YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 I'd give a 2nd and Kopecky for Neil -- though that is probably overpaying; I just think he would be a great addition. Exactly. In my mind, acquiring Neil and trading Filppula are two smart ideas, but they should both be carried out separately. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 Playing on Crosby's wing. He was on pace for 70 points. Crosby or not, those are great numbers. Regardless, the fact is that he CAN put up 40 points in a season, which is Filppula's relative ceiling on the Wings, i.e. no loss in production from this hypothetical. Not to mention, in 15 minutes a game, Armstrong is on pace for 20 goals on frickin Atlanta of all places. Personally I'd take the swap of a skilled 3rd line center for a grittier, 3rd line winger with a nose for the net. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Drake_Marcus 890 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 When you look at what Filppula could reasonably land, and what would be a smart return for him, Armstrong makes a ton of sense. Size? Armstrong is 6'2, 195 Youth? 26 Offense? 22 points, same as Flip, but 13 of those are goals, and hes put up 40 points before (in 47 games no less). Physicality? 60 hits so far this year, 85 hits in 72 games last year Contract? 1.2M, RFA this season. Allows the Wings to get their ducks in order before they figure out how much they can spend on their depth, and they can take him to arbitration. And I don't know what kind of shot he has, but he IS a right-handed shooter. So he could feasibly take over Samuelsson's role in every sense. Then the Wings could probably role a 3rd line of Armstrong - Helm - Cleary next season. Your break down does sell him to me pretty well! I hate to see Filppula go... but it'd have to be done for the greater good if we're going to keep Hossa. Remember- Hossa's side is really pushing for a deal and I'm willing to bet they'd be very favourable in their negotiations. We could probably get him for a hair under $6 million cap hit (5.8?) if it's a 10+ year deal like Zetterberg's. It's a tantalizing proposition... but it kills me inside to lose the Mule. I'm glad I don't make these types of decisions (even putting aside my lack of qualifications!). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Heroes of Hockeytown 694 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 (edited) He was on pace for 70 points. Crosby or not, those are great numbers. Regardless, the fact is that he CAN put up 40 points in a season, which is Filppula's relative ceiling on the Wings, i.e. no loss in production from this hypothetical. Not to mention, in 15 minutes a game, Armstrong is on pace for 20 goals on frickin Atlanta of all places. Personally I'd take the swap of a skilled 3rd line center for a grittier, 3rd line winger with a nose for the net. I was mostly nitpicking, but I don't think anyone should get an inflated sense of his scoring prowess. For what it's worth, I don't know what I feel about all this. Edited February 3, 2009 by Heroes of Hockeytown Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Drake_Marcus 890 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 He was on pace for 70 points. Crosby or not, those are great numbers. Regardless, the fact is that he CAN put up 40 points in a season, which is Filppula's relative ceiling on the Wings, i.e. no loss in production from this hypothetical. Not to mention, in 15 minutes a game, Armstrong is on pace for 20 goals on frickin Atlanta of all places. Personally I'd take the swap of a skilled 3rd line center for a grittier, 3rd line winger with a nose for the net. See the important point here is that Filppula lacks any finish (no pun intended) what-so-ever. We've got talented pivots in spades. Gritty players with the ability to actually knock the puck in the net when they're being set up by Datsyuk? We have two of those. And one is 36 while the other is possibly going to leave via free agency. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Blueliner 69 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 There are more nerves in your gut than in your head. I learned that from Colbert. You know what? You're right. What was I thinking? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Drake_Marcus 890 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 I was mostly nitpicking, but I don't think anyone should get an inflated sense of his scoring prowess. For what it's worth, I don't know what I feel about all this. Indeed those numbers were inflated by Crosby gift-wrapping the goals. His number of goals in Atlanta this season is the more telling stat. Plus he'd add to the impressive collection of ex-penguins on this team. I'm not necessarily advocating this type of trade, but I do see the argument for it. Too bad Malone is locked up for twice what he's worth. He's another gritty guy that can give you some goals on the third line. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AtomicPunk 296 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 Instead of a "grit / fight" player (which I know Neil is...I just don't see the need), we need someone to set up Zetterberg. Those top 2 lines would be LETHAL. That is where a "playmaking center" would be a good thing! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 I was mostly nitpicking, but I don't think anyone should get an inflated sense of his scoring prowess. For what it's worth, I don't know what I feel about all this. I'm not sure how I'm giving off an "inflated" sense of his offensive capabilities. Like I said, for the 3rd time, hes a guy that can put up 40 points. Not in 50 games, but in 80. Keep in mind it was Filppula's 19G, 36 point campaign that was on his side in contract negotiations, and that kind of production was lauded by fans and the Brass alike. Any time you can get 15-20 goals from someone on your 3rd line, you're a step ahead of the game. Ideally, if you're swapping Filppula for a forward, it would make sense to look at two main aspects. The first obviously being the price difference - keep in mind that a big part of the reason the Wings would look to trade Filppula is to retain key players, or make cap space to play on the market if they lose their big guns. And the second is Filppula's value to the Wings in general, contract aside. Realistically, the Wings have plenty of two-way centers who play a skilled game. So in trading Filppula, it would make sense to hunt for a cheaper, more dynamic player that would add balance to the Wings roster. Namely, grit and tertiary goal scoring - something you don't get with Flip. A guy like Armstrong in Atlanta, or MacCarthur in Buffalo fit the bill pretty well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 Instead of a "grit / fight" player (which I know Neil is...I just don't see the need), we need someone to set up Zetterberg. Those top 2 lines would be LETHAL. That is where a "playmaking center" would be a good thing! I agree the Wings need someone to feed Hank, instead of the other way around, but the cost to get it would be too high at the deadline, and likely in the off-season too. The only name I can think of in terms of playmaking that would be a good fit in the off-season would be Tanguay, who could operate as a playmaking winger. But ideally, the Wings have a capable 2nd line playmaking winger in Hudler, Babcock just needs to get over the fact that he was wrong about Hudler not being able to make it in this league and give him his due. