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X13WINGS13X

Traverse City Tournament

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Guest Heaten   
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Though playing well in Juniors is usually a better sign than not playing well.

There have been a few posters on this board who would love to see a team of goons iced by the Wings, but they are not here anymore - go chase them down if that is the argument you are looking for.

The rest of us believe it is beneficial to have a few players on the team willing and able to give a beatdown when smaller players are being run. That's it.

Why would someone need to chase any anyone for a hockey discussions? That makes no sense.

I'm just praising the Red Wings organization for building playoff teams each and every year. Holland realizes the team doesn't need fighters to win. In fact, the Red Wings enforcer is typically the power play. I endorse their philosophy because it works. For example, the guy who say Smith can fight... well good. But when he's on the top 4, we need him to quarter back the power play, not sitting in the box. I prefer winning games, not beating the s*** out of other players.

Red Wings, as is, is tough enough with fighters. Bertuzzi, Abby, Ericsson... they don't need to fight 3 times per game, but 1 or 3 times per year *if* needed. Wings don't need to fight to fight, they need to win games and go to the SCFs and try to win cups.

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Callahan may never play an NHL game with the Detroit Red Wings. Smith will be the type of player you want on the ice to help win games and score goals instead of sitting in the penalty box...

Fighting is overrated.

Yeah Brendan Smith may never play and NHL game either. Fact of the matter is the wings brass has stated they think Callahan is likely an NHL player and has at least a good skillset to make it on the 4th line someday.

Callahan is much more likely to make the NHL than Pulkkinen but I bet you wouldnt agree

And just curious, if the wings dont think they need to toughen up a bit, why would they take the player (Callahan) who was one fight away from setting the WHL record for most fights by a rookie instead of going for some homerun late round skilled pick?

Edited by newfy

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Guest Heaten   
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Yeah Brendan Smith may never play and NHL game either. Fact of the matter is the wings brass has stated they think Callahan is likely an NHL player and has at least a good skillset to make it on the 4th line someday.

Callahan is much more likely to make the NHL than Pulkkinen but I bet you wouldnt agree

And just curious, if the wings dont think they need to toughen up a bit, why would they take the player (Callahan) who was one fight away from setting the WHL record for most fights by a rookie instead of going for some homerun late round skilled pick?

If Smith doesn't make the NHL then someone needs to be fired.

Pulkkinen (who you claim is less likely to make the NHL over Callahan) was drafted 4th overall, while Callahan was drafted 6th overall. I guess Red Wings scouting team have their priorities in place and see things slightly different than you do. It doesn't matter what I think, the pro scouts understand things better than both of us.

Callahan was a 6th overall pick, when you get that far down, its a flip of the coin and calculated luck/hope.

By the way, wasn't Callahan a healthy scratch just a couple days ago? Mhmmmmmmmmm.....

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Pulkkinen (who you claim is less likely to make the NHL over Callahan) was drafted 4th overall, while Callahan was drafted 6th overall. I guess Red Wings scouting team have their priorities in place and see things slightly different than you do. It doesn't matter what I think, the pro scouts understand things better than both of us.

Callahan was a 6th overall pick, when you get that far down, its a flip of the coin and calculated luck/hope.

By the way, wasn't Callahan a healthy scratch just a couple days ago? Mhmmmmmmmmm.....

Detroit must have done some incredibly impressive trades to maintain the roster they have now whilst also obtaining the number 4 and number 6 overall pick. That must have been some draft. Three first round picks! :hehe:

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If Smith doesn't make the NHL then someone needs to be fired.

Pulkkinen (who you claim is less likely to make the NHL over Callahan) was drafted 4th overall, while Callahan was drafted 6th overall. I guess Red Wings scouting team have their priorities in place and see things slightly different than you do. It doesn't matter what I think, the pro scouts understand things better than both of us.

Callahan was a 6th overall pick, when you get that far down, its a flip of the coin and calculated luck/hope.

By the way, wasn't Callahan a healthy scratch just a couple days ago? Mhmmmmmmmmm.....

Yeah they know what Callahan can do and have even said he very likely an NHLer, they have to see all the guys they can in this Prospects tourny so they drafted what is probably their second or third most well known commodity in the tournament in favour of some others.

This healthy scratch also managed to be third on the team in scoring while playing one less game than the guys ahead of him. And the game he didnt play in was their highest scoring affair.

Callahan is almost as close as it gets to an NHLer, just because of the plain old fact he can fight. If Pulkkinens skating doesnt improve or he cant adjust to NA, he will bust.

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Yeah they know what Callahan can do and have even said he very likely an NHLer, they have to see all the guys they can in this Prospects tourny so they drafted what is probably their second or third most well known commodity in the tournament in favour of some others.

This healthy scratch also managed to be third on the team in scoring while playing one less game than the guys ahead of him. And the game he didnt play in was their highest scoring affair.

Callahan is almost as close as it gets to an NHLer, just because of the plain old fact he can fight. If Pulkkinens skating doesnt improve or he cant adjust to NA, he will bust.

