Valtteri Filppula watch thread

[Motown4013 350]

You obviously aren't watching the games.

I am...and Franzen has looked slow and disengaged in every area of his game. Despite the two assists he got last night,he has been brutal. Watch the guy on Wednesday because all I see is a ton of lollygagging and zero physicality! I dont tend to rag on players but he has been the most disappointing over the last 10 games. At least hit somebody with that big body....

[Mabuhay Red Wings 177]

I am...and Franzen has looked slow and disengaged in every area of his game. Despite the two assists he got last night,he has been brutal. Watch the guy on Wednesday because all I see is a ton of lollygagging and zero physicality! I dont tend to rag on players but he has been the most disappointing over the last 10 games. At least hit somebody with that big body....

Whenever I see someone on here talk about the players not hitting enough or not hitting strongly enough or whatever, I always think of this one interview with Jimmy Nill where he mentioned (and if anybody has the exact quote it'd be great) that when they tell the players to be physical, they mean play tough on the puck. Not necessarily hit a guy to do it. but just do whatever to get the puck and hold on to it.

Of course, it doesn't mean Franzen isn't partially responsible as most of the time he's usually a wuss when it comes to initiating physical play himself, despite his hits numbers this season.

[Guest stinky fish taco]

You're an idiot.

If Filppula was ever given a legit chance in the top six with competent teammates (read: not Bertuzzi and Franzen) for an entire season, he would break 70, guaranteed.

whatever you say.

keep waiting for that 'potential' to show up

[thedisappearer 291]

I'm pretty sure Franzen having 1 goal in his past 18 games is a pretty good measure that he is incompetent.

I see your slump-mentioning and raise you a HE HAS A CONTRACT TO PLAY IN THIS LEAGUE FOR A LONG DAMN TIME. Seems competent now, unless you provide more evidence.

Look, if you want to argue how good he is, fine. But you brought competence into this. He can, and does, lace them up and play for an NHL team. That's competence.

Also, can I cherry pick data? If so, there's a playoff series against Colorado I would like to rub your nose in.

[dragonballgtz 273]

So what do you have to say about all the stretches of games where he DID score at/around a 70 point pace? The 15 points in 16 games he just had. 6 points in 7 games to start the season. 7 points in 7 games of the first round of the playoffs last year. 16 points in 20 games/28 points in 30 games last season after his injury? And the bulk of that was playing with third/fourth liners (and even on the third line himself), by the way.

If you want to argue that he isn't capable of sustaining the pace over an entire season, fine. But saying that when he is playing well, that he is just a third line player is just ridiculous, and counts out your entire opinion.

Your last sentience confuses me a little bit. So you are saying that people have an argument when it comes to his ability to sustain such a 2nd line+ point production. But when he is playing good or on a hot streak it is wrong for people to call him out for being what he is a great 3rd liner decent 2nd liner?

I am honestly not sure what your last sentience is suppose to mean or what you meant by it. I'm not trying to get you angry but if you can clarify what you mean that would be excellent.

[Doc Holliday 1,888]

I am...and Franzen has looked slow and disengaged in every area of his game. Despite the two assists he got last night,he has been brutal. Watch the guy on Wednesday because all I see is a ton of lollygagging and zero physicality! I dont tend to rag on players but he has been the most disappointing over the last 10 games. At least hit somebody with that big body....

Really?

He backchecks. He tries to make plays in the offensive zone (and has done such at a reasonable level). My big issue is he is deferring it too much. He isn't trying to make plays himself. He wants to give it to someone else to score (such as Datsyuk's OT winner against Edmonton). He needs to be confident in his ability to drive the net, shoot, and score. Other than that I think the effort has been there.

[thedisappearer 291]

Really?

He backchecks. He tries to make plays in the offensive zone (and has done such at a reasonable level). My big issue is he is deferring it too much. He isn't trying to make plays himself. He wants to give it to someone else to score (such as Datsyuk's OT winner against Edmonton). He needs to be confident in his ability to drive the net, shoot, and score. Other than that I think the effort has been there.

This.

[Z and D for the C 712]

f so, there's a playoff series against Colorado I would like to rub your nose in.

Rub my nose in? It's not like I have a personal vendetta against him. Besides, we're not trying to win the Colorado series again. Everyone knows Franzen is a great goal scorer, I'm not saying he has sucked his whole career, I'm just saying he's been pretty bad overall this year, except for a few standout games.

