Who would produce the most on the 2nd line?

[wingslionstigers 12]

This is not an omg red wings this that thread. Wings are 9-2-3 and they have already faced some of their hardest games of the season until crunch time comes around. They do have some improving to do and its going to happen.

None the less i was just wondering what everyone thinks about our 1st/2nd line combo. Zetterberg and Hudler have been connecting for some goals when they are paired. Although i can't help but notice Zetterberg just seems like he has to float around a little more than he would like to find his linemates. He just doesn't have the same options he had with Dats. Hes been producing alot of points but i just wonder what Hossa could do on the second line.

I think Hossa would have the best chances of producing on the second line. Hossa doesn't need great passes and line mates to work with. He just needs to simply shoot the puck from anywhere and everywhere. Hossa's one of those solo heroes out of nowhere at any given time kinda player in my perspective. It's really not a question of what combo would produce the most points on the first line because i think whatever you do your probably going to get close to the same results. The real controversy here is who would put up better numbers on the second line?

Edited November 13, 2008 by wingslionstigers

[Heroes of Hockeytown 694]

Hank and Franzen should do alright.

[CrossoverThrash 0]

Hank and Franzen have good chemistry, the problem is the other player on the line seemingly not on track wiht those two, thats where i think you might give leino a try

[The Secret 304]

I agree that there is a good chemistry between Zetts and Franzen but a good, consistent 3rd is required and I also would like to see what Leino could do. Sammy, Hudler have both failed. Filpula has been the best option but IMO he has not been earning his keep for his new salary.

[Slave 31]

i think hudler was not givin enough of a tryout, the guy can obviously put up points, look what he did against the pens...anyways it seems to me like Fil is floating lost out there on the second line, almost like he has a "holy crap i am playing with z and franzen...what do i do?" Sammy as much as i really am not a fan of the guy was not horribly bad out there with Z. I would want Leino to at least get a shot on that line but that is just me and the wings make you "earn your spot" not just give a non proven nhler 2nd line ice time. from the roster we have now i would like to see huds play there again, but i think huds and fil have some chemistry together as well., If i was coach i would have it set up like this:

homer/dats/hossa

leino/Z/franzen

Hudler/Fil/Cleary

Maltby/Draper/Sammy

Aside from that if i go by my nhl09 lineup the coach has Z and Franzen playing with maltby on the wing and they are doing ok

[b.shanafan14 733]

I think Filppula should stay up on the second line with Franzen and Zetterberg for a few games and see how it goes. Hudler had a good game vs. the Pens tho, so maybe his second chance is paying off. I don't think our first and second lines are the problem either way, with each having two of Hossa, Pav, Hank, and Mule, its our third line thats been invisible so far this season. Its fine that the first two take the vast majority, but you need the others to pitch in a bit more.

No matter what, I think its time to finally give Hudler or Filppula a consistent second-line spot and stop wasting a forward spot on Samuelsson who adds little to nothing and will in all likelyhood be gone next season. Also, anyone on the point in the second powerplay unit EXCEPT Samuelsson, please. Its pathetic, having a subpar forward with a hard and inaccurate shot who can't hold the zone and gets caught switching back to forward without warning didn't work well with Jason Williams, and it looks horrendous with Samuelsson.

[DRW Dominance 255]

I would say leave it as is for now. These lines need to gel a bit and I think that is part of the reason for the defensive struggles of our forwards right now.

[egroen 384]

Zetterberg is a better all-around player than Hossa and can set others up better, while still being a consistent scoring threat. Having Franzen back will give him a legitimate 2nd option and we should see his assists start to take off.

Get Samuelsson off the second line - he just turns the puck over too much to make that line a real #1 line alternative and is a poor compliment to Franzen and Zetterberg. Hudler is still my first choice because he is the best set up man, followed by Filppula because I think he has the potential. Leino would also probably be a good fit there.

I want to see Samuelsson play consistently with Cleary and maybe Kopecky. On that line, Samuelsson could throw as many pucks towards the net as he wants, with Cleary and Kopecky banging away and getting some sloppies. Not a bad energy/chaos line.

[This Is Bida 0]

I do not understand why so many people insist on Hossa being on the 2nd line. Hossa is the 4 or 5th top scorer in the NHL right now. Granted, Zetterberg could be up there too with Dats but he's not. Zetterberg, and hell, even Franzen is producing right after coming back from an injury. Franzen and Z are fine together. The first line is taking care of business just like they should. I'm not saying Hossa did us a favor by signing with Detroit but considering he took a pretty large paycut to come here he should have the right to play with Dats as long as they're producing.

The funny part about it is that our offense has been spectacular. Scoring in bunches, highlight reel goals. Right about now, there's not much reason to mess with the first 2 lines. The ONLY thing I think needs to change with our offense is that, I truthfully believe that Leino, Helm (and hell, probably even Abdelkader) should be playing in place of McCarty & Kopy (and take your pick for Abdelkader. At one time I would've said Malts but he's been playing phenomenal lately).

As far as our first 2 lines go, not many other teams can come close to competing with us as far as our talent on those 2 lines. No reason to change it.