If I got a nickel every time someone says "_________ prospect will likely be an NHLer", I'd have enough cash to go buy a house. Who knows, Callahan might become an NHLer someday, I just question if he'll ever play for the Red Wings.

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If I got a nickel every time someone says "_________ prospect will likely be an NHLer", I'd have enough cash to go buy a house. Who knows, Callahan might become an NHLer someday, I just question if he'll ever play for the Red Wings.

Since last year you (smartly) wouldn't bet a Abby/Ritola shirt with me based on which would score more, how about we make the same (with a player of your choosing) bet that Callahan will play at least one game for the Red Wings in the next five years?

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Since last year you (smartly) wouldn't bet a Abby/Ritola shirt with me based on which would score more, how about we make the same (with a player of your choosing) bet that Callahan will play at least one game for the Red Wings in the next five years?

Smartly? Nobody could have predicted all of Ritola's misfortunes. The kid was a damn good hockey player and would have EASILY scored more goals than Abby had he not went deaf and had other unfortunate health issues.

Stop chest pounding, you can only claim victory to some stupid debate we had over a year ago because of a player's unforeseen health misfortune. Anyone could have lost on the Igor Grigorenko bet too, because it could never have been thought he would be in a horrible car accident that cost him his NHL future.

Have fun rejoicing.

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Smartly? Nobody could have predicted all of Ritola's misfortunes. The kid was a damn good hockey player and would have EASILY scored more goals than Abby had he not went deaf and had other unfortunate health issues.

Stop chest pounding, you can only claim victory to some stupid debate we had over a year ago because of a player's unforeseen health misfortune. Anyone could have lost on the Igor Grigorenko bet too, because it could never have been thought he would be in a horrible car accident that cost him his NHL future.

Have fun rejoicing.

Could have is all you can say though. In ppg they were close, but Ritola was also sent to the AHL during his playing time (which doesnt support your claim to his superiority). I felt as bad as anyone about Ritola's condition, but that doesn't lessen the bet. How about the new one? If you're so confident, let's make this bet for real.

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Could have is all you can say though. In ppg they were close, but Ritola was also sent to the AHL during his playing time (which doesnt support your claim to his superiority). I felt as bad as anyone about Ritola's condition, but that doesn't lessen the bet. How about the new one? If you're so confident, let's make this bet for real.

Yes, "Could have" is all I can say because I lost a debate to a technicality. Fact is, nobody will ever know because Ritola's hockey career is pretty much over due to being deaf in one ear and slowly losing his hearing in the other. I feel bad for the kid because he's been nothing but a trooper.

As for Callahan, I don't really care. Making a bet in what happens in the next 5 years is pretty stupid, especially given the chance something bad happens like it did Ritola. If you want to make a "I told you so" bet, lets do it. If I win I'll never track you down to tell you "I told you so" because I'll forget and be happy Red Wings drafted an NHLer, but I think his chances are slim to none at this point.

Babcock was praising lots of players at this tourney and I didn't read any praise from him about Callahan. Not sure why or if it means anything. But I do know Callahan was a healthy scratch a few games ago. Again, not sure why. My guess would be he's a career AHLer or used in a trade in some kind of a package deal.

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Why would someone need to chase any anyone for a hockey discussions? That makes no sense.

I'm just praising the Red Wings organization for building playoff teams each and every year. Holland realizes the team doesn't need fighters to win. In fact, the Red Wings enforcer is typically the power play. I endorse their philosophy because it works. For example, the guy who say Smith can fight... well good. But when he's on the top 4, we need him to quarter back the power play, not sitting in the box. I prefer winning games, not beating the s*** out of other players.

Red Wings, as is, is tough enough with fighters. Bertuzzi, Abby, Ericsson... they don't need to fight 3 times per game, but 1 or 3 times per year *if* needed. Wings don't need to fight to fight, they need to win games and go to the SCFs and try to win cups.

Nice backtracking... Your earlier posts were so full of hyperbole I could do nothing but laugh. No one here is pushing for a bunch of goons like you were adamantly arguing against.

1-3 fights for a team in the NHL is embarrassing- easily the lowest in the history of the NHL.

In 2008 the Wings had 21 fighting majors and 13 last year.

Your opinions are pretty ridiculous and ignore the nature of the NHL and hockey.

Edited by egroen

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Yes, "Could have" is all I can say because I lost a debate to a technicality. Fact is, nobody will ever know because Ritola's hockey career is pretty much over due to being deaf in one ear and slowly losing his hearing in the other. I feel bad for the kid because he's been nothing but a trooper.

As for Callahan, I don't really care. Making a bet in what happens in the next 5 years is pretty stupid, especially given the chance something bad happens like it did Ritola. If you want to make a "I told you so" bet, lets do it. If I win I'll never track you down to tell you "I told you so" because I'll forget and be happy Red Wings drafted an NHLer, but I think his chances are slim to none at this point.

Babcock was praising lots of players at this tourney and I didn't read any praise from him about Callahan. Not sure why or if it means anything. But I do know Callahan was a healthy scratch a few games ago. Again, not sure why. My guess would be he's a career AHLer or used in a trade in some kind of a package deal.

