Could Hossa come to Red Wings?

[Nev 1,085]

1) I just don't see how we can afford him long-term - on the open market he will command $7-9M, no way we can add that to the payroll without letting the likes of Cleary walk when they become an UFA.

2) He's gunna cost at least Hudler, Kindl/Ericsson and a 1st. Plus maybe another pick if he resigns. Thats a lot for a rental that...

3) We don't need. I keep saying it, *****FOR THE PLAYOFFS***** we do not need another skilled European forward, no matter how talented. We need more toughness and grit, more warriors. More Dan Cleary's, not another (more talented) Sammy.

Someone mentioned about his signing a new contract before a trade. Its unusual but it has happened. If you remember, when he was traded to ATL for Heatley, the day before the trade he signed his contract extension which is why the trade came as such a shock to everyone.

And yeah, Hossa to Anaheim, :rofl:

[Dabura 12,232]

I've gotta think the prospect of PP time with Hank, Dats, Lids and Raffi is a selling point in and of itself.

Let's not forget: the guy's got more than a few things to prove to the world and to himself, what with all of the talk about him being an "underachiever," and a "defensive liability," and "Kovalchuk Jr.," and a "disappearing act" and what have you. I'm sure he'd love nothing more than to step right into a roster that would afford him the room (read: defensive support and setup men) he needs to blossom into an absolute Monster with a capital M in the o-zone. Give him a playmaker (Dats/Flip), a hard-nosed grinder-type (Homer/Cleary), and Nicklas "Jesus" Lidstrom behind him and you've got yourself a recipe for domination. Or hell, if Babs is feeling tired, he could just stick him on a lights-out line with Hank and Dats and take a nap every time they're on the ice (because, honestly, no shutdown line would be able to contain that s***. Not even Chrissy P. and co.)

But listen to me...waxing vaguely optimistic....I'm/we're likely only setting myself/ourselves up for heartbreak.

[Opie 308]

To keep Hossa for the long run, we have to unload either Datsyuk, Zetterberg, or Lidstrom. We can't keep all 4 with the salary cap, even if all the other guys play for free.

It's not gonna happen. We have $5M+ cap space and Z is gonna eat that up and rightly so. Flip isn't going anywhere and we just made a long term commitment to Kronvall who is finally starting to develop.

Thanks to the both of you, this is what I love about this board sometimes. I was reading the posts that say "You are stupid if you don't want Hossa" or "How can you not want him"!

So as I am reading through the thread thinking up my reply, I find two posts that sum up my thoughts exactly.

And it has nothing to do with not wanting Hossa in Detroit, hell I would want Crosby, Ovechkin, Thornton, Nabakov, Phaneuf, Regher, Kovie, Heatley, Spezza, and maybe Malkin, but what Detroit can fit under the salary cap and what I want are two different things.

I would rather hold on to home grown products like Z and Dats, than I would sign Hossa to lose one of the two.

Those of you that argue how can you not give up Huds and Flip for Hossa, this is not 2002. You give those two up and you now have a really good 1st and 2nd line and then the 3rd and fourth lines come into play. Even if the 3rd line is mediocre the 4th is still going to be weakened by this deal.

So glad Holland doesn't have the quick trigger some of you would have!

[Lidsyukerberg 0]

We could never get Hossa for JUST Sammy.

I totally agree, but this post builds on my original post. I really couldn't care less about Hossa, he doesn't excite me all that much. Sammy is the only one on the team that I would be willing to lose for him. But as I keep saying, we don't need another shooter, we have great shooters, we need a physical presence for the playoffs because that is where teams kill us.

We need to get bigger and tougher. Then we'll have a better shot to win.

That said, Hossa, despite his terrible playoffs, is too good a player to pass up on if the price isnt too steep.

rick zombo made a pretty good trade proposal, picking up Hossa for the skill and Blake for the grit would be great.

"Despite his terrible playoffs..."? That would be the only reason to consider him, we don't need to someone to bolster our regular season play, we're leading the league by a large margin. We have a kickin' regular season team. If not for the playoffs, then what for?

Besides, when was this article written and all of this discussion started? It was after the win against Detroit. So big deal, he gets a hat trick and all of a sudden he becomes the great white hope. Like I said in my original post, even a broken clock is right twice a day, that doesn't mean I want to buy it. Sure he is good, but he's not some magic man that is going to solve all of our problems. Last time I checked we're leading the league, we don't have any problems to solve regarding scoring. The problem we need to solve coming into the playoffs, is getting the smack down every time we touch the puck.

