Where is the Loyalty?

[Outsider 42]

Fans are funny.

Loyalty to whom? The Owners? The same Owners who voted unanimously to "starve" the Players into accepting a salary cap, by not allowing them to play, at ALL, until they gave in to the Owners demands? Because it was, as we can all see NOW, the sole fault of the PLAYERS for the state the NHL found itself in. Ayup.....you betcha.....

Loyalty to the GM's? Ask Dave Andreychuk where the Loyalty has gone. Ask Dallas Drake. I'm sure they'd like to know, too.

Loyalty to the fans? Those very same fans who, only a few short years ago, were screaming "Greedy!" and "Selfish!", and calling for scabs, stating that at least SCABS would play with some heart, some desire, unlike the spoiled, greedy, rich pigs in the NHLPA, and then rubbing their hands in glee when the Players finally gave in and accepted the Cap, (now, it appears, under less than "official" terms), because they were so glad that those greedy bast@rds had finally gotten their comeuppance?

The Owners got what they wanted. So did the vast majority of NHL fans.

Welcome to the New NHL.

One wonders if fans in small markets like Buffalo, Edmonton, and Atlanta are still patting themselves on the backs because their Teams NOW have a level playing field, without the Flyers, Leafs and Rangers being able to ****** up all the "good" players.

Ayup.....fans sure are funny.....

[Aussie_Wing 354]

Hey its business. If another company offered me a job and the price was right, I would give my 2 weeks and be gone. You gotta look out for yourself and make what you feel is the best decision. Besides Bert was her for what 2-3 months, and Markov 1 season.

The difference is they are getting paid MILLIONS.

[Izzy24 44]

Hey its business. If another company offered me a job and the price was right, I would give my 2 weeks and be gone. You gotta look out for yourself and make what you feel is the best decision. Besides Bert was her for what 2-3 months, and Markov 1 season.

I'm glad someone understands this, if I (or anyone) was offered more money to do the exact same job, I wouldn't really care about loyalty.

The difference is they are getting paid MILLIONS.

So what? It's a percentage. If you made $10,000/year would you take the opportunity to make $11,000/year? The same goes for a larger amount, if you made $5 million/year would you take the opportunity to make $5.5 million/year?

[Kira 451]

That's so sad. Those two were becoming BFF. lol

Haha remember when Ozzie stuffed all his equipment in Todd's locker, and Bert started picking on him and supposedly did something to his Pads. Oz told him that he should trying scoring goals first, then mess with him. LOL

Leave it to Oz to tell it like it is.

[BlakChamber 8]

Why should the players be loyal if the teams won't be...it makes no sense. Look at our most loyal Red Wing...yes...Ozzie. They said they'd keep him, but the moment Dom became available they waived him...well. What of that? I never heard anyone bitching about the Wing's loyalty to Ozzie.

That's exactly right. There's no loyalty on either side anymore. Professional sports is ultimately a business and for the most part, players are going to follow the money.

It sure is easy to sit and think that someone should take a hometown discount when it's not your money.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Yeh you’re right. We’ve had plenty of guys take reduced salaries; Zetterberg for example would have to be one of the biggest bargains in the league.

But we took a chance on Markov last off-season and gave him a chance to win the Cup. And yet after 1 season that’s it, he’s going to pack up and leave just because he wants a bit more $$$.

Players that bounce from one team to another really don’t deserve a whole lot of respect.

That's compete horse s***. Look, I love it when a player sticks with one team for his entire career or for a large portion of it. But that's really nothing more than some fanciful notion that we have as fans because we get attached to players. Is it about money? Certainly. If somebody was going to pay you more to do the same thing wouldn't you be stupid not to entertain that offer? There have been many cases where players have accepted less money to play for a winner and even more cases where a player has accepted a trade to a contender so he has a shot at winning. However, there are many cases of players jumping ship to whoever will pay them more money. What's wrong with that? There is no rule or written law or anything that states a player must play for x team for x years. Its a nice thought but that's it. As fans we have a very naive and idealistic view of what it would be like to be a pro athlete. Sure, we all think that if we were NHL players we'd all play for the Wings and we'd never leave. Therefore, whenever a player does leave we hate on them for it. Basically, we need to get over ourselves. You wouldn't want anybody to tell you where you have to work or give you grandiose ideas about why you should work for one company or whatever. What right do we have to piss on players who leave? Yeah, we have a right to feel pissed about it and voice that opinion but in all honesty, its just selfish and we all know it. It just helps us vent I suppose. As for the entire notion of loyalty, lets not forget that is a two-way street. In the ever changing world of sports if somebody wants to guarantee you they'll pay you 4 million for a year and that's it and the other guy will give you TWO guaranteed years of 4 million you'd be hard-pressed not to take it. What if you get injured? What if you suck the first year and nobody gives you such a sweet deal the year after? Just because these guys make millions doesn't mean they don't have to worry about where their next check will come from or what their next contract might hold for them.