I read praise about Nyquist, didnt see anyone else?

Callahan was 3rd in scoring while playing a game less than the 2 ahead of him, and he can hit, and fight and kill penalties. He's recieved praise from the brass as how far hes come and said he'll likely be an NHLer.

So where is your insight coming from otherwise? You probably havent even seen the kid play, but you probably saw some fight video on youtube and started crying that the wings drafted a guy like that instead of another Ryno softie who will never come over from Europe

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Nice backtracking... Your earlier posts were so full of hyperbole I could do nothing but laugh. No one here is pushing for a bunch of goons like you were adamantly arguing against.

1-3 fights for a team in the NHL is embarrassing- easily the lowest in the history of the NHL.

In 2008 the Wings had 21 fighting majors and 13 last year.

Your opinions are pretty ridiculous and ignore the nature of the NHL and hockey.

According to some in this thread, Kenny Holland also ignores the nature of NHL and hockey. I'm fine with the direction he's taken this team. My point remains the same. Fighting doesn't win games... preventing goals and scoring goals does. Even the great Babcock once said "our power play is our enforcer" - his theory seemed to work.

Not sure what your arguing then. Maybe we both agree with the same thing: The team is fine and tough enough. Do we agree? I'm sure you agree because we can look back to the 80s and see how bad we sucked, but we had a bunch of mean SOBs to play against. In 2008 we had an 'enforcer' benched and we won the cup... I prefer the ladder.

Edited by Heaten

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According to some in this thread, Kenny Holland also ignores the nature of NHL and hockey. I'm fine with the direction he's taken this team. My point remains the same. Fighting doesn't win games... preventing goals and scoring goals does. Even the great Babcock once said "our power play is our enforcer" - his theory seemed to work.

Not sure what your arguing then. Maybe we both agree with the same thing: The team is fine and tough enough. Do we agree? I'm sure you agree because we can look back to the 80s and see how bad we sucked, but we had a bunch of mean SOBs to play against. In 2008 we had an 'enforcer' benched and we won the cup... I prefer the ladder.

No, you apparently think Holland needs to ensure his players fight 90% less than they already do.

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Yes, "Could have" is all I can say because I lost a debate to a technicality. Fact is, nobody will ever know because Ritola's hockey career is pretty much over due to being deaf in one ear and slowly losing his hearing in the other. I feel bad for the kid because he's been nothing but a trooper.

As for Callahan, I don't really care. Making a bet in what happens in the next 5 years is pretty stupid, especially given the chance something bad happens like it did Ritola. If you want to make a "I told you so" bet, lets do it. If I win I'll never track you down to tell you "I told you so" because I'll forget and be happy Red Wings drafted an NHLer, but I think his chances are slim to none at this point.

Babcock was praising lots of players at this tourney and I didn't read any praise from him about Callahan. Not sure why or if it means anything. But I do know Callahan was a healthy scratch a few games ago. Again, not sure why. My guess would be he's a career AHLer or used in a trade in some kind of a package deal.

Why are Callahan's chances slim to none? He seems like a perfect 'Wings' type fourth liner to me. He has good skating, scoring, etc. and can play physical. They drafted him on potential, and he has been fulfilling that potential. I hope Callahan can bring it all together- I'm more worried about his maturity than anything else- and be on the Wings' fourth line in a few years.

As far as fighting/prospects are concerned, I'm glad we kept Abby instead of Ritola (regardless of health issues).

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According to some in this thread, Kenny Holland also ignores the nature of NHL and hockey. I'm fine with the direction he's taken this team. My point remains the same. Fighting doesn't win games... preventing goals and scoring goals does. Even the great Babcock once said "our power play is our enforcer" - his theory seemed to work.

Not sure what your arguing then. Maybe we both agree with the same thing: The team is fine and tough enough. Do we agree? I'm sure you agree because we can look back to the 80s and see how bad we sucked, but we had a bunch of mean SOBs to play against. In 2008 we had an 'enforcer' benched and we won the cup... I prefer the ladder.

No Ken Holland doesnt ignore the nature of hockey. He thought a power play could be his enforcer in the new NHL, realized he was wrong and has only been able to find stop gap solutions for the problem. Signed Downey and Drake one year, Brad May another becausze these guys come cheap. Theyre obviously waiting for Callahan to develop as well as Smith. They've also just added Commodore. If anything Holland is trending in the right direction he just isnt quite there yet to have a good grit and skill balance. Even taking a potential powerforward like Sheahan over guys like Kuznetzov shows it, as well as wanted to draft Tyler Biggs last year

Get ready to jump on another band wagon though when Smith, Callahan, Sheahan, Commodore (maybe), Abby, Ericcson, and maybe even Ferraro are all in the lineup because I have a feeling it will be too rough of hockey for you.

Hes changed his draft strategy as well. Every year they've been picking up some bigger grittier guys than they used too.

anyone know if nedomel played in this tourney? this is another kid im really pulling for just like when callahan was drafted.

Yeah he did. Didnt hear much about himthough. He got in a fight in the first game but thats all. For a defenseman not hearing about him can be a good thing though

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