would be filing lawsuits and screaming bloody murder.

I bet the NHL hasn't paid 51 million dollars in total for every player who ever left their native country to come to the NHL. If I were a hockey fan in any of those countries, i'd be pissed off.

I get caught up in the principles of things I suppose. And for me, we've been reaping the benefits of players breaking contracts to come to the NHL forever. So don't come crying to me (not you personally) when somebody leaves the NHL b/c i'm going to call that person a goddamned baby and to quit 'yur whinin!

Edited September 12, 2008 by GordieSid&Ted

[jawbreaker 0]

Great post GordieSid&Ted. As I said before, European clubs are not against that their players leave them for the NHL. They just want the money for the players they have groomed.

One soccer example :

If the Real Madrid wants a player, then they ask the other club: How much? Madrid don't tell, that they will take him for free, 'cause they are Real Madrid, and the player would love to play for them.

If the NHL club wants a player, then they are telling: We will take him for free, 'cause we are the NHL club, and the player would love to play for us.

[Guest nutz2u]

Doc

Sorry for this epic rant. If we had a "i'm sorry for ranting emoticon I would use it hear.

Hey, i'm no expert on Russia or its workings. I've heard lots of different stories about how their athletes were treated. But I've heard things like they have mandatory military service for their athletes? Although they don't really serve in a military sense. I don't know if that's true or not and I don't care. It's not my place to tell the Russians how they were supposed to run their country. Frankly, I don't even know what obligations Fedorov had to his club or country. I'm just guessing that there was something there seeing as he had to sneak out in the middle of the night and be whisked out of the country with the aid of the Red Wings.

But i've also heard that the Russians pump/ed alot of dough into training their top athletes. Imagine seeing countless players like Fedorov leave the country and you get next to nothing in compensation for them. Of course the Wings did pay up for Feds. But how much? How much would you have paid to have a decade + worth of Sergei's services?

Should Radulov have bad mouthed the NHL. Probably not. If he wanted to play in Russia he just do so and leave his former employer out of it. But he didn't. Frankly, IMO its not something to get our collective panties in a bunch over. So what if he bad mouthed the NHL. Who really cares. That's not the crux of the issue.

We're talking about the fact that we as NHL fans love to see European's come over here no matter what the circumstances are. I have never once seen an NHL fan poo poo a foreign player who decides to defect, breach his contract, etc... with his club to come to the NHL. We love when they come to the NHL. But Radulov leaves and Wings fans are in an uproar b/c of the poor Predators situation. Our *******, hated rivals! What is that s***? Well that my friend is hypocrisy at its finest. And its people taking themselves way too seriously, like its a slight against the NHL or even moreso, a slight against AMERICA! Whatever.

From my seat, you dont' get to pick where you were born, what country you are raised in, what, if any military or other obligations you may have. And deciding you just don't like it and sneaking out of it to go somewhere else is actually of no concern to me. I could really care less if every Russian player defected or left their clubs tomorrow.

We as fans would love it and wouldn't shed a tear for poor old Russia. So when a player leaves here, breaches contract with an NHL club. I feel no sympathy for that club and I feel no ill will towards the player. A player leaving the NHL, even under contract, is something they've been doing for years. Just b/c the NHL has always been the beneficiary of these defections doesn't make it ok. And not ok when the NHL loses a player.

IMO, the Preds are due something from the club that signed Radulov. And if I were the Russians, Swedes, whomever. I'd be spitting on the transfer agreement the NHL proffered up b/c its a joke. We give them pennies and we get players like Ovechkin and Zetterberg.

The Boston Red Sox paid 51 freaking MILLION dollars to a Japanese baseball team just for the right to negotiate with Daisuke Matsuzaka. Imagine Dice-K defecting, breaching his contract with his team and just joining the Sox. Every baseball fan in the US that isn't a yankee fan would be loving it. But if A-rod bailed on the Yanks tomorrow, breached his contract and went to the Japanese league, MLB would be filing lawsuits and screaming bloody murder.

I bet the NHL hasn't paid 51 million dollars in total for every player who ever left their native country to come to the NHL. If I were a hockey fan in any of those countries, i'd be pissed off.

I get caught up in the principles of things I suppose. And for me, we've been reaping the benefits of players breaking contracts to come to the NHL forever. So don't come crying to me (not you personally) when somebody leaves the NHL b/c i'm going to call that person a goddamned baby and to quit 'yur whinin!

