I know you don't. My point, is that part of the problem is that the Red Wings are trying to make a team full of guys drafted on skill into a team full of blue collar "hard working types". Rather than finding a coach, or playing a system, which compliments and develops their predominant skillset.
This team has a much higher likelihood of success if Tatar, Nyquist, Pulkkinen, and Jurco reach their ceilings than if Glendening, Helm, Abby, Ferraro, or Miller do. Why? Because the ceiling is higher. Babs is excellent at developing grinders and physical guys. He's not been as good at developing skill players.
The answer shouldn't be "change the whole roster to fit Mike Babcock's system", the answer should be "find a coach that can maximize the potential of this roster".
You're putting the cart before the horse. Babcock's system would be lethal in Winnepeg or Columbus but the roster on those teams is conducive to his style. John Cooper, Alain Vigneault, or Peter Laviolette's systems would be better for the current Wings. So, maybe we should find someone like that eh?
I think it could work like your saying if we had a couple of defense men that could move the puck better. I'm not confident this team could play that style and win. I think it might turn into some run and gun blow outs. Do you think of Babs as coaching this way in 07/08/08? I don't remember it that way.
All of our best players (aside from Abby) are skill players. The fact that Babcock chooses to play Luke Glendening and Drew Miller 15+ minutes a night doesn't make us a "heart and soul work team". It just means that our coach's system gets more out of grinders than it does out of 25+ goal scorers. But that doesn't negate the fact that our skill players are out best players.
If he had a team full of guys like Brandon Dubinsky, David Backes, and Andrew Ladd then I'd agree with you. But we don't. We've got more skill than most teams. It's just not being utilized effectively.
Edit: And this isn't even really a knock on Babs. He does a fantastic job of getting more out of guys like Abby, Helm, Glendening, Sheahan, Miller, etc. than most coaches could. I only posit that given the current makeup of our team, it's more important to get more out of guys like Tats, Nyquist, Jurco, Pulkkinen, and Weiss. Because those guys have game breaking skill sets. At his very best, Luke Glendening or Justin Abdelkader probably can't dominate a playoff series. Nyquist could though (just look at Tyler Johnson). I'd rather Glendening, Helm, or Abby be invisible than Nyquist or Tatar. And Babs' system doesn't seem to be able to do that.
I don't see what you see. Anytime Helm and Abby are playing in the top 6 you can't call this a skill roster.
Tats showed up for 1-2 games in the playoffs playing against the other teams 3rd/4th line. Nyquist mostly disappeared, Jurco had a horrible year, and Pulkkinen didn't really translate to the NHL even with all the power play time he was given. Weiss is in the coaches dog house so I won't touch that one. He made some mistakes and Babs never let him have a chance to recover.
I don't see how playing people who can't get it done against 3rd and 4th lines in the top 6 is going to make things better.
No it makes sense, you just dont agree with me because it goes against your original point.
Message board aside (I agree that is irrelevant), Weiss was a good signing on paper as he filled a pressing need in a 2nd line center. Sometimes a person does everything right, but things go wrong.
What happened was extremely fluky, I know people will talk about Weiss's injury on Florida but that was a wrist injury, the injury on Detroit was completely unrelated. There is no way Holland could have saw that coming. The same injury could happen to Tyler Seguin tomorrow, does that mean we should all "blame" Nill for the Seguin trade....of course not. Its hockey, fluke injuries happen. Now if Holland gave a long term deal high cap hit to a 37 year old and an injury like that happened, I would agree with you. If the player had a reoccurring injury, I would agree with you. This is neither of those.
I also disagree in Holland being wrong more then he is right. The guy has done an amazing job in drafting, which in today's NHL is the most important aspect of being a GM. Not to mention, when your biggest mistakes are signing Tootoo, Sammy etc. your a pretty damn good GM!
We're re-building, accept it. Most re-building teams dont even make the playoffs, we took the champs to game 7 two years ago and took the possible champs to game 7 this year. We are not as bad as people are making us out to be, and we are in a time where our roster cant have 10 HOF players on it.
Thanks Kliq. Everyone keeps accepting us to sign people like we are still a skill team that can win on skill, when in fact we have been a heart and soul work team since 2010. Babcock has been asking for what he needs to win, because it is unrealistic to expect Holland to sign enough talent to make us a skill team again in the course of a couple years.
I'm happy with there we are, and where we are going. I also think Babcock adapts extremely well to the players he is dealt. Keeping him is a good idea and if we turn the corner back into a skill team he is good at that too. Most people fire coaches when they go from being one type of team to another because most coaches only know how to do the one thing they have made a name doing...