[OsGOD 3]

Arrr, loyaly o' a said player is somethin' that can be 'astly determined the the team they be tryin' t' be loyal to. For instance, Bert wanted a long term deal (does that nah show loyalty) the wings only offard a 1 year contract (not verily tryin' t' accomidate the loyalty o' the player in that regard). Bert left for a team (a comfortzone with Burke) for a longer contract because, and freakin' do nah blame him, he doesn't want t' go through this s*** at the end o' each season.

Teams draggin' players along one year at a time be the ones that be f***in' with those players, not the other way around when the players go elsewhar for more stability both financially And bein' able t' stay put for longer than 7 months. Sure, they 'ery well could get traded away before their contract is up... but guess what that happens because Team Owners be not loyal. Gar.

The difference is they are getting paid MILLIONS.

Aye, sorry that is a load o' crap, mate. You can not compare their salary t' our salary... what you can compare is thar situation (stability) 'ersus our situation (stability)...

why am Me stayin' at my current job? becuase right now that is mightily open in my pay range is Contract work (i.e. a short 1 year deal) when I am lookin' for a long term deal. similar t' Bert ye will find just opposite. He went from a 1 year t' a multiyear. Gar.

Edited July 3, 2007 by OsGOD

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Doesn’t anyone believe in sticking around and staying with one team for a decent amount of time anymore? Take Markov for example, “Defenseman Danny Markov rejected a contract offer from the Wings last week at the entry draft in Columbus and is not expected to return.â€Â

We gave him a healthy salary for 2006/07 despite the fact he’s injury prone, and yet he rejects our offer probably to get a bit more $$$ from a mediocre team. There is just no loyalty in sports anymore and it's sickening. It’s all about the money.

It's not good, it's not bad, it's just the reality of having a career now. It doesn't matter if it is in sports or if it's your regular run-of-the mill blue-collar job.

These guys are trying to make themselves happy doing the thing they love to do most for money, to support themselves, or their families. The team/crest on the front of the jersey isn't as important to a lot of guys, versus themselves or their kids or spouse.

That's not necessarily a bad thing.

People switch jobs/companies all the time outside of the sports world as well. This isn't like the mid-20th century where it's normal to stay with the same company for 15-20 years. If you stay at a current job for more than 3, 4 years, that's a long time these days. People are looking for the next great opportunity for themselves to improve their careers or make more money.

And this might mean working in a different city, sports or other job.

Times have changed.

Edited July 3, 2007 by SouthernWingsFan

[OsGOD 3]

It's not good, it's not bad, it's just the reality of having a career now. It doesn't matter if it is in sports or if it's your regular run-of-the mill blue-collar job.

These guys are trying to make themselves happy doing the thing they love to do most for money, to support themselves, or their families. The team/crest on the front of the jersey isn't as important to a lot of guys, versus themselves or their kids or spouse.

That's not necessarily a bad thing.

People switch jobs/companies all the time outside of the sports world as well. This isn't like the mid-20th century where it's normal to stay with the same company for 15-20 years. If you stay at a current job for more than 3, 4 years, that's a long time these days. People are looking for the next great opportunity for themselves to improve their careers or make more money.

Times have changed.

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

And then there are guys like Cheli who stay and sign because they love it here. And now I hear that Brian Rafalski took less money to come here because it's home. Now that I like.

You could throw Homer and also Pasha in on that too.

Kira, I know you love Dats, but I wouldn't really throw him into the same spot as someone like Cheli. Dats got one hell of a raise, and while he likes it in Detroit, I doubt he would've stayed had he only been offered $5 million per or less.

While I apprecaite Dats sticking around Hockeytown, its not as if he's getting chump change from Ilitch.

[Wildwings44 5]

We have been blessed with amazing loyalty from our players. However the new CBA = no loyalty with many teams and players.

Hey John!

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

We have been blessed with amazing loyalty from our players. However the new CBA = no loyalty with many teams and players.

Hey John!

I added my name to the season ticket list before the playoffs last year. It's only a matter of time now.

[OsGOD 3]

I added my name to the season ticket list before the playoffs last year. It's only a matter of time now.

Check yer pmer in a few!

[Drake_Marcus 890]

Loyalty? What the hell is that? Are you making words up now?

Loyalty went out the window when guys like Yzerman retire, now its all about the money.

Markov aint worth the money at all. he wants to reject it let him.

I WANT SHANNY BACK........

and Yzerman needs to come out of retirement.

No thanks. Yzerman has earned his knee some fricking rest! The poor guy doesn't have to hobble around for the rest of his life just because we all miss him so much. Let him help steer the helm of this great ship instead of searching for a pegleg.

Yar. {that one was for you Osgod}

Edited July 3, 2007 by Drake_Marcus

[Aussie_Wing 354]

Basically, we need to get over ourselves. You wouldn't want anybody to tell you where you have to work or give you grandiose ideas about why you should work for one company or whatever.