I totally agree with most of your post. The only problem I have is that if a player has a valid contract they signed they should honor it. No one made them sign it. Used to piss me off when players had a contract and would not show up at training camp because they wanted to renegotiate it. Glad they can no longer do that.

[Doc Holiday 0]

I just don't see where the player's rights come into play here. If I live in a different country than the country where a league is and I want to play there, I'll be damned if some clause is going to force me to play somewhere I don't want to be. It is like if I worked at a certain office and I decided I wanted to jump ship and work somewhere with more pay, better benefits, or what have you. Does the company I am going to have to pay the company I used to work for a certain sum to gain my rights? No, because it is my decision. Ovenchkin and Fedorov CHOSE to come here, and if the KHL and others want their players to stay they should put up a decent product. That is why I have no problem with guys like Jagr leaving the NHL if it isn't a breach of contract, because it is their decision, not the NHLs to whether he is allowed to leave.

Should players from Europe pay a sum if they don't feel like playing anymore, even when the country put a large sum getting them to where they are today? I don't seem to understand it.

Should the NHL compensate the OHL for the talent they "stole"? I mean the OHL put up good money to groom the players and make them better.

I am not trying to demean your argument I just don't understand the logic here. Players have rights.

[jawbreaker 0]

I just don't see where the player's rights come into play here. If I live in a different country than the country where a league is and I want to play there, I'll be damned if some clause is going to force me to play somewhere I don't want to be. It is like if I worked at a certain office and I decided I wanted to jump ship and work somewhere with more pay, better benefits, or what have you. Does the company I am going to have to pay the company I used to work for a certain sum to gain my rights? No, because it is my decision. Ovenchkin and Fedorov CHOSE to come here, and if the KHL and others want their players to stay they should put up a decent product. That is why I have no problem with guys like Jagr leaving the NHL if it isn't a breach of contract, because it is their decision, not the NHLs to whether he is allowed to leave.

Should players from Europe pay a sum if they don't feel like playing anymore, even when the country put a large sum getting them to where they are today? I don't seem to understand it.

Should the NHL compensate the OHL for the talent they "stole"? I mean the OHL put up good money to groom the players and make them better.

I am not trying to demean your argument I just don't understand the logic here. Players have rights.

Yes, players have rights. They have rights to sign a contract, or not to sign a contract. If you are a prospect (not matters from Europe, or from the North America), then your rights are limited. You can't choose any NHL-team. You can't demand any salary.

Difference between OHL, and European leagues are so huge than it's silly to compare. As far as I know OHL, or any NA junior hockey leagues doesn't make their money from the transfers. Plus, they have the age limit. And what is the most important: they are not a PRO leagues. On the other hand European leagues make some money on these transfers, it's vital to them (I'm talking about small clubs, not Russian Oil clubs). If small club doesn't get the transfer money for the players, then they are in trouble.

Small example: (this is how it should be)

If Filatov wants to play in NA, then there would be choices to make:

1. Columbus pays a transfer money to the CSKA, and Filatov is free to go.

2. If Columbus is not willing to pay, then Filatov waits until he is 24, and is not a RFA in the home league (I think they don't have this UFA, and RFA. But they should.) After that Filatov is free to go.

The restricted free agent part is the exact same as in the NHL. So about what player rights we are talking here?

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

I just don't see where the player's rights come into play here. If I live in a different country than the country where a league is and I want to play there, I'll be damned if some clause is going to force me to play somewhere I don't want to be. It is like if I worked at a certain office and I decided I wanted to jump ship and work somewhere with more pay, better benefits, or what have you. Does the company I am going to have to pay the company I used to work for a certain sum to gain my rights? No, because it is my decision. Ovenchkin and Fedorov CHOSE to come here, and if the KHL and others want their players to stay they should put up a decent product. That is why I have no problem with guys like Jagr leaving the NHL if it isn't a breach of contract, because it is their decision, not the NHLs to whether he is allowed to leave.

Should players from Europe pay a sum if they don't feel like playing anymore, even when the country put a large sum getting them to where they are today? I don't seem to understand it.

Should the NHL compensate the OHL for the talent they "stole"? I mean the OHL put up good money to groom the players and make them better.

I am not trying to demean your argument I just don't understand the logic here. Players have rights.