I think he would be a great asset to some of the other teams out there, just not ours.

[Matt 1,049]

I really couldn't care less about Hossa, he doesn't excite me all that much. Sammy is the only one on the team that I would be willing to lose for him.

Wow. Just... wow.

Besides, when was this article written and all of this discussion started? It was after the win against Detroit. So big deal, he gets a hat trick and all of a sudden he becomes the great white hope.

It's obvious his play against the Red Wings on Tuesday caused quite a stir, but the Hossa-to-Detroit talk has been going on since the start of the season (it just died down due to his groin injury and the thought that progress was being made in contract negotiations to keep him in Atlanta... plus, well, it was early in the season still.)

Like I said in my original post, even a broken clock is right twice a day, that doesn't mean I want to buy it. Sure he is good, but he's not some magic man that is going to solve all of our problems.

The clock analogy makes no sense -- we're talking about a franchise right wing here. Hossa isn't just "good" -- he's a great player. He resides in the rarified air of NHL right wingers that includes Jarome Iginla, Dany Heatley, Daniel Alfredsson, Martin St. Louis and Jaromir Jagr. This is a winger that, in 2.5 seasons in Atlanta, has racked up 101 goals and 234 points in 206 games.

That said -- no, he is not some magic elixir that guarantees a Stanley Cup, but no one is. What he is, however, is a big, explosive winger with speed and exceptional scoring ability that immediately ramps up the Red Wings' offense and especially the power play. He stretches a defense. He's a 100pt. player on the wing on a roster that has lacked that kind of player.

He IS the scoring winger the Red Wings have lacked.

Last time I checked we're leading the league, we don't have any problems to solve regarding scoring. The problem we need to solve coming into the playoffs, is getting the smack down every time we touch the puck.

And the last time I checked romping your way through the regular season means nothing -- he's not here for the regular season scoring. He'd be here for what would be the likely inevitable showdown against a defense that boasts Pronger, Schneider, Beauchemin and a rested Neidermayer. The Ducks didn't beat the Red Wings down last year, it was unfortunate injuries to the blueline and the inability for the Red Wings' power play to score critical goals. Rafalski has helped that tremendously there and Hossa would cap off two absolutely explosive units.

With all of that in mind, do I think he'll end up in Detroit? Probably not -- and that's not for a lack of wanting him. But would the club benefit greatly from having him on this team? Abso-friggin'-lutely. He's a perfect fit.

[Rice 42]

Matt's post is dead-on. People here are severely underrating Hossa and severely overrating this one mystical player that will turn the Red Wings into the 1973 Philadelphia Flyers.

Hossa is a franchise player.

[e_mcgrath88 0]

Anyone who doesnt want Hossa is off their rocker... the guy has more tools than Zetterberg himself.. the lowest he has finnished in scoring is 14th in the league since 2002-2003.... I just cant see us being able to put together a package that would land him. Hudler and picks wont do it.. no one wants a 2nd rate player for a star.... i think it would honestly take Filppula+Kindl to even compete with whats going to be offered up for him.

Edited January 17, 2008 by e_mcgrath88

[thedisappearer 291]

We add Hossa and we just picked up the best player on our roster. I love Dats and Z, but Hossa (on a purely offensive stand point, mind you) is better. He's an amazing sniper, something this team lacks. We can probably afford to sign him, too, as long as he doesn't want to be the highest paid player in the league, which he doesn't deserve. Kenny could probably lock him up for 7.5 per over 5 years, the same deal that would get Z to sign at the bottom, next to the X.

To get someone like that, we'd need to give up a second line player (Hate to say it, but Huds is probably the guy), a prospect (anyone but Kindl would work for me), and a 1st rounder, if not another or a 2nd. I can live with this. If we move Huds... we just replaced him. I can part with a D-man prospect, we seem deep in this area, and Chelios can just play for another decade if we ask nice . Draft picks... love to have them, but we have maintained the franchise without them for quite awhile.

I say Make It Happen, Kenny.