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Drake_Marcus 890 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 Look for someone in LA. They love drafting, developing and dumping future all stars. Plus Q just showed them that Detroit's trash is their treasure! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Heaton 1 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 Losing Filppula for nothing? If we're trading Filppula we better be getting something back. 24 year old two-way centers who have room to grow offensively and can already be in the top 4 rotation on a teams PK aren't available all the time. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Blueliner 69 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 Filppula would be a top two line player on pretty much any other team in the NHL. This team just has so many good players. Just think that Helm, Leino, Abdelkader, Ericsson, Howard, Kindl, and possibly Larsson could all be on NHL rosters right now if they weren't apart of this organization. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Heroes of Hockeytown 694 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 I'm not sure how I'm giving off an "inflated" sense of his offensive capabilities. I was clarifying the intent of my original post (he played on Crosby's wing), which you clarified for me, so we're all square. I've read what everyone's got to say about trading Flip, and I realize that there are some pro's to this consideration. Flip is essentially forever buried under Hank and Pavel on depth chart, and that he brings an element we have in spades already, plus cap relief. There's merit to the trade talk. Still, I can't shake the feeling that we ought to hang onto this guy. His potential still intrigues me. Pavel definitely has better offensive talent than Flip, but at least examining their early careers their in the same boat -- if only they'd shoot more they'd be a helluva threat. I don't know, maybe, maybe not. I'm quite torn and confused and unsure on this matter. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
soultrain 43 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 yes. say goodbye flips! i wanna see punches on faces! then draps can retire then malts and were cool! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BeeRYCE 2 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 Oooo- or maybe that horribly ugly tyler kennedy kid. God damn he's ugly. Like Sandra Oh ugly. Yeah, he looks like he's from Whoville. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
clutchngrab 12 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 Whoever can be traded to make room for Hossa, should be traded to make room for Hossa. That would be Rafalski Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
clutchngrab 12 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 I agree the Wings need someone to feed Hank, instead of the other way around, but the cost to get it would be too high at the deadline, and likely in the off-season too. The only name I can think of in terms of playmaking that would be a good fit in the off-season would be Tanguay, who could operate as a playmaking winger. But ideally, the Wings have a capable 2nd line playmaking winger in Hudler, Babcock just needs to get over the fact that he was wrong about Hudler not being able to make it in this league and give him his due. Tanguay and tonic LOL Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2probert4 8 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 But Helm does. If you trade Filppula, then Helm probably comes up full time and Neil replaces Maltby or Kopecky on the 4th, since we'd have the cap space to scratch guys at ease. Ideally, though, if we're trading Filppula for a forward, a guy like Colby Armstong makes a lot of sense. I have no idea why you would want Armstrong......Im sure Atlanta would pay you to take him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2probert4 8 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 Indeed those numbers were inflated by Crosby gift-wrapping the goals. His number of goals in Atlanta this season is the more telling stat. Plus he'd add to the impressive collection of ex-penguins on this team. I'm not necessarily advocating this type of trade, but I do see the argument for it. Too bad Malone is locked up for twice what he's worth. He's another gritty guy that can give you some goals on the third line. You people forget that the year after next, there have been many conversations concerning the cap going DOWN. It will depend on the revenue numbers this season. It is possible that this happens. Also, if Hossa was willing to take LESS money to be here, as people seem to think he will , why didn't he do it NOW ??? We have kids like Helm, Abdelkader and Ericsson ready to step in and play, and would be on most teams. I myself, don't plan on Hossa coming back, not if they keep the mule. Plus we need a goaltender...Not all of the blame goes on the goaltending but a good part of it does. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Secret 304 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 I would not make this trade in particular but I would definately be looking to trade Filpula and his $3M salary as he just hasn't been to impressive at all this entire season. Limited ice time on a 3rd line role could be a small factor IMO, Hudler seems to thrive in the same capacity. I think he should be showing more despite being on the 3rd line but so far he is not... at all. He should have taken my advice this past off season and got himself a Gold's Gym membership and a nice cycle of Decca Durabolin + Winstrol V... would have given him some added size, strength and maybe a bit of roid rage to fire up his game. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PROBIE4PREZ 58 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 Hate the idea Only b/c Fil has been in the system his whole pro career and all the time devoloping him would be a waste. I trust the redwing system and the product it produces so there's no doubt in my mind that next year and the years to follow he will be completely devoloped. 3 mill will be a bargain when he reaches he full potential. Add to that what he brings in the playoffs and hes a steal. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tommingthepuck96 1 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 (edited) Filppula would be a top two line player on pretty much any other team in the NHL. This team just has so many good players. Exactely. Iv'e heard commentators of other teams mention this numerous times. Give valtterri some consistent top 6 time, some cosistent power play time,. not just every couple games, but real consistent time .... add a touch of confidence some better linemates and he will be scoring 45-50 points in an 82 game season, i have no doubt in my mind. Combined the scoring ability with his solid two way hockey ability and 3 mil is well worth it.. Both babcock and holland sees his skill and potential. In no way is he a disappointment to the team. Edited February 3, 2009 by tommingthepuck96 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hockeytown_Ryan 122 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 That would be Rafalski Thats a dumb notion..... Flip for Niel Yes A Pick for Smith No.... A Bag of pucks or a Skate lace for Smith.........Maybe Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted February 3, 2009 Namely, grit and tertiary goal scoring - something you don't get with Flip. Nice. (and yes, I had to look it up. ) esteef Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