I simply see no effort out of him and Bertuzzi. They just float around in the offensive zone. Can anyone remember the last time Bertuzzi won a battle for the puck along the boards? Seriously, point it out to me.

Edited March 14, 2011 by Z and D for the C

[thedisappearer 291]

Rub my nose in? It's not like I have a personal vendetta against him. Besides, we're not trying to win the Colorado series again. Everyone knows Franzen is a great goal scorer, I'm not saying he has sucked his whole career, I'm just saying he's been pretty bad overall this year, except for a few standout games.

I simply see no effort out of him and Bertuzzi. They just float around in the offensive zone. Can anyone remember the last time Bertuzzi won a battle for the puck along the boards? Seriously, point it out to me.

You said he was not a competent teammate. That's a slam, dude. That's not being nice and jovial. That's attacking the guy.

It seems you have an issue with his on-ice play. Do you realize you attacked his locker room character as well?

[Z and D for the C 712]

Your last sentience confuses me a little bit. So you are saying that people have an argument when it comes to his ability to sustain such a 2nd line+ point production. But when he is playing good or on a hot streak it is wrong for people to call him out for being what he is a great 3rd liner decent 2nd liner?

I am honestly not sure what your last sentience is suppose to mean or what you meant by it. I'm not trying to get you angry but if you can clarify what you mean that would be excellent.

Filppula has the potential and the talent to play on the first line and put up a 70 point pace, maybe more. I find that undeniable. I don't see an argument there. The proof is there, just watch the games. The only argument that anyone can make is that he isn't consistent. The only argument anyone can make is that while he may be able to play like a star for a stretch of games, he will disappear for another stretch of games.

I would disagree, but it's a legit argument. Sure, he has his off games like anyone else, but generally I find him one of the most consistent players, game in game out. He goes stretches without any point, but I think it's because of other reasons than Filppula's consistency. For example the past 11 games he was injured and demoted to less playing time with third liners. It's not like he was playing with the same teammates for the past 11 games.

You said he was not a competent teammate. That's a slam, dude. That's not being nice and jovial. That's attacking the guy.

It seems you have an issue with his on-ice play. Do you realize you attacked his locker room character as well?

His on-ice plays has been at the level of incompetent.

[thedisappearer 291]

His on-ice plays has been at the level of incompetent.

Our leading goal scorer is incompetent on the ice. Got it.

Carry on.

[dragonballgtz 273]

Filppula has the potential and the talent to play on the first line and put up a 70 point pace, maybe more. I find that undeniable. I don't see an argument there. The proof is there, just watch the games. The only argument that anyone can make is that he isn't consistent. The only argument anyone can make is that while he may be able to play like a star for a stretch of games, he will disappear for another stretch of games.

I would disagree, but it's a legit argument. Sure, he has his off games like anyone else, but generally I find him one of the most consistent players, game in game out. He goes stretches without any point, but I think it's because of other reasons than Filppula's consistency. For example the past 11 games he was injured and demoted to less playing time with third liners. It's not like he was playing with the same teammates for the past 11 games.

Four of those games according to NHL.com he played at least 18+ minutes, one 17 minute game, 2 16 minutes, 3 15 minute games, and 1 10 minute game. Interesting thing though is that within the last 5 games is when all those 18+ minute games have taken place so ice time is not an issue. Line mates like you said could be it.

That bold part is why people think of him as an average 2nd liner great 3rd liner. He does not have the ability to bring it every game and produce even with the "wrong" line mates. I know he is no superstar like Datssyuk but players like that, even a tier below, can produce and make things happen even with bad line mates. Flip just isn't at that point in his career IMO.

Skilled, yes.

Can he compliment/complete a line, yes.

Is he consistent enough and good enough to make his line mates better around him, no.

Until he can do that he will be an average 2nd liner at best.

[Z and D for the C 712]

I know he is no superstar like Datssyuk but players like that, even a tier below, can produce and make things happen even with bad line mates. Flip just isn't at that point in his career IMO.

I won't disagree, but you don't have to make bad teammates great to score 70 points.

[dragonballgtz 273]

I won't disagree, but you don't have to make bad teammates great to score 70 points.

You don't have to make them great but you have to make them good enough for you to score 70 points.

[Mikeal 60]

I won't disagree, but you don't have to make bad teammates great to score 70 points.

