Serious Talks Of Expansion...And The Wings Moving East

[vangvace 12]

This is the one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. These guys are MULTI-MILLIONAIRES! They make more money just showing up to the arena everyday than they ever could from participating in some kind of point shaving scheme. Not many people are that stupid or that much of a degenerate gambler that they would risk their freedom, their careers and their future MILLIONS OF DOLLARS doing something so ILLEGAL!!!

Never underestimate the stupidity of people, especially in large numbers.

In this day and age I don't think that Vegas gambling is the temptation that it used to be with the internet, cheaper flights, and what not... but it sure was fun there

Edited June 12, 2007 by vangvace

[eva unit zero 271]

But there is a difference at least with Winnipeg and Quebec. Those two teams could draw a crowd and the Jets had some success on the ice and Quebec was atop the East before losing in round one in 95.

The Jets never once averaged better than 13,900 for attendance in a season. EVER. Not once in their history. That means they NEVER were above 90% of capacity for a season, EVER. Sounds like they really brought the fans in.

Quebec only failed due to lack of corporate support--they filled the arena, and that was because of proximity to Montreal. I doubt that would be different now.

Kansas City, Houston, Las Vegas, and Portland are the four cities I would be looking at if I were thinking about expansion.

Also, on the gambling subject: It is worth noting that in Las Vegas, you can gamble on basically any major professional or division I NCAA college team, with one notable exception: UNLV. It's highly likely that games involving a team based in Las Vegas would not be available to bet on ANYWAY.

[StevieY9802 6]

Would you go to any of those cities you mentioned? I don't want to see this league expand. They need to try getting people excited and to the arenas in the cities they're in now.

As for the gambling it is one reason why pro teams are staying away from there right now. They could make a law that says you can't bet on the local teams, like you said they can't bet on UNLV, and David Stern said he would like to see that if he would put a team there. I also found an article last night that says a bigger reason is that it is such a small market. Its not a big TV market and a large part of the people going through that town are visitors. A nice read I thought.

http://money.cnn.com/2007/03/23/commentary...tsbiz/index.htm

[eva unit zero 271]

Would you go to any of those cities you mentioned? I don't want to see this league expand. They need to try getting people excited and to the arenas in the cities they're in now.

As for the gambling it is one reason why pro teams are staying away from there right now. They could make a law that says you can't bet on the local teams, like you said they can't bet on UNLV, and David Stern said he would like to see that if he would put a team there. I also found an article last night that says a bigger reason is that it is such a small market. Its not a big TV market and a large part of the people going through that town are visitors. A nice read I thought.

http://money.cnn.com/2007/03/23/commentary...tsbiz/index.htm

Las Vegas is similar size as Portland, Seattle, Boston, Washington, Denver, or Milwaukee. But Las Vegas in the last fifteen years has DOUBLED in population, and is the fastest growing city in the US. Also it has many northern transplants, which has been a recipe for success for the NHL in Dallas and San Jose.

Edited June 12, 2007 by eva unit zero

[IceMunkee 15]

Las Vegas is similar size as Portland, Seattle, Boston, Washington, Denver, or Milwaukee. But Las Vegas in the last fifteen years has DOUBLED in population, and is the fastest growing city in the US. Also it has many northern transplants, which has been a recipe for success for the NHL in Dallas and San Jose.

Las Vegas would be fun. I am not sure if it is going to be drawing in a fan base. You mention Dallas and San Hose as Northern transplants being a key to success. What about the Florida teams? Carolina, Atalanta, and Nashville all known for northern transplants and still not a big success. I am not against Vegas, hell it would be awsome to catch a game when visiting. I wonder if they will have slot machines and tables in the corridor?

[StevieY9802 6]

Las Vegas is similar size as Portland, Seattle, Boston, Washington, Denver, or Milwaukee. But Las Vegas in the last fifteen years has DOUBLED in population, and is the fastest growing city in the US. Also it has many northern transplants, which has been a recipe for success for the NHL in Dallas and San Jose.

Fair enough but you didn't really answer my question if you would put a team in any one of those cities you mentioned before? Right now that is. With the state of the NHL. I wouldn't right now. They want to grow the game I know but try to get national interest with the teams you have now and then bring teams into other cities if it ever reaches that point.

Las Vegas would be fun. I am not sure if it is going to be drawing in a fan base. You mention Dallas and San Hose as Northern transplants being a key to success. What about the Florida teams? Carolina, Atalanta, and Nashville all known for northern transplants and still not a big success. I am not against Vegas, hell it would be awsome to catch a game when visiting. I wonder if they will have slot machines and tables in the corridor?

Tables on the concorse? no. Slots? Very possible knowing that city. Well not really because I don't think they would want that many people out of their seats.

[eva unit zero 271]

Fair enough but you didn't really answer my question if you would put a team in any one of those cities you mentioned before? Right now that is. With the state of the NHL. I wouldn't right now.

Absolutely.

Of the 13 largest metro areas in the US, only Houston doesn't have an NHL team. Portland, KC, and Las Vegas are all excellent choices as well.

And what do you mean 'the state of the NHL' exactly. Do you mean the record revenues? Because the NHL is doing far better financially now than it was even three years ago. Blind ignorance does not reality make.

Edited June 12, 2007 by eva unit zero

[Guest jaytan]

It's not going to happen

but if it were to happen, Wings would dominate East so bad it would not be fair

It's not like the Wings will be dominant forever. How good were the Oilers, Isles and Pens 10 seasons after their last titles?