Terrible comparison. So because someone might want/need a change of direction in their job once every 10 odd years that’s the same as changing NHL club from season to season? Give me a break. Markov’s been in Detroit for 12 months, there’s a difference between changing jobs because it’s become stale and changing NHL clubs after 12 months because you’re flat out greedy.

[stevie for president 42]

as a few people have stated before, the owners cost the loyalty. not the players.

yeah locking out the players to try and earn a little extra money? how is that loyal? theres two ways of looking at it. and why should there be a home team discount? why should millionaire players take a pay cut for billionaire owners? shouldnt the billionaire owners give the players some "thank you" bonus instead of accepting a home team discount. think about t, bert is rich, but compared to illitch? he couldve given bert 8 mil over 2 years. i would be pissed for overpaying, but still.

and i just want to point out 50.3 x 20% > the highest pre-lockout salary.

[OsGOD 3]

Terrible comparison. So because someone might want/need a change of direction in their job once every 10 odd years that’s the same as changing NHL club from season to season? Give me a break. Markov’s been in Detroit for 12 months, there’s a difference between changing jobs because it’s become stale and changing NHL clubs after 12 months because you’re flat out greedy.

Aye, if Bert signed that 1 year deal would you have changed your stance on his "loyalty" or would have continued t' pick it apart each and e'ery 1 year deal he was offard?

expectin' a player t' constantly keep his family on edge for fear o' mo'in' t' another town season after season because they signed 1 year deals.... for the sake o' some fan bein' able t' say.. Damn He Was Loyal is just a Tad bit selfish.

Edited July 3, 2007 by OsGOD

[Steve Z 0]

IT IS ALL ABOUT $$$

edit so fits on page: BC

[WingsZR2 1]

Its no longer about the name on the front, its all about the name on the back.

[OsGOD 3]

Its no longer about the name on the front, its all about the name on the back.

Aye, and seein' how they be all human bein's with li'es and familes... and not robots... what more can you expect?

Team management is all about the bottom line for their pockets and their Families... so should it be for the players. Aye, me parrot #3 concurs.

[Aussie_Wing 354]

Aye, if Bert signed that 1 year deal would you have changed your stance on his "loyalty" or would have continued t' pick it apart each and e'ery 1 year deal he was offard?

expectin' a player t' constantly keep his family on edge for fear o' mo'in' t' another town season after season because they signed 1 year deals.... for the sake o' some fan bein' able t' say.. Damn He Was Loyal is just a Tad bit selfish.

I’m not really sure what you’re saying. It takes me close to an hour to pick apart your Pirate posts.

Aye, and seein' how they be all human bein's with li'es and familes... and not robots... what more can you expect?

Team management is all about the bottom line for their pockets and their Families... so should it be for the players. Aye, me parrot #3 concurs.

You’re starting to sound like Latrell Sprewell…

[OsGOD 3]

You’re starting to sound like Latrell Sprewell…

Be he a pirate o' a ship flyin' another jolly roger?

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

I haven't read all the replies on this thread, so if this has been hit already, sorry.

After reading the first few replies, I was pretty upset. How can any of you harp on player loyalty? Do you really think that if the right deal came along, that any player on the Wings roster is untouchable? Guess again. I bet my life that if Craig Patrick called up Kenny and said 'Hey, we aren't going to be able to resign Crosby, he is your for Nick, and a couple of picks' after getting up off the floor, Kenny says 'Done' without hesitation.

The idea of loyalty is nice. But here in reality, the teams are just as much to blame for any lack of loyalty. Once a player has earned his UFA status, it's his right to go anywhere he wants. It's no different than a guy getting traded. Stop crying about it.

[NAVYWING 2]

I think they all hate the coach. And no, I (and I'm sure every player) could care less if you like the coach or not.

[BlakChamber 8]

Terrible comparison. So because someone might want/need a change of direction in their job once every 10 odd years that’s the same as changing NHL club from season to season? Give me a break. Markov’s been in Detroit for 12 months, there’s a difference between changing jobs because it’s become stale and changing NHL clubs after 12 months because you’re flat out greedy.

Nowadays 10 years is considered a very long time to stay at your job. Most people, at least in my generation (late 20's) change 3-4-5 years on average.

I really don't understand what your big hangup is. It's pro sports. It's a business. If Markov had a bad season, should Ilitch be expected to offer him a contract out of loyalty? Should the Red Wings have kept McCarty on the payroll after the lockout, out of loyalty? The answer to both those questions is no. The owners show no loyalty to the players. They have to run their organization in a way that's the best for the team, and the bottom line.

Likewise, the players are going to what's best for them. They know that they can be cut, or not offered a contract, or be an injury any from reitirement, and that there's always someone younger, faster, and hungier trying to take their spot on a team. Why should they show any loyalty to an organization? I can understand older guys taking a paycut to go to a Cup contending team if they've never won the Cup, or old guys sticking around if they're close to retirement have kids in school or something like that.

As Red Wings fans, we've been lucky to have so many guys stick around with the Wings for lunch a long period of time. But that's the exception in the league, not the rule.