He seems like he doesn't believe in himself this year. Less of those flashes we have seen in the past to make us believe he could break out. You can't make your line mates better if you don't believe.

[dirtydangles 1,328]

not another fil debate. not everyone can be zetterberg or datsyuk. fil brings things to this team, and I think he is a valuable player. so is franzen. it would be an understatement to say that they are different players. bottom line is he is going through a bit of a dry spell, i don't see him going anywhere else in the near future.

[hooon 1,089]

His on-ice plays has been at the level of incompetent.

[gcom007 1,465]

So much good stuff in here...

Flip's a good player, but he's streaky. Always has been, probably always will be. If people would get over the idea of him being more than a descent 40 point scorer (and if he made less money...), there'd be no point in calling him out at all. He's a great defensive forward and I'd be fine with keeping him in the fold when this contract is complete for around $2 million.

But, again, he's streaky. This is absolutely nothing new. He had a hot streak. Now he's on one of his patented cold streaks.

It's the same thing every year.

Just like his fan club trying to suggest that there's more evidence to support the idea of him being a 70 point 1st liner than there is of him being a streaky, 40 point 2nd-3rd liner...

[miksteri 55]

Flip steps up in the playoffs, so Wings should keep him.

[HankthaTank 1,100]

If Filppula was ever given a legit chance in the top six with competent teammates (read: not Bertuzzi and Franzen) for an entire season, he would break 70, guaranteed.

Yet Hank posted his biggest amount of points during the time he was on the line with these 2 floater mcgees. Interesting logic here. I also think people need to back off Flipper, whipping boys are all the rage here I understand but this guy is not someone to look at. On a sidenote it would appear we probably should have traded Huds when he was on the line with Clears and Pav. He is gone again

[uk_redwing 495]

Call up his brother.

[Finnish Wing 110]

Wait. Is that Dan Carcillo?

Call up his brother.

”I don't see him playing permanently for the Detroit Red Wings”, says GM of the organization Ken Holland in an interview with Urheilulehti (10/2011). Edited March 14, 2011 by Finnish Wing

[eva unit zero 271]

So what do you have to say about all the stretches of games where he DID score at/around a 70 point pace? The 15 points in 16 games he just had. 6 points in 7 games to start the season. 7 points in 7 games of the first round of the playoffs last year. 16 points in 20 games/28 points in 30 games last season after his injury? And the bulk of that was playing with third/fourth liners (and even on the third line himself), by the way.

If you want to argue that he isn't capable of sustaining the pace over an entire season, fine. But saying that when he is playing well, that he is just a third line player is just ridiculous, and counts out your entire opinion.

Filppula is a decent offensive player who needs to be playing with players as good or better than himself to have any kind of performance offensively. This has been shown again and again. If Filppula is put in a role where he has to carry the line offensively, he doesn't produce.

Filppula has the potential and the talent to play on the first line and put up a 70 point pace, maybe more. I find that undeniable. I don't see an argument there. The proof is there, just watch the games. The only argument that anyone can make is that he isn't consistent. The only argument anyone can make is that while he may be able to play like a star for a stretch of games, he will disappear for another stretch of games.

I would disagree, but it's a legit argument. Sure, he has his off games like anyone else, but generally I find him one of the most consistent players, game in game out. He goes stretches without any point, but I think it's because of other reasons than Filppula's consistency. For example the past 11 games he was injured and demoted to less playing time with third liners. It's not like he was playing with the same teammates for the past 11 games.

Filppula has been getting second line ice time all season, and his average per-game is 5th on the team in ES ice time (about 14 minutes, Hank and Dats play 15 1/2) and 4th in overall (almost 17 minutes, Hank and Dats play 19 1/2). If that's "less" ice time, what would you say he should be playing? On par with two of the top five forwards in the world? Sorry, he will never, EVER be that good.

Filppula is turning out as a very good defensive center with offensive capability, and his offensive capability may be topping out. He's not a Hudler, who can get hot for a long stretch and play 100+ point hockey, but he's not Dougie Brown either.

Inconceiveable!!

Edited March 14, 2011 by eva unit zero

[mmamolo 287]

He's not a Hudler, who can get hot for a long stretch and play 100+ point hockey, but he's not Dougie Brown either.

Here comes a barrage of pretzels...

[HankthaTank 1,100]

He's not a Hudler, who can get hot for a long stretch and play 100+ point hockey

You are, if anything, consistently on Hudler's nutsack. Funny stuff.