That's the entire point Doc. Fedorov didn't want to play in Russia but he had a "clause", contract, obligation,whatever the heck you want to call it....to do exactly that. He should've stayed in Russia and honored that obligation. But he didn't and the Redwings and the NHL reaped the benefits of that.

Now the shoe is on the other foot and Radulov is saying "BE DAMNED MY CRAPPY NASHVILLE CONTRACT!" and he's out of here. Exactly what you are saying, nobody is going to keep you where you don't want to be.

In a perfect world players would honor their contracts.

In a perfect world NHL teams would negotiate with foreign teams to pay them to bring under contract players over.

I suppose the days of defections, etc... are over. But the days of players breaching contracts certainly are not.

IMO, any team that accepts a player who is under contract should be made to pay the other team a size able, fair market value for that player.

Basically its a win, win, win situation for everybody.

Use the Radulov example: Let's say he breaches his contract with Nashville, goes to Russia but the Russian club pays Nashville a handsome, bigass sum of cash for him, a sum Nashville is pleased with.

Nashville: Loses a player but gains money and cap space and rids itself of a player who doesn't want to be there (can you say locker room cancer)

Russian club: Gets player who wants to be there, gets marquee name player to generate interest in its club, but has to pay to get those services since Rads was under contract.

Radulov: Loses the chance to play in the top league in the world but gets to play where he's happy and gets to make a hell of alot more money.

Everybody wins in this scenario, at least to some degree.

[Earthhuman 8]

Honor isn't the issue in the article.

If all the best hockey players are going to the NHL constantly, then foreign countries get pissed, invest less money in their leagues, and turn out less big players. If Russia says to Hell with hockey, then no more Malkins, Ovechkins, Zherdevs. You need to keep the foreign leagues happy to pilfer at a controlled but consistent rate.

Make sense Doc?

[al48 1]

That's the entire point Doc. Fedorov didn't want to play in Russia but he had a "clause", contract, obligation,whatever the heck you want to call it....to do exactly that. He should've stayed in Russia and honored that obligation. But he didn't and the Redwings and the NHL reaped the benefits of that.

Now the shoe is on the other foot and Radulov is saying "BE DAMNED MY CRAPPY NASHVILLE CONTRACT!" and he's out of here. Exactly what you are saying, nobody is going to keep you where you don't want to be.

In a perfect world players would honor their contracts.

In a perfect world NHL teams would negotiate with foreign teams to pay them to bring under contract players over.

I suppose the days of defections, etc... are over. But the days of players breaching contracts certainly are not.

IMO, any team that accepts a player who is under contract should be made to pay the other team a size able, fair market value for that player.

Basically its a win, win, win situation for everybody.

Use the Radulov example: Let's say he breaches his contract with Nashville, goes to Russia but the Russian club pays Nashville a handsome, bigass sum of cash for him, a sum Nashville is pleased with.

Nashville: Loses a player but gains money and cap space and rids itself of a player who doesn't want to be there (can you say locker room cancer)

Russian club: Gets player who wants to be there, gets marquee name player to generate interest in its club, but has to pay to get those services since Rads was under contract.

Radulov: Loses the chance to play in the top league in the world but gets to play where he's happy and gets to make a hell of alot more money.

Everybody wins in this scenario, at least to some degree.

Look, I apologize for my seemingly assholic attitude earlier. My point wasn't that the Soviet players were actually slaves. In comparison to other Soviet athletes they were treated relatively well. The fact, however, is that they weren't really allowed to pursue a career on THEIR terms. That's the comparison I was trying to draw. They were, in all terms, property, and couldn't pursue relations with the West. These players became increasingly aware of the short end of the stick they were getting and that's why they were beginning to defect. Also, let's not forget the countless Soviet players who, prior to Mogilny, wanted to make a living out west and were subsequently brought down by the Soviet government. My point is, there's a lot more to any of this than "contracts". Soviet players and players of the entire Eastern Bloc weren't just able to shop around, and don't ever forget the effect the cold war had in a lot of people's lives.

Edited September 13, 2008 by al48

[Doc Holiday 0]

Honor isn't the issue in the article.

If all the best hockey players are going to the NHL constantly, then foreign countries get pissed, invest less money in their leagues, and turn out less big players. If Russia says to Hell with hockey, then no more Malkins, Ovechkins, Zherdevs. You need to keep the foreign leagues happy to pilfer at a controlled but consistent rate.