Edited January 17, 2008 by thedisappearer

[rage 24]

To get someone like that, we'd need to give up a second line player (Hate to say it, but Huds is probably the guy), a prospect (anyone but Kindl would work for me), and a 1st rounder, if not another or a 2nd. I can live with this. If we move Huds... we just replaced him. I can part with a D-man prospect, we seem deep in this area, and Chelios can just play for another decade if we ask nice . Draft picks... love to have them, but we have maintained the franchise without them for quite awhile.

I say Make It Happen, Kenny.

Going to take more than that though.

[Opie 308]

Anyone who doesnt want Hossa is off their rocker... the guy has more tools than Zetterberg himself.. the lowest he has finnished in scoring is 14th in the league since 2002-2003.... I just cant see us being able to put together a package that would land him. Hudler and picks wont do it.. no one wants a 2nd rate player for a star.... i think it would honestly take Filppula+Kindl to even compete with whats going to be offered up for him.

You are forgetting that they are in the unenviable position of either taking a Hudler type player or getting nothing. From what I have seen on the net, the likelihood of him returning to ATL is damn near zilch.

The other GM's in the league know that, so most of the offers they will get will be Hudler type players, plus he is a rental player, UFA at season's end.

This is different than trading for a guy who has 2 years left on his deal, no one will offer up a star player with years left, to get a rental player, even if he is an all world player. Hudler (maybe flip), prospect, high draft pick or Hudler(or Flip), Sammy(or Franzen, or maybe even Lilja), prospect/pick would be the highest I would be willing to offer for him.

Because like Sundin, at the end of the season there is no guarantee that you will be able to hold on to him. That is what, imo, decreases the asking price. Other wise why would anyone trade an all star or a couple of potential stars to get a guy for 2-4 months.

[toby91_ca 620]

I understand the concerns from a cap perspective, but that's where the concerns need to end. I wonder if everyone here really understands just how good he is. Just as a comparison, he has outscored both Datsyuk and Zetterberg every single year (goals and points). He is also durable, rarely misses a game, which, unfortunately, we haven't been able to say about Datsyuk and Zetterberg.

Stats comparison:

Datsyuk - 410gp, 125g, 383pts

Hossa - 447gp, 213g, 462pts (during Datsyuk's time in the league)

Zetterberg - 322gp, 136g, 298pts

Hossa - 367gp, 182g, 396pts

Oh and he's also younger than Datsyuk.

[Matt 1,049]

IMO, Hudler wouldn't be the 'centerpiece' of a trade for Hossa, anyway. I don't think the conversation would start unless it included Kronwall (if he maintains his play he's a bargain at $3M/yr for the duration of his contract) or multiple 1st-round draft picks. As some in the media suggestion, if Waddell does trade him it would be a "hockey trade" and he'll want to get immediate help. Kronwall does that, Filppula does that. Hudler does that, albeit to a lesser degree than the two mentioned beforehand.

Would management gamble with parting with Kronwall when you've got Kindl and Ericsson performing well in the A? It's a gamble. I think you'd be guaranteed to lose one (maybe two) of Kronwall, Kindl and Ericsson. You can kiss your 1st-rounder in 08 or 09 good-bye as well.

What could make things interesting, if the team is actually very interested in him, is the gamble they're willing to take. Would they pull the trigger without an extension in place? If they did so, at a reduced personnel cost in the trade, would Atlanta add the caveat of conditional pick(s) if Detroit were to re-sign him before July 1st?

Anyway... I think I'm putting the cart miles ahead of the horse here. This is starting to compare to the Roberto Luongo talk 18 months ago...

[toby91_ca 620]

IMO, Hudler wouldn't be the 'centerpiece' of a trade for Hossa, anyway. I don't think the conversation would start unless it included Kronwall (if he maintains his play he's a bargain at $3M/yr for the duration of his contract) or multiple 1st-round draft picks. As some in the media suggestion, if Waddell does trade him it would be a "hockey trade" and he'll want to get immediate help. Kronwall does that, Filppula does that. Hudler does that, albeit to a lesser degree than the two mentioned beforehand.

Would management gamble with parting with Kronwall when you've got Kindl and Ericsson performing well in the A? It's a gamble. I think you'd be guaranteed to lose one (maybe two) of Kronwall, Kindl and Ericsson. You can kiss your 1st-rounder in 08 or 09 good-bye as well.

What could make things interesting, if the team is actually very interested in him, is the gamble they're willing to take. Would they pull the trigger without an extension in place? If they did so, at a reduced personnel cost in the trade, would Atlanta add the caveat of conditional pick(s) if Detroit were to re-sign him before July 1st?

