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Gnredwing

Howard the rest of the way

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This whole "he sat for awhile" thing is a f***in bulls*** excuse. Save it. The man has played goalie, according to his smart ass remarks, his whole life. If he can't come off the bench and play well, that's his problem.

When he makes a nice save? It's "ZOMG OZZIE RULES-SEE! WE WERE RIGHT ABOUT HIM!"

When he flops? It's "well he can't play well without playing time!"

Pretty sure nobody talks about the good and always focuses on the bad.

Well guess what? The reality of it is, he had his chance earlier, with consistent playing time and sucked then. It comes down to having to make one of these two choices...

Actually he was playing pretty good (remember the Nashville game where he magically didn't get to play after?)

1) Try our best to mix in a goalie who hasn't earned a regular season start in two f***in years. While we're doing this, we'll be in 11th place.

Out of curiousity whats the difference between "wasting" starts now and "wasting" starts when we are in the playoffs?

2) Play the goalie who is giving us a chance to win every night.

Last time I checked neither are doing that.

Ozzie apologists need to get their goddamn priorities straight. You're clearly more of a fan of Osgood than the team, or you'd see this glaringly obvious fact in all it's light.

What are the "Osgood" apologists saying? That Howard sucks and Osgood should get a bunch of starts? That Osgood should be played perfectly evenly no matter what?

Ozzie blew the game tonight. You can't blame the defense for every single goal and at some point, your starter has to make some game changing saves in moments where it changes momentum-Ozzie does NOT do that, Howard does. I'm not a Howard fan, I'm just a fan of whoever the f*** plays better.

Really? Cause Detroit only scored two goals tonight and the first three were definitely not on Osgood. Everyone talks about how a big save could swing momentum (which he had a good share of tonight) but nobody gets on the offense for not scoring a big goal first to change the momentum. Hellooo?

I personally hope we've seen Osgood's last game in Detroit. I can't take his s*** anymore. He's never confident, he's always wobbly and looks like he's flailing his limbs hoping to God the puck hits him. He doesn't try to make the save anymore, he's not good enough. He just tries to flail and f***s up.

All bologna and you know it.

He's 37 years old. One day, he won't flick this magical switch in the playoffs (which sorry, only happened twice and in the big picture, that's a small sample size) and we need to cut him loose before he costs us more games. We can blame our D until we're blue in the face but it's quite the coincidence that our D is somehow always the reason Howard does well and always the reason Osgood doesn't.

Really? Cause last time I checked the D was the reason Howard has lost the past few games. Hmmm, that seems pretty consistent if you ask me.

But what do I know? I'm just an Osgood apologist who wants Osgood to play every game cause I just love him oh so much.

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Guest zackmorris   
Guest zackmorris
And Nick Lidstrom: "I don't think we helped Osgood out tonight at all."

Sports fans more than anyone else consistently confuse modesty with honesty.

Nick will never throw Ozzie under the bus.

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And Nick Lidstrom: "I don't think we helped Osgood out tonight at all."

While that is true, he also says that for Ozzie's benefit. For as cocky as he comes off sometimes, Ozzie needs more confidence stroking than most goalies. If Nick hung that loss on him, he'd be up in the rafters with homie in no time.

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Sports fans more than anyone else consistently confuse modesty with honesty.

Nick will never throw Ozzie under the bus.

Babcock hasn't had a problem doing it though, and he sure didn't tonight.

You're not even a good Osgood-hater, do you realize that? You make all these overzealous statements that have absolutely no basis in reality, you blatantly ignore other elements in the game and then all these hyperbolic declarations about Osgood never playing another game again. It's ridiculous. What are you trying to prove?

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Guest zackmorris   
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Pretty sure nobody talks about the good and always focuses on the bad.

I'm pretty sure you're not really hanging around Wings fans when he makes a good save. Check ANY jtv or ustream chat room.

Actually he was playing pretty good (remember the Nashville game where he magically didn't get to play after?)

You can't count one game as "playing consistently good" smart guy.

Out of curiousity whats the difference between "wasting" starts now and "wasting" starts when we are in the playoffs?

Because maybe Howard will start in the playoffs. He's certainly earned the chance.

Last time I checked neither are doing that.