Make sense Doc?

OHL? They are the creators of players like Steve Yzerman yet they don't reap any benefits from getting their players drafted. And after 20 years it seems that the leagues haven't disappointed when it comes to talent overseas.

Also, if we are talking SOLEY about players who breach contracts, then I agree with the notion that the NHL should pay to bring players over who are under a contract with a foreign league. That seems completely fair in my book.

[Dabura 12,232]

Like I've said before, the humor in all this is that Radulov isn't even a product of the Russian hockey machine -- he came out of the North American system. All this talk about the U.S. stealing Russian players certainly doesn't apply in his case, and really, it hasn't been a big issue for a long time now. If the KHL wants "vengeance" or whatever, they're gonna have to do a lot better than Jagr and some scrubs.

Also, lol @ Radulov.

[Opie 308]

BERN, Switzerland (AP)—Ice hockey’s world governing body has ruled that Russian forward Alexander Radulov was wrong to sign for a club in his home country while under contract with the Nashville Predators, but won’t be suspended.

The International Ice Hockey Federation says it has no legal basis to suspend him from playing because there is no agreement in place to regulate international transfers.

The IIHF ordered an investigation after Radulov signed in July with Salavat Yulayev Ufa of the new Continental Hockey League. He still had one year left on a binding contract with Nashville, and the team suspended him indefinitely.

NHL and Russian officials are meeting in Switzerland on Wednesday to explore ways of bringing the case to court.

Per Yahoo

[Rivalred 630]

So Switzerland is staying neutral again?

[Shutemdown 23]

Ok... the point was just proven in all of your posts. Thank you to everyone who posted their thoughts. There's no need to argue.

Just as Radulov caught some heat for leaving his North American club to play oversees, imagine the European fans that saw a favorite player of theirs move to America and become a star. What if Radulov would have prospered in Russia? What if he became a superstar there? Would everyone be alright with it and completely agree? No... I can imagine the fans, particularly Nashville's fans, would feel like they had been robbed.

Just as he "defected" to Russia to play overseas, their players come here. Still... you have to understand Europe being a little bitter.

One would think that giving compensation to those European teams for their homegrown talent would make this whole ordeal alot easier... Maybe NA teams SHOULD pay a larger sum in order to contract players overseas. It would probably result in a more mutual, two-sided relationship.

[Opie 308]

Ok... the point was just proven in all of your posts. Thank you to everyone who posted their thoughts. There's no need to argue.

Just as Radulov caught some heat for leaving his North American club to play oversees, imagine the European fans that saw a favorite player of theirs move to America and become a star. What if Radulov would have prospered in Russia? What if he became a superstar there? Would everyone be alright with it and completely agree? No... I can imagine the fans, particularly Nashville's fans, would feel like they had been robbed.

Just as he "defected" to Russia to play overseas, their players come here. Still... you have to understand Europe being a little bitter.

One would think that giving compensation to those European teams for their homegrown talent would make this whole ordeal alot easier... Maybe NA teams SHOULD pay a larger sum in order to contract players overseas. It would probably result in a more mutual, two-sided relationship.

1 question who is holding a gun to the head of these players?

Are they being stolen away in the middle of the night? other than Feds!

Do you feel any bitterness towards the players?

[T.Low 1,011]

Great post GordieSid&Ted. As I said before, European clubs are not against that their players leave them for the NHL. They just want the money for the players they have groomed.

One soccer example :

If the Real Madrid wants a player, then they ask the other club: How much? Madrid don't tell, that they will take him for free, 'cause they are Real Madrid, and the player would love to play for them.

If the NHL club wants a player, then they are telling: We will take him for free, 'cause we are the NHL club, and the player would love to play for us.

So, too bad, so sad. When I groom my employees all winter long so that they will be able to perform in the summer, only to have them leave for a company that can offer them more than I can, I'm not getting paid for my time invested in these employees.

I realize that you are European and therefore not used to how competition works, and you think that some else should always be paying for what you need, but that is not a fair way to distribute scarce resources.

The bottom line is, if Europe can't offer the players enough to stay, then Europe does not deserve to keep them.

In Europe, if your wife leaves you for a man that has more to offer her, does he pay you for her?

[Guest Four]

Radulov wants to stay in Russia now

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news?slug=ap-r...p&type=lgns