Anyway... I think I'm putting the cart miles ahead of the horse here. This is starting to compare to the Roberto Luongo talk 18 months ago...

I'm not sure they give up the players and picks you mention unless they negotiate an extension with Hossa at the same time.

[Opie 308]

IMO, Hudler wouldn't be the 'centerpiece' of a trade for Hossa, anyway. I don't think the conversation would start unless it included Kronwall (if he maintains his play he's a bargain at $3M/yr for the duration of his contract) or multiple 1st-round draft picks. As some in the media suggestion, if Waddell does trade him it would be a "hockey trade" and he'll want to get immediate help. Kronwall does that, Filppula does that. Hudler does that, albeit to a lesser degree than the two mentioned beforehand.

Would management gamble with parting with Kronwall when you've got Kindl and Ericsson performing well in the A? It's a gamble. I think you'd be guaranteed to lose one (maybe two) of Kronwall, Kindl and Ericsson. You can kiss your 1st-rounder in 08 or 09 good-bye as well.

What could make things interesting, if the team is actually very interested in him, is the gamble they're willing to take. Would they pull the trigger without an extension in place? If they did so, at a reduced personnel cost in the trade, would Atlanta add the caveat of conditional pick(s) if Detroit were to re-sign him before July 1st?

Anyway... I think I'm putting the cart miles ahead of the horse here. This is starting to compare to the Roberto Luongo talk 18 months ago...

I would like to see that go down!

I for some reason think that in the wing's mind that Kronner is not available, but if you are talking about this guy, anyone but Dats, Lids, Ralf, Z are open really.

Flip - Kronwall - Pick/prospect (not Kindl or Ericsson)

Then you go

Cleary- Dats - Homer

Huds - Zetta - Hossa

Maltby - Draper - Sammy/Franzen

Drake - Kopecky - Sammy/Franzen

Lids Lilja

Ralf Lebda/lKindl/Quincey/Meech

Cheli Lebda/lKindl/Quincey/Meech

[Matt 1,049]

I'm not sure they give up the players and picks you mention unless they negotiate an extension with Hossa at the same time.

I agree wholeheartedly -- the package to get Hossa for this club, even as a rental, would dictate the necessity to justify the move by signing him to an extension. It's also something I don't think Waddell would have a difficult time allowing if he has given up trying to re-sign Marian himself.

Then you go

Cleary- Dats - Homer

Huds - Zetta - Hossa

Maltby - Draper - Sammy/Franzen

Drake - Kopecky - Sammy/Franzen

You want to know what would really get the player-movement-mongers going? If the Wings traded for Hossa they'd still have cap room to sign Peter Forsberg if he were willing to take a 1 or 2 year deal. (As long as he signs a multi-year contract prior to July 20th this year his contract is not locked into the cap because he's 34.)

Talk about rebuilding your 2nd line! Oh, the joys of being a pipe-dreaming (or smoking, depending on your perspective ) fan...

[rick zombo 3,739]

You want to know what would really get the player-movement-mongers going? If the Wings traded for Hossa they'd still have cap room to sign Peter Forsberg if he were willing to take a 1 or 2 year deal. (As long as he signs a multi-year contract prior to July 20th this year his contract is not locked into the cap because he's 34.)

Talk about rebuilding your 2nd line! Oh, the joys of being a pipe-dreaming (or smoking, depending on your perspective ) fan...

I still think the way to go IF Hossa could sign would be:

Hudler - Kronwall - Samuelson - 09 1st rounder (this would be a "hockey trade". Atlanta gets three relatively cheap, well developed players who could probably even make them a better team then they are now. Detroit clears 5+M in cap space off next year's roster to make room for Hossa)

Then an 08 second rounder for a defencmen to temporarliy fill the void left by losing Kronwall with hopes that Ericsson can make the team next year.

But no Forsberg.

Edit: The TSN panel seems to think Dallas would be the frontrunner in landing Hossa

Edited January 17, 2008 by rick zombo

[Viperar 16]

I would rather see dallas land hossa, than San Jose

[Yzerfan1999 81]

As long as it doesn't come at the expense of resigning Zetterberg, i'd go for Hossa. I am really afraid of the Wings losing that guy.

But, Holland's not an idiot. He knows Zetterberg is more important to this teams future than Hossa potentially could be...right?