[Pavel Hossyukstrom 2]

I do not understand why so many people insist on Hossa being on the 2nd line. Hossa is the 4 or 5th top scorer in the NHL right now. Granted, Zetterberg could be up there too with Dats but he's not. Zetterberg, and hell, even Franzen is producing right after coming back from an injury. Franzen and Z are fine together. The first line is taking care of business just like they should. I'm not saying Hossa did us a favor by signing with Detroit but considering he took a pretty large paycut to come here he should have the right to play with Dats as long as they're producing.

The funny part about it is that our offense has been spectacular. Scoring in bunches, highlight reel goals. Right about now, there's not much reason to mess with the first 2 lines. The ONLY thing I think needs to change with our offense is that, I truthfully believe that Leino, Helm (and hell, probably even Abdelkader) should be playing in place of McCarty & Kopy (and take your pick for Abdelkader. At one time I would've said Malts but he's been playing phenomenal lately).

As far as our first 2 lines go, not many other teams can come close to competing with us as far as our talent on those 2 lines. No reason to change it.

On Malts it must be the NHL Live interview he did the other day

[withinyouwithoutyou 0]

Hossa-Dats-Homer

Franzen-Z-Cleary

Hudler-Filpulla-Sammy

Maltby-Draper-McCarty

those would be the best lines...fo sho

[clutchngrab 12]

On Malts it must be the NHL Live interview he did the other day

Our 90's 4th line is very aware of the young blood nipping at their heals.

[Seraph 240]

I was just wondering this unmentionable thought to myself the other day. Do you think the organization would pair Dats and Hossa (versus Z and Hossa) so Z won't be putting up as much points, creating a talking point for contract negotiations? You know, them saying: you're not putting up as much points as Dats, so maybe you should be content with the offers we're giving you. I understand Z is by far a proven player, Conn Smythe winner, but in general, do things like this happen?

I mean, if either Dats and Z could perform with Hossa, and Dats is locked up, why not let him enjoy the extra productivity? It probably wouldn't hurt the team any.

[Grim 5]

floating around is Zetterberg's forte.

defenses break down, eventually someone gets open.

[egroen 384]

I was just wondering this unmentionable thought to myself the other day. Do you think the organization would pair Dats and Hossa (versus Z and Hossa) so Z won't be putting up as much points, creating a talking point for contract negotiations? You know, them saying: you're not putting up as much points as Dats, so maybe you should be content with the offers we're giving you. I understand Z is by far a proven player, Conn Smythe winner, but in general, do things like this happen?

I mean, if either Dats and Z could perform with Hossa, and Dats is locked up, why not let him enjoy the extra productivity? It probably wouldn't hurt the team any.

Could it also be why Hudler is getting so little playing time?

Probably not... but I wouldn't mind if that was the reason.

[Chunkylover 26]

Sometimes I feel bad for Hank getting demoted and then playing with Samuelsson and Filppula or Cleary. But he's still putting up a lot of points so good on him. I think the most powerful counterpoint during contract negotiations will be the injury factor.

Samuelsson is one of the most defensively responsible forwards out there. He's always mindful of when a defenseman is pinching. Sure he can cough up the puck but so can Rafalski who's making six times as much as Sammy. And yeah his shot is inaccurate but at least he's doing what the coach is telling him to do: shoot the puck!

Hudler doesn't need any more second line time to prove that he just can't compete with the opponents top four defensemen. He thrives against bottom pairings and on outnumbered situations and that's really where he's the best fit.

It seems like whether it's Sammy, Fil, or Clears on the second line they underachieve and that needs to be solved because there's no reason for that to happen when you've got Mule and Z killin' everybody out there.

I say leave Fil with Z based on his potential and paycheck. Rotate Cleary in when he's healthy. Samuelsson is ahead of Hudler on this particular depth chart.

[kook_10 1,705]

Sometimes I feel bad for Hank getting demoted and then playing with Samuelsson and Filppula or Cleary. But he's still putting up a lot of points so good on him.

It seems like whether it's Sammy, Fil, or Clears on the second line they underachieve and that needs to be solved because there's no reason for that to happen when you've got Mule and Z killin' everybody out there.

I say leave Fil with Z based on his potential and paycheck. Rotate Cleary in when he's healthy.

[hey guys - noobie here!]

just curious - what is it that you guys think the third man on the 2nd line should bring? with z and Mule I dont think its goals. i like Fil there because he puts in good work in the offensive corners and has good puck protection skills against the boards. he could possibly save Z some work so he can backcheck in the 3rd period. ...so long as his assists pick up.

Edited November 14, 2008 by kook_10

[Chunkylover 26]

[hey guys - noobie here!]

just curious - what is it that you guys think the third man on the 2nd line should bring? with z and Mule I dont think its goals. i like Fil there because he puts in good work in the offensive corners and has good puck protection skills against the boards. he could possibly save Z some work so he can backcheck in the 3rd period. ...so long as his assists pick up.