Pardon me, but I don't give a f*** what you've checked, you're biased as hell towards Ozzie and an argumentative prick on the side. If you don't think a guy who is near top 5 in the whole league in goaltending isn't giving us a chance to win, stop watching, hockey isn't for you.

What are the "Osgood" apologists saying? That Howard sucks and Osgood should get a bunch of starts? That Osgood should be played perfectly evenly no matter what?

Yup

Really? Cause Detroit only scored two goals tonight and the first three were definitely not on Osgood. Everyone talks about how a big save could swing momentum (which he had a good share of tonight) but nobody gets on the offense for not scoring a big goal first to change the momentum. Hellooo?

2 of the first 4 were definitely Ozzie and it's arguable the tip would've hit a goalie who had been out of his crease a bit more. It only missed his shoulder by about 2 inches. We kept Ozzie in it and he just kept ******* up.

All bologna and you know it.

Shut up Doc, it's all true. We both know I'm right. He f***in flails a limb or two, and hopes it hits him. He plays like he's out in the goddamn street stopping rubber balls. He juts out his chest and doesn't react to shots anymore. Every save attempt is identical.

Really? Cause last time I checked the D was the reason Howard has lost the past few games. Hmmm, that seems pretty consistent if you ask me.

If you have to use the last few games as a reason Howard shouldn't be in there, f*** off. Take a few steps backward.

But what do I know? I'm just an Osgood apologist who wants Osgood to play every game cause I just love him oh so much.

Sarcasm overload = losing mans crutch.

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Guest zackmorris   
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Babcock hasn't had a problem doing it though, and he sure didn't tonight.

You're not even a good Osgood-hater, do you realize that? You make all these overzealous statements that have absolutely no basis in reality, you blatantly ignore other elements in the game and then all these hyperbolic declarations about Osgood never playing another game again. It's ridiculous. What are you trying to prove?

Yes, what am I trying to prove? Maybe instead of witch hunting for tihs mysterious ulterior motive, you should ponder the possibilities of me just uttering the truth.

It hurts being an Ozzie fan, I know. But I'm a fan of the wheel, not the name on the back.

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While that is true, he also says that for Ozzie's benefit. For as cocky as he comes off sometimes, Ozzie needs more confidence stroking than most goalies. If Nick hung that loss on him, he'd be up in the rafters with homie in no time.

Again, Babcock will rip into Osgood without flinching and he said more to defend Osgood than anything. I suppose that means nothing too? Again, I'm not saying Osgood played great, but he didn't lose this game for us by any means, and if you go back and watch those replays, there's a lot of good goals there that in Babcock's words "no goalie has a chance on" and a lot of terrible defensive breakdowns.

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Guest zackmorris

Nick isn't Babcock. That's it. That's all. Babcock isn't as easy on someone when they f*** up.

And you know what? Both serve their purpose. Sometimes Nick isn't truly honest when honesty would result in hurt feelings. But sometimes people need to hear when they're ******* up.

Edited by zackmorris

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I'm pretty sure you're not really hanging around Wings fans when he makes a good save. Check ANY jtv or ustream chat room.

That is normal for any goaltender for any team. It is called a "knee-jerk" reaction. I for one have not seen it once on here.

You can't count one game as "playing consistently good" smart guy.

Would you like me to list every game he played well? I mean it is as if you started watching in December.

Because maybe Howard will start in the playoffs. He's certainly earned the chance.

As of right now it doesn't matter because the team as a whole sucks so bad they can't win with either goaltender.

Pardon me, but I don't give a f*** what you've checked, you're biased as hell towards Ozzie and an argumentative prick on the side. If you don't think a guy who is near top 5 in the whole league in goaltending isn't giving us a chance to win, stop watching, hockey isn't for you.

Check the last few games and tell me that again. It isn't about the goaltending anymore.

Yup

Not once.

2 of the first 4 were definitely Ozzie and it's arguable the tip would've hit a goalie who had been out of his crease a bit more. It only missed his shoulder by about 2 inches. We kept Ozzie in it and he just kept ******* up.

The fourth I will give you but not the first three. Once again defensive coverage. It has been screwing Detroit for the past six games and has been unbiased to either goaltender. Howard moreso because he has been playing more than Ozzie.