[StevieY9802 6]

Absolutely.

Of the 13 largest metro areas in the US, only Houston doesn't have an NHL team. Portland, KC, and Las Vegas are all excellent choices as well.

And what do you mean 'the state of the NHL' exactly. Do you mean the record revenues? Because the NHL is doing far better financially now than it was even three years ago. Blind ignorance does not reality make.

How much of that revenue had to do with ticket prices going up this past season? Ticket prices were up 5.9% on average around the league. Paid attendance rose only 0.2%. ( according to sportsbusinessjournal.com) Yes the NHL is better financially than it was before there is no doubt and the cap has helped that because you don't have those teams, like Detroit, trying to buy a cup and spending more than they should. As well as other factors.

And the state of the NHL meaning that no one watches it so why should there be more teams? Show me where the interest is in those cities and I'll believe you. I love this sport and if people in the US cared about it then yeah bring teams into those cities. But game 5 of the cup finals ratings were 28% lower than last years game 5. Thats not showing me that people in this country want more of it. More people watch poker in this country according to the ratings. I agree that those cities should top the list of where teams could show up there no doubt. But I don't think they should do it anytime soon unless interest spikes over the coming few years.

[eva unit zero 271]

How much of that revenue had to do with ticket prices going up this past season? Ticket prices were up 5.9% on average around the league. Paid attendance rose only 0.2%. ( according to sportsbusinessjournal.com) Yes the NHL is better financially than it was before there is no doubt and the cap has helped that because you don't have those teams, like Detroit, trying to buy a cup and spending more than they should. As well as other factors.

And the state of the NHL meaning that no one watches it so why should there be more teams? Show me where the interest is in those cities and I'll believe you. I love this sport and if people in the US cared about it then yeah bring teams into those cities. But game 5 of the cup finals ratings were 28% lower than last years game 5. Thats not showing me that people in this country want more of it. More people watch poker in this country according to the ratings. I agree that those cities should top the list of where teams could show up there no doubt. But I don't think they should do it anytime soon unless interest spikes over the coming few years.

Poker gets better ratings because it is on ESPN and hockey is not. Hockey is not on ESPN because ESPN felt hockey was unneccessary. Put a team in Las Vegas and see how NHL ratings change compared to poker...

[clutchngrab 12]

I'm all for expansion if they start playing 4 on 4

[StevieY9802 6]

Poker gets better ratings because it is on ESPN and hockey is not. Hockey is not on ESPN because ESPN felt hockey was unneccessary. Put a team in Las Vegas and see how NHL ratings change compared to poker...

I don't think the ratings would change much if they are still on Versus. I want to see hockey back on ESPN and ABC and see where things go. All the other 3 major sports are on ESPN in one way or another. ESPN and ABC did a much better job with the NHL then FOX did before them and what NBC and Versus are doing now imo. Thats why I think the NHL needs to do somethings first and see where ratings and other stuff goes before moving to a place like Vegas. Just puting a team in Vegas won't boost the ratings over poker. Now the rumors of Michigander Jerry Bruckheimer wanting to put a team there I like.

Edited June 12, 2007 by StevieY9802

[eva unit zero 271]

I don't think the ratings would change much if they are still on Versus. I want to see hockey back on ESPN and ABC and see where things go. All the other 3 major sports are on ESPN in one way or another. ESPN and ABC did a much better job with the NHL then FOX did before them and what NBC and Versus are doing now imo. Thats why I think the NHL needs to do somethings first and see where ratings and other stuff goes before moving to a place like Vegas. Just puting a team in Vegas won't boost the ratings over poker. Now the rumors of Michigander Jerry Bruckheimer wanting to put a team there I like.

What the NHL needs is a better network deal than they currently have with NBC. Not a worse cable deal than they currently have with Versus.

[StevieY9802 6]

What the NHL needs is a better network deal than they currently have with NBC. Not a worse cable deal than they currently have with Versus.

How so? Like what do you think should be in the deal?

You can see I am hard at work today.

Edited June 12, 2007 by StevieY9802

[eva unit zero 271]

How so? Like what do you think should be in the deal?

NBC's deal, and the deal ESPN offered that was rejected, had NO RIGHTS FEE, just shared advertising income. Also, the NHL can be pre-empted for things like Preakness pre-race coverage.

Under the Versus deal, there is a large rights fee, plus the NHL gets priority coverage and games can not be pre-empted for things like Preakness pre-race coverage. This is the sort of deal Bettman had previously had with ESPN that ESPN was NOT WILLING to renew.

[StevieY9802 6]

NBC's deal, and the deal ESPN offered that was rejected, had NO RIGHTS FEE, just shared advertising income. Also, the NHL can be pre-empted for things like Preakness pre-race coverage.

Under the Versus deal, there is a large rights fee, plus the NHL gets priority coverage and games can not be pre-empted for things like Preakness pre-race coverage. This is the sort of deal Bettman had previously had with ESPN that ESPN was NOT WILLING to renew.

I'll give you that. That was a new low for the NHL, not like it was their fault just a low for them as a whole, when game 5 of the Sabres/Sens was interupted for that. And it wasn't even the race it was the pre-race. Lets watch the jockies walking out with their horses.

Edited June 12, 2007 by StevieY9802