It would be nice if the third guy could get the odd goal and some consistent assists. His linemates are too good for him not to see any production. Sammy, Fil, and Cleary all have good defensive instincts and fit well there but they should be benefitting from Z and Mule which heretofore none have.

[b.shanafan14 733]

I was just wondering this unmentionable thought to myself the other day. Do you think the organization would pair Dats and Hossa (versus Z and Hossa) so Z won't be putting up as much points, creating a talking point for contract negotiations? You know, them saying: you're not putting up as much points as Dats, so maybe you should be content with the offers we're giving you. I understand Z is by far a proven player, Conn Smythe winner, but in general, do things like this happen?

I mean, if either Dats and Z could perform with Hossa, and Dats is locked up, why not let him enjoy the extra productivity? It probably wouldn't hurt the team any.

No, they are simply trying to create two balanced highly productive top lines, and they are very successful in doing so. Look at them as near equivalents in skill: Franzen-Zetterberg-Fil/Hud/Sam have nearly the skill of Pav-Hossa-Homer when you think that Franzen is a more skilled version of Homer (the Hossa of the the Homer position), Z and Pav are equals, and whoever the other wing on the second line is plays as less skilled version of Hossa (the Homer of the Hossa position).

Everyone in the league knows Hanks worth, thats a non-issue. Its really going to come down to making Hank know that come hell or high water he is going to be in a Winged-Wheel for the rest of his career, he just needs to decide if he would rather play alongside great players for that period or have an extra million a year.

Sometimes I feel bad for Hank getting demoted and then playing with Samuelsson and Filppula or Cleary. But he's still putting up a lot of points so good on him. I think the most powerful counterpoint during contract negotiations will be the injury factor.

Zetterberg on the "second" line isn't a demotion, see above. Think of them as Lines 1A and 1B.

[CrossoverThrash 0]

i think hudler was not givin enough of a tryout, the guy can obviously put up points, look what he did against the pens...anyways it seems to me like Fil is floating lost out there on the second line, almost like he has a "holy crap i am playing with z and franzen...what do i do?" Sammy as much as i really am not a fan of the guy was not horribly bad out there with Z. I would want Leino to at least get a shot on that line but that is just me and the wings make you "earn your spot" not just give a non proven nhler 2nd line ice time. from the roster we have now i would like to see huds play there again, but i think huds and fil have some chemistry together as well., If i was coach i would have it set up like this:

homer/dats/hossa

leino/Z/franzen

Hudler/Fil/Cleary

Maltby/Draper/Sammy

Aside from that if i go by my nhl09 lineup the coach has Z and Franzen playing with maltby on the wing and they are doing ok

Hudler was getting gassed, he is not big enough or physical enough to play on a line with franzen and z simple as that, he was just getting pushed around and left behind

[Guest EZBAKETHAGANGSTA]

Hudler was getting gassed, he is not big enough or physical enough to play on a line with franzen and z simple as that, he was just getting pushed around and left behind

You could tell this by the whole 1 and a half games he played on the 2nd line this year? Hudler has good chemsitry with Z + Franzen, as his powerplay points show. If Hudler was 2 inchs taller and 15 pds heavier, no one would question him.

[egroen 384]

You could tell this by the whole 1 and a half games he played on the 2nd line this year? Hudler has good chemsitry with Z + Franzen, as his powerplay points show. If Hudler was 2 inchs taller and 15 pds heavier, no one would question him.

In no way has Hudler "proven" he can not hack it on the second line - we have barely seen him there. Samuelsson does something every ten games or so that makes him look like a decent option on that second line, then he goes back to being the space on the ice where plays go to die. So far this season, Filppula and Cleary have "proven" they do not belong there either.

[chrisdetroit 189]

In no way has Hudler "proven" he can not hack it on the second line - we have barely seen him there. Samuelsson does something every ten games or so that makes him look like a decent option on that second line, then he goes back to being the space on the ice where plays go to die. So far this season, Filppula and Cleary have "proven" they do not belong there either.

None of the 3 - Huds, Flip, Sammy or Dan have "clicked" on the second line. Part of that has been Mule was gone for 5 games and Babs hasn't left any of them up there long enough.

My bet is that they each get a chance to try it for a longer period of time until one of them wins the position. It looks like Flip will get the first shot at it and IMO he is the better playmaker. Huds has great hands but he doesn't have the confidence. He defers to Hank and Mule instead of playing on equal terms with them. He is certainly talented enough but I think he is lacking confidence.

[egroen 384]

Huds has great hands but he doesn't have the confidence. He defers to Hank and Mule instead of playing on equal terms with them. He is certainly talented enough but I think he is lacking confidence.

Heh... I wonder how he could be possibly be lacking confidence

[Guest EZBAKETHAGANGSTA]

In no way has Hudler "proven" he can not hack it on the second line - we have barely seen him there. Samuelsson does something every ten games or so that makes him look like a decent option on that second line, then he goes back to being the space on the ice where plays go to die. So far this season, Filppula and Cleary have "proven" they do not belong there either.

you do realise that I was agreeing that Hudler is more suited then the other players, correct?