Shut up Doc, it's all true. We both know I'm right. He f***in flails a limb or two, and hopes it hits him. He plays like he's out in the goddamn street stopping rubber balls. He juts out his chest and doesn't react to shots anymore. Every save attempt is identical.

Shut up? What are we in third grade? I'm not even talking, I'm typing.

If you have to use the last few games as a reason Howard shouldn't be in there, f*** off. Take a few steps backward.

I never talked about Howard not being in there, I'm talking about how goaltending is irrelevant at the current point in time because the team is losing with both. Goaltending has not been at fault for the past 5 games at least.

Sarcasm overload = losing mans crutch.

Only when the sarcasm is all that is being put onto the table. I bring my sarcasm WITH content.

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Guest DatsyukianDeke13   
Guest DatsyukianDeke13
That is normal for any goaltender for any team. It is called a "knee-jerk" reaction. I for one have not seen it once on here.

Would you like me to list every game he played well? I mean it is as if you started watching in December.

As of right now it doesn't matter because the team as a whole sucks so bad they can't win with either goaltender.

Check the last few games and tell me that again. It isn't about the goaltending anymore.

Not once.

The fourth I will give you but not the first three. Once again defensive coverage. It has been screwing Detroit for the past six games and has been unbiased to either goaltender. Howard moreso because he has been playing more than Ozzie.

Shut up? What are we in third grade? I'm not even talking, I'm typing.

I never talked about Howard not being in there, I'm talking about how goaltending is irrelevant at the current point in time because the team is losing with both. Goaltending has not been at fault for the past 5 games at least.

Only when the sarcasm is all that is being put onto the table. I bring my sarcasm WITH content.

Only one way to settle this dispute. DUEL.

Balls in your court Huckleberries

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Guest zackmorris   
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That is normal for any goaltender for any team. It is called a "knee-jerk" reaction. I for one have not seen it once on here.

Oh, ok, well any time anyone f***s up in life let's just call it a flip, knee jerk reaction. That seems to make it excusable.

No, fact remains, it's hypocritical. His good saves are amazing but his goals against are purely because he's rusty.

Doesn't make sense.

Would you like me to list every game he played well? I mean it is as if you started watching in December.

I mean early in the season in general. He played like s***. I know you're the local argue-holic but do you really want to start a pissing contest over something everyone knows?

As of right now it doesn't matter because the team as a whole sucks so bad they can't win with either goaltender.

Yeah, recently. What about before? Because recently isn't something that will continue in 'til April if you catch my drift.

Check the last few games and tell me that again. It isn't about the goaltending anymore.

You're confused. You're looking at the outcome, not the play of the goaltender. Howard makes huge stops that Ozzie would let in. 3 games doesn't erase the season he's had so far and he gives us a better chance to win.

Not once.

The fourth I will give you but not the first three. Once again defensive coverage. It has been screwing Detroit for the past six games and has been unbiased to either goaltender. Howard moreso because he has been playing more than Ozzie.

Defensive lapses are going to happen in every single hockey game ever played. Sorry, but your goalie needs to make a few of those saves. Again, that tipped shot would've been stopped by cutting off the angle a little more.

Shut up? What are we in third grade? I'm not even talking, I'm typing.

And avoiding the entire point after it? Must be that "content" you go on to speak so highly of :rolleyes:

I never talked about Howard not being in there, I'm talking about how goaltending is irrelevant at the current point in time because the team is losing with both. Goaltending has not been at fault for the past 5 games at least.

The goaltending is not irrelevant. It is if you just look at the box score. If Howard doesn't make a small handful of great saves per game on chances Ozzie would s*** himself over, we don't even get the 1 point we've gotten most of the time.

Edited by zackmorris

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Yes, what am I trying to prove? Maybe instead of witch hunting for tihs mysterious ulterior motive, you should ponder the possibilities of me just uttering the truth.

It hurts being an Ozzie fan, I know. But I'm a fan of the wheel, not the name on the back.

Truth? In who's twisted reality?

Again, no one's saying Osgood played great, but you're wanting to string him up for tonight when last night Howard let in 5 goals in a game where he didn't face near as many quality chances, defensive breakdowns or odd-man rushes. But he had to deal with a team that fell apart in the last five minutes while Osgood had to deal with a team that floundered the entire game, still in shambles from last nights disaster.

As a fan of the wheel, I'm not going to get hung up on any one guy if they don't deserve it. Neither Howard or Osgood deserve it right now, but jokers like you like to throw lines out there about names on jersey's to support why some guy sucks, but you're the one singling out ONE GUY when there's an entire team out there ******* up on a grand level.

So sure, it makes a whole lot of sense to single out the goalie again and again despite the fact that the defense has been terrible and half the time we struggle to score more than 1-2 goals. SURE!!!

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Guest zackmorris   
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Truth? In who's twisted reality?

Again, no one's saying Osgood played great, but you're wanting to string him up for tonight when last night Howard let in 5 goals in a game where he didn't face near as many quality chances, defensive breakdowns or odd-man rushes.

I don't care about the numbers as much as some people. It's the fact that Ozzie's f*** ups look a hell of alot worse than Howard's. Howard can let in 5 and I still feel more confident with him in there. Ozzie looks at any moment like he may give up an easy whiffer backbreaking goal.

As a fan of the wheel, I'm not going to get hung up on any one guy if they don't deserve it. Neither Howard or Osgood deserve it right now, but jokers like you like to throw lines out there about names on jersey's to support why some guy sucks, but you're the one singling out ONE GUY when there's an entire team out there ******* up on a grand level.

The team didn't play well tonight but I'm looking at Osgood on the whole-all season. What the f*** has he done to earn anything from anyone? Tonight was another joke, and sorry but he looked like he was going to f*** up and let in 3 more that luckily hit him.

So sure, it makes a whole lot of sense to single out the goalie again and again despite the fact that the defense has been terrible and half the time we struggle to score more than 1-2 goals. SURE!!!

This is a thread about our goaltending. I'm talking about our goalie. Who can't make a huge save to save his life. But we don't really expect that, do we? I see Howard doing it. But we don't think about it when he does, more specifically, we don't think about what might have been if he didn't. He does that quite a bit. We're just too happy to think about it. Ozzie doesn't do that-he doesn't make big saves anymore.

This is mroe about what I see with my eyes and ultimately I almost always end up right about these things in the end, because I don't let bias into my thoughts on a player-Ozzie is shaky in the net and looks like he doesn't have the quickness to react to a shot anymore. Howard does.

This happens on every sports forum. Every player has a fan base of a certain size who will defend him to the death in spite of any bad performance. It's always everyone elses fault. Even when that player is sent f***in packing.

Edited by zackmorris

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Again, Babcock will rip into Osgood without flinching and he said more to defend Osgood than anything. I suppose that means nothing too? Again, I'm not saying Osgood played great, but he didn't lose this game for us by any means, and if you go back and watch those replays, there's a lot of good goals there that in Babcock's words "no goalie has a chance on" and a lot of terrible defensive breakdowns.

I'm not hanging the loss on Ozzie nor am I looking to string him up, then team skated like s*** and no goalie would have bailed them out of this one. Without a doubt they had a ton of defensive zone lapses and gave up way too many power plays. The rest of the team's play notwithstanding, Ozzie looked bad too. I wouldn't rule out that it could have something to do his lack of starts, but that wouldn't change the fact that he was on his knees early all night and his lateral movement was awful. Yes Howard has lost recently too, but he looks more confident and fundamentally sound. Ozzie has given the team nothing to rally around all year, Howard has. This team needs something and someone to rally around and Howard, if anybody, has been that guy. If Dats and Z were carrying more of the load I'd say the spark in goal would be less important but that's not the case.

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Oh, ok, well any time anyone f***s up in life let's just call it a flip, knee jerk reaction. That seems to make it excusable.

No, fact remains, it's hypocritical. His good saves are amazing but his goals against are purely because he's rusty.

Doesn't make sense.

Because nobody says that with other goaltenders. Nobody rips on Howard for doing badly or praises him immensly for doing well.

That NEEEVERRR happens.

I mean early in the season in general. He played like s***. I know you're the local argue-holic but do you really want to start a pissing contest over something everyone knows?

You have it backwards. Osgood played well early in the season while Howard did not.

Yeah, recently. What about before? Because recently isn't something that will continue in 'til April if you catch my drift.

Well since you are talking about having Howard continue to start NOW I would assume that NOW would be more important. Right NOW the Wings are playing terribly and the goaltenders are caught between the pipes as the rest of the team collapses around them.

You're confused. You're looking at the outcome, not the play of the goaltender. Howard makes huge stops that Ozzie would let in. 3 games doesn't erase the season he's had so far and he gives us a better chance to win.

3 games? Have you seen the last six games? Do you think this is just some short phase they are going to get over?

RIGHT NOW they are playing bad so RIGHT NOW it makes almost no difference who they put in net. Put Howard in and see if the defense does any better. If not then put Osgood in.

Defensive lapses are going to happen in every single hockey game ever played. Sorry, but your goalie needs to make a few of those saves. Again, that tipped shot would've been stopped by cutting off the angle a little more.

First time I've seen a redirected shot blamed on the goaltender. Congrats.

Did Osgood not stop any odd man rushses?

And avoiding the entire point after it? Must be that "content" you go on to speak so highly of :rolleyes:

All you did was list assertions. I can do that to but it won't go anywhere for us to just continue doing that now will it?

I could go on an on about how Howard couldn't keep a rebound in if his life depended on it but that (like a large amount of your opinions of Osgood) is a gross exaggeration of the facts.

The goaltending is not irrelevant. It is if you just look at the box score. If Howard doesn't make a small handful of great saves per game on chances Ozzie would s*** himself over, we don't even get the 1 point we've gotten most of the time.

I'm sure we don't. Don't mind the fact Howard let in five goals against the Coyotes. Or is it only relevant on certain occasions?

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Guest DatsyukianDeke13   
Guest DatsyukianDeke13

So neither Doc Holliday or Zak Morris will accept the invitation to the winner take all duel, eh? Your no daisies at all.

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Guest zackmorris   
Guest zackmorris
Because nobody says that with other goaltenders. Nobody rips on Howard for doing badly or praises him immensly for doing well.

That NEEEVERRR happens.

If you think it's the same with other goalies, namely Howard, you're high. Ozzie has a cemented, die-hard fanbase here.

You have it backwards. Osgood played well early in the season while Howard did not.

Yeah? Show me the consistent period where Osgood did anything worth noting.

Well since you are talking about having Howard continue to start NOW I would assume that NOW would be more important. Right NOW the Wings are playing terribly and the goaltenders are caught between the pipes as the rest of the team collapses around them.

Like I said before, Howard's goals against look a hell of alot better than Osgood's. Teams actually have to earn goals on him, rather than just passing a little because Ozzie either will go down too early or has the lateral movement of a crippled JS Giguere

3 games? Have you seen the last six games? Do you think this is just some short phase they are going to get over?

Yes. Such is sports.

RIGHT NOW they are playing bad so RIGHT NOW it makes almost no difference who they put in net. Put Howard in and see if the defense does any better. If not then put Osgood in.

This is so foolish. There can still be a goalie who gives us a better chance to win regardless of the outcome in the past. Howard is more confident in the net and plays better. This is so obvious I can't believe you don't see it.

First time I've seen a redirected shot blamed on the goaltender. Congrats.

Thank you, thank you, I only call it exactly how it is. Move out a little and it hits him in the upper body and we don't spend more than 4 seconds thinking about it.

Did Osgood not stop any odd man rushses?

He also didn't stop much else. Point is there were a few instances where he could've made a big save and kept us in it. He didn't. He hasn't before very much either. That's the problem.

All you did was list assertions. I can do that to but it won't go anywhere for us to just continue doing that now will it?

Nice excuse. Dodge a little more buddy.

I could go on an on about how Howard couldn't keep a rebound in if his life depended on it but that (like a large amount of your opinions of Osgood) is a gross exaggeration of the facts.

No, I'm brutally honest. You just don't like it, so you're going to call my opinions exaggerated because you're argumentative. You're not exactly pointing out which ones, either. His save attempts are pitiful, as he just sticks his chest out while getting into a quick butterfly stance, he's not really reacting to shots like he used to.

http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/index.ph...d=1874936

I'm sure we don't. Don't mind the fact Howard let in five goals against the Coyotes. Or is it only relevant on certain occasions?

Like I said before, Howard can let in 5 and still look better. He's nto just flailing at the shot hoping it hits him.

Edited by